Why Lukas went downhill

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I'm not saying a horse will come back better than ever if they had a serious injury. I'm saying that they will often times come back better than ever if you turn them out before a problem gets serious.

If you look at many of the good trainers, their win percentage is just as high with a horse coming off a 6 month layoff as with a horse that just ran a month ago. I don't have Pletcher's stats in front of me for horses coming back from a 6 months to a 1 year layoff, but I know his win percenatge for horses that haven't run for somewhere between 45 days and 6 months is 26%.

If you think that Lukas taught any of those guys how to trainn, you are crazy. He only hired guys that were great horsemen.

Oh come on now Rup, thats an anti Lukas bias showing.
Those guys sure feel like he taught them something. They all use the white bridle as a tribute to their old boss, and none of them bash him.
I just don't buy that they were already good enough to go on their own and simply became paid slaves because they wanted the challenge.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Oh come on now Rup, thats an anti Lukas bias showing.
Those guys sure feel like he taught them something. They all use the white bridle as a tribute to their old boss, and none of them bash him.
I just don't buy that they were already good enough to go on their own and simply became paid slaves because they wanted the challenge.

None of those guys train anything like Lukas. If he was so good, you would think they would have a similar style. When they interviewed McLauglin about his days with Lukas, the only thing he said with regards to what he learned from Lukas was that "He teaches you how to get owners and stuff like that."

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I'm not saying a horse will come back better than ever if they had a serious injury. I'm saying that they will often times come back better than ever if you turn them out before a problem gets serious.

If you look at many of the good trainers, their win percentage is just as high with a horse coming off a 6 month layoff as with a horse that just ran a month ago. I don't have Pletcher's stats in front of me for horses coming back from a 6 months to a 1 year layoff, but I know his win percenatge for horses that haven't run for somewhere between 45 days and 6 months is 26%.

If you think that Lukas taught any of those guys how to trainn, you are crazy. He only hired guys that were great horsemen.

Flower Alley must have overslept during that barn meeting and never read the memo.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

Flower Alley must have overslept during that barn meeting and never read the memo.

Who knows what they did to FA to get that big effort out of him in the BC Classic. He had just gotten beat by 15 lengths. If you have a horse with an injury and inject them to get one more race out of them, there is a good chance that they will not come back 100%. That is always the risk if you try to get one or two moe races out of a horse that is showing the beginning of a minor injury.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Who knows what they did to FA to get that big effort out of him in the BC Classic. He had just gotten beat by 15 lengths. If you have a horse with an injury and inject them to get one more race out of them, there is a good chance that they will not come back 100%. That is always the risk if you try to get one or two moe races out of a horse that is showing the beginning of a minor injury.

He only got beat by 15 lengths prior to the BC because of Pletcher's poor use of a rabbit & Chantel Sutherland.

[Rupert Pupkin]

[quote=oracle80]This is true. Heck even horses who have small chips removed rarely if ever come back to what they were before the chip.
Tendons? Well maybe if you give em 2-3 years they can be ok. Fractures? Well sometimes it works with the screws but most of the time it doesn't.
I still find it hysterical that the guy won yet another championship last year and that at his age people hold him up to scrutiny as if he were a spring chicken.

Take a guy like James Jerkens. His normal win percentage is 17%. His win percenatge for horses coming off 45-180 day layoffs is 23%. I guess you guys are right. You shouldn't give a horse time off if they have a slight problem. The time off won't do any good.

[quote=Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by oracle80

This is true. Heck even horses who have small chips removed rarely if ever come back to what they were before the chip.
Tendons? Well maybe if you give em 2-3 years they can be ok. Fractures? Well sometimes it works with the screws but most of the time it doesn't.
I still find it hysterical that the guy won yet another championship last year and that at his age people hold him up to scrutiny as if he were a spring chicken.

Take a guy like James Jerkens. His normal win percentage is 17%. His win percenatge for horses coming off 45-180 day layoffs is 23%. I guess you guys are right. You shouldn't give a horse time off if they have a slight problem. The time off won't do any good.

I never said that Rupert. Obviously horses need time off when they have a minor problem so it doesn't become major, and obviously D Wayne could have done a better job with giving horses time off. I think thats obvious.
Noone is disputing that. But you name a trainer and I can name weaknesses that he or she has, just like you are with D Wayne.

[Rupert Pupkin]

[quote=oracle80]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I never said that Rupert. Obviously horses need time off when they have a minor problem so it doesn't become major, and obviously D Wayne could have done a better job with giving horses time off. I think thats obvious.
Noone is disputing that. But you name a trainer and I can name weaknesses that he or she has, just like you are with D Wayne.

To call it a weakness is the understatement of the year. He won't turn a horse out unless they are so lame that they can hardly walk. He breaks down so many horses that many of the big insurance companies will not insure his horses. I think that says it all. In addition, his win percenatage is 9%. If you think he's a good trainer, you can recommend that some of your owners give their next horse to him.

[Rupert Pupkin]

[quote=Dixie Porter]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Not ONLY can you not read, but you haven't got the slightest idea how to train a horse to get the most $ out of him. As far as your lame per cenatages on Allen's kid, it's to dumb for me to comment on.

BTW I have zero interest in DWL one way or the other.

You never have anything to say. You make a lot of snide comments but you you never post anything of any substance.

I have no idea if you're a smart guy or not. If you are a smart guy, nobody here will ever know it if you don't explain yourself. You say stuff like, "You don't know how to train a horse to get the most out of him."

That's not telling us anything. That's not giving us any information. If you don't think I know how to train to get the most out of a horse, then tell us what part of my thinking is wrong and tell us what the proper way to get the most out of a horse is.

You obviously had no explanation as to why Jerkens win percentage is higher when he gives his horses a break, so you simply called my percentages "lame".

If you think that anyone is going to be impressd with your knowledge by making snide remarks you are mistaken. If you really do have some knowledge, then post it. I'd be happy to hear what you have to say. Nobody is going to learn anything from your comments like "Your percentages are lame" or "You don't know how to get the most out of a horse".

[blackthroatedwind]

[quote=Dixie Porter]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

If you feel my opinions are weak read all my posts and get back to me. Most of the trolls have given up after 3 years. Kinda like "The Myth of Sisyphus" (Sp)

Oh yer a myth alright....a mythomaniac.

[Cajungator26]

[quote=Dixie Porter]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I'm not on here to give lessons. You want to learn it's $1500 an hour.

Personally I like hangin out with Mike, Steve and Brooklynite. Takes me back to my yoot.

If you feel my opinions are weak read all my posts and get back to me. Most of the trolls have given up after 3 years. Kinda like "The Myth of Sisyphus" (Sp)

Don't you charge by the minute? (Couldn't resist.)

[Rupert Pupkin]

[quote=Dixie Porter]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I'm not on here to give lessons. You want to learn it's $1500 an hour.

Personally I like hangin out with Mike, Steve and Brooklynite. Takes me back to my yoot.

If you feel my opinions are weak read all my posts and get back to me. Most of the trolls have given up after 3 years. Kinda like "The Myth of Sisyphus" (Sp)

You don't sound very intelligent when you knock a person't post if you don't explain yourself. It's pointless.

There is nothing wrong with knocking a post but there is a prpoer way to do it. If you're going to disagree with a person, you should way, "I think you are wrong. Here is why." And then you explain why they are wrong. You're not adding anything to a discussion by saying "that's stupid" or "you're wrong" or that type of thing if you don't explain yourself. You need to tell a person why their comment was stupid or why it was wrong. Otherwise, your comments are empty and are a waste of our time.

[Assttodixie]

[quote=Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Dixie Porter

You don't sound very intelligent when you knock a person't post if you don't explain yourself. It's pointless.

There is nothing wrong with knocking a post but there is a prpoer way to do it. If you're going to disagree with a person, you should way, "I think you are wrong. Here is why." And then you explain why they are wrong. You're not adding anything to a discussion by saying "that's stupid" or "you're wrong" or that type of thing if you don't explain yourself. You need to tell a person why their comment was stupid or why it was wrong. Otherwise, your comments are empty and are a waste of our time.

Waste of time? Waste of time? Do you realize to whom you are referring? You dont talk to the boss that way! No one talks to the boss that way!!!

Do you realize that my boss Dixie trained under Chuck Norris after he beat chuck in a round of poker?

Do you realize that my boss Dixie has forgotten more about horses than you will ever know? He learned from the great BA jones.

Now apologize before i let dixie go and he gives you an 80 year old karate chop on the side of your head.

[Rupert Pupkin]

[quote=Dixie Porter]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Not ONLY can you not read, but you haven't got the slightest idea how to train a horse to get the most $ out of him. As far as your lame per cenatages on Allen's kid, it's to dumb for me to comment on.

BTW I have zero interest in DWL one way or the other.

You obviously are not a very good reader either. I never said that horses who sustain serious injuries will usually come back 100%. I said that if you stop on a horse before a problem gets too serious that they will often times come back 100%.