3 year old filly Eclipse?

[VOL JACK]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Clearly Zaftig deserves the Eclipse.

She beat Indian Blessing. Indian Blessing beat Proud Spell. Proud Spell beat Music Note.

Clearly Zaftig is better than all of them.

End of debate.

Damn it!!! You stole all my thunder.

Originally Posted by Betsy

Let me be clear that I am not knocking PS in any way...nor Indian Blessing. I just don't think IB has a resume that stacks up to PS or MN. In a weaker year, yes. As somone pointed out earlier, IB will very likely get the Eclipse for female sprinter. Also, I really don't see why PS is such a lead pipe cinch unless MN wins the Distaff, but I suppose it doesn't really matter. I have no clue as to how MN will handle the synthetic, but I suspect she won't handle it well at all. That will settle the question.

Indian Blessing is already a champion, and can now rate, something she could not do earlier in the year, i think shes as good if not better then Music Note and Proud Spell, and if they faced today things could be different, especially with her clear pace advantage

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

no doubt if zaftig was right its a lock....imo

[hockey2315]

Originally Posted by hrfan

Indian Blessing is already a champion, and can now rate, something she could not do earlier in the year, i think shes as good if not better then Music Note and Proud Spell, and if they faced today things could be different, especially with her clear pace advantage

she's a very good sprinter but would have very little chance against those two right now going long. . .

[Indian Charlie]

It's just a fun thing to speculate on, for most people, I'm going to guess.

If you really think about it, most things people seem to care about really don't matter much, if at all.

As for liking a sire, in my case, with Indian Charlie, I was fanatic about that horse when he broke his maiden. Along with Rahy and Cee's Tizzy, two of my other favorites when they ran, I couldn't see how they wouldn't be successful stallions when they retired and I really enjoyed watching their progeny run.

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I'm still trying to figure out why it matters to people who gets the eclipse. This is a good debate, don't get me wrong. But the eclipse is voted on by a panel of racing "journalists", whatever that means nowadays. I suppose it's the fairest way, but take a look at the voting from last year.

http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/nat...rd-voting.aspx

Now, I have no objection to any of the winners. But, can someone tell me who voted for Court Vision and Kodiak Kowboy as 2 year old male? Or Cry and Catch me as 2 year old filly? Or Lava Man and Student Council as older male? Or Take D'Tour as older female? I could go on and on. I understand wanting to win the award, I'm sure it's nice to put in the trophy case. I just don't get why it would be important to someone with no connection to the horse. But, I also don't get why people fixate on a sire, so maybe it's me.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by hockey2315

she's a very good sprinter but would have very little chance against those two right now going long. . .

i don't know whether indian blessing could beat them or not, but i don't think that is how you're supposed to vote anyway-based on who would win a race. i think it's supposed to go to the most dominate horse in their division from spring til fall. indian blessing certainly fits the bill, and now has taken on older horses with success.
look back at azeri for example-there was no dominant male all year, but i'd imagine most would say street cry would have beaten her head to head. but he didn't dominate all year, and she did.

[hockey2315]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i don't know whether indian blessing could beat them or not, but i don't think that is how you're supposed to vote anyway-based on who would win a race. i think it's supposed to go to the most dominate horse in their division from spring til fall. indian blessing certainly fits the bill, and now has taken on older horses with success.
look back at azeri for example-there was no dominant male all year, but i'd imagine most would say street cry would have beaten her head to head. but he didn't dominate all year, and she did.

I don't disagree with anything you're saying. . . I was responding to PG's claim that Indian Blessing could beat the other two going longer now that she can rate.

[Betsy]

this thread has taken an unfortunate turn. Thanks for your responses, but I am sorry I even asked the question.

[hockey2315]

Originally Posted by Betsy

this thread has taken an unfortunate turn. Thanks for your responses, but I am sorry I even asked the question.

Really? What's so bad about it? Seems more civil than most threads on here to me. . .

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by hockey2315

Really? What's so bad about it? Seems more civil than most threads on here to me. . .

Seriously. I thought this has been one of the more healthy and civil debates on here recently. What turn has it taken Betsy?

[hockey2315]

Probably because Andy called her out on the A.P. Indy thing. . .

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by hockey2315

I don't disagree with anything you're saying. . . I was responding to PG's claim that Indian Blessing could beat the other two going longer now that she can rate.

ok, gotcha.

[zippyneedsawin]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Since PS doesn't seem to like synthetic, I'm going out on a limb here and say she's going to be hard pressed to beat Zenyatta in the distaff. That almost rules her out for the Eclipse.

Music Note, while not as good a resume this year, is helped by PS losing today. She's an unknown on synthetic, but AP Indy seems to do okay on the fake stuff. Still, will she beat Zenyatta?

Indian Blessing looked just okay in winning over the synthetic, but at least she did win. I don't see any Zenyatta caliber horses in either sprint race, so who knows.

I get what you're saying, but, again, I don't think another loss from PS rules her out of the eclipse if both Music Note and Indian Blessing lose in the BC as well.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I actually didn't have you in mind when I mentioned the sire thing. I was thinking more of the guy who was hung up on Golden Missile. And the guy who spends his nights looking for progeny of Giant's Causeway.

Of course I realized that, but offered up that it's probably something similar for PG as well.

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

She won the Silverbulletday, a Grade 3, at Fair Grounds. The Davona Dale is run at Gulfstream.

Indian Blessing has won two Grade 1's,.....

The Prioress is a totally bogus G1, and the Test is questionable, too. And, yes, classic-distance animals will ALWAYS have the advantage over sprinters because that is the what being a Thoroughbred is all about - having the speed AND the stamina to keep going to win at a distance of ground in the best races. Pure sprinters, however talented, are lacking an important element in their makeup.

[CSC]

The Eclispe will probably be decided at the Breeders Cup, alot of the fillies mentioned here all have good points to be chosen, if ever the concept of the BC was a good one it is for this division, I certainly couldn't decide right now.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by Pedigree Ann

The Prioress is a totally bogus G1, and the Test is questionable, too. And, yes, classic-distance animals will ALWAYS have the advantage over sprinters because that is the what being a Thoroughbred is all about - having the speed AND the stamina to keep going to win at a distance of ground in the best races. Pure sprinters, however talented, are lacking an important element in their makeup.

The Test is a very important race. 7 furlongs is basically the one distance where routers and sprinters are in neutral territory. If you look at the last 30 Test winners, route fillies have won their fair share (Go For Wand, Versailles Treaty, Society Selection, November Snow, Lady's Secret, etc.). Its also produced 2 BC Sprint winners in Very Subtle and Safely Kept, as well as the dam of at least one BC Sprint winner (Blitey, who produced Dancing Spree who was also a Grade 1 winner at 10f). This latter factoid brings up another interesting characteristic of the Test, its produced several outstanding broodmares in its history.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by CSC

The Eclispe will probably be decided at the Breeders Cup, alot of the fillies mentioned here all have good points to be chosen, if ever the concept of the BC was a good one it is for this division, I certainly couldn't decide right now.

in most years, you would be correct, the bcd would decide. but this year of course will be different, and some of the fillies and mares at the top of their division may not even run. and if they do run, but falter on an unfamiliar surface......ought to be interesting.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Indian Blessing's only losses this year are to Proud Spell and Zaftig, and she beat the former once. If she wins the BC F&M Sprint and neither Music Note nor Proud Spell win the Distaff, why shouldn't she be considered?

I for one think Indian Blessing is the best 3yo filly out there. And I think she'll get it if the circumstance above happens!

[pgiaco]

Sounds like Proud Spell is done for the year, at least according to Blood Horse.