Met Steve Crist yesterday

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Looks like a duck,walks like a duck,and probably is a duck.Hey ,if horseplayers are dumb enough to pay these parasites,then they deserve what they get. We got a huge difference of agreement on these guys. I consider them PRO PARASITES(one and all.)Obviously, many others don't mind blowing money each day on product to pay these guys. These guys are not new.There will always be guys trying to make money off of cappers.They are the Carlton Sheets of the horseracing world.Like him,they claim to make $$ from doing something,but in actuality they make money by selling books,tapes,and articles on "how to" do something.If they were so great at doing this "something,"then they would just get paid from doing that.They make money off of other handicappers.Do you dispute this?

Probably the most offbase comment that I can recall seeing from someone that is a regular. Should they just print the form as a charity? Of course they make money on selling their information. I never hear them tout their products in a "Carlton Sheets" manner promising to make you rich. Also I don't recall them claiming to be making money from handicapping.

Question for you, how do you go about handicapping without purchasing information from some source? I don't think you can just wing it or have the time to collect your own data. Are all data services therefore parasites?

[sumitas]

thanks kasept...Crist makes some good points.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Scuds..

Just don't have the time right now to answer this in full.. But will hopefully get to it after the show tonight. Maybe Andy (Serling) is around and will see it and respond...

My short answer is that Crist's body of work, and in fact entire career, belies that of someone looking to usurp the gullability of the get-rich-quick crowd.

SB

I don't have the time in life to respond to such nonsense. I would say that most people posting in this thread understand Steve's dedication and accomplishments in racing. In an industry where it often feels like it is " us " against " them ", and we have no say, at least Steve Crist is fighting the good fight for us as best he can. The truth is that Steve has been a positive voice in, and for, racing since he joined the NY Times in 1978 and racing, as well as racing fans, are far better off for having him.

How many people in this game can you say that about?

[Gander]

Crist may be a genius when it comes to his knowledge and writing of the sport, but lets also remember...hes one of us Scuds. This guy likes the juice more than anyone I have ever met, yes even Oracle!

Only difference is he makes his living through the industry. I dont see the big deal of paying $5 for a drf every time I want to bet. I mean spending $5 for a paper to kill time between races is a great thing in my opinion.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

I made a general statement about these pundits.To me,they are all parasites.That is the relationship here(host/parasite.....like it, or not.)So,the responses all come in to stick up for one particular pundit.Did I go out of my way to attack a particular pundit? No,the thread just so happens to be about one pundit.My aim is not to attack one person.I have no personal thing against this guy.If you want to make it a Scud versus Crist thing,then go ahead,but the issue is Scuds versus all parasite pundits (not a personal thing against one guy.)

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Like I said,most handicappers are indeed dumb enough to want to pay these parasites.This thread shows that.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I don't have the time in life to respond to such nonsense. I would say that most people posting in this thread understand Steve's dedication and accomplishments in racing. In an industry where it often feels like it is " us " against " them ", and we have no say, at least Steve Crist is fighting the good fight for us as best he can. The truth is that Steve has been a positive voice in, and for, racing since he joined the NY Times in 1978 and racing, as well as racing fans, are far better off for having him.

How many people in this game can you say that about?

You just did respond to it.If you look at the relationship,you will see it is a basic host/parasite relationship.

Scuds hes not a handicapper. hes a guy who has devoted his life to the business and is responsible for some great things that we have now. He loves the game, and he understands all angles of it.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Scuds hes not a handicapper. hes a guy who has devoted his life to the business and is responsible for some great things that we have now. He loves the game, and he understands all angles of it.

He makes bucks off of the handicapper.I didn't say he is an awful person(simply a common parasite.)It is not that complicated an issue.You have a host stupid enough to support a parasite.

[Gander]

Not sure what the alternative is to buying a drf?

I am too dumb to read sheets, and I like the articles that the drf has. I absolutely hate printing pages and pages of stuff off the computer. And $5 isnt much considering what I am willing to throw through the windows.

Not sure what the big deal is here, I happen to agree with you on a lot of these "pundits". Crists name just got thrown around on here and he just happens to be one guy I have talked to a number of times who is very nice.
Just my opinion though and I can repsect yours.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

You just did respond to it.If you look at the relationship,you will see it is a basic host/parasite relationship.

Let me, then, respond further.

Here is the definition of parasite...since, apparantly in your weak attempt to appear clever, you don't know it....



par·a·site ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pr-st)
n.
Biology. An organism that grows, feeds, and is sheltered on or in a different organism while contributing nothing to the survival of its host.

One who habitually takes advantage of the generosity of others without making any useful return.
One who lives off and flatters the rich; a sycophant.
A professional dinner guest, especially in ancient Greece.



Thus, for Steve Crist, you know....the subject of this thread, to be a parasite he would have to be feeding off racing fans while providing nothing in return. This is completely untrue, inaccurate, and grossly unfair. Steve's accomplishments for the betterment of racing fans are substantial and evident.

You, on the other hand, seem to be establishing a parasitic relationship with this board. Luckily, antibiotics are on the way.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Gander

Not sure what the alternative is to buying a drf?

I am too dumb to read sheets, and I like the articles that the drf has. I absolutely hate printing pages and pages of stuff off the computer. And $5 isnt much considering what I am willing to throw through the windows.

Not sure what the big deal is here, I happen to agree with you on a lot of these "pundits". Crists name just got thrown around on here and he just happens to be one guy I have talked to a number of times who is very nice.
Just my opinion though and I can repsect yours.

Last time I looked,you can pay a $1 to download past performances for a card.If you want to buy a whole drf ( and pay these parasites,)then so be it.

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

He makes bucks off of the handicapper.I didn't say he is an awful person(simply a common parasite.)It is not that complicated an issue.You have a host stupid enough to support a parasite.

Scuds--my question to you is this...what is wrong with Crist making money off of the bettor? I do not understand why that is so wrong. He makes a product and we buy it. It is no different from someone buying anything. I make money from young people, old people, people who do not have alot of money but understand the importance of maintaining your car. Heck, any of us can change oil. Just go to the local Wal Mart--gets 5 quarts and an oil filter. You can do that for less than $15. Heck, there are people who make fantasy football magazine and people buy them to get the information that they can get for free. It is a business, a transfer of money. I dont understand why it is wrong to sell something if you have found a market.

[Gander]

Maybe I am just completely nuts but one of the best things about horse racing to me is buying Saturday's drf on a Friday morning and sitting down with a hot cup of coffee and a few glazed donuts and getting to work.

Its the only newspaper I read, the only other sport I like more is baseball and for that I watch ESPN's baseball tonight and at least one game per night.

I dont see saving $4 buy not buying a drf is going to suddenly improve my life leaps and bounds. And I could give 2 ****-s who I make rich by buying it. It makes me happy and thats all I care about.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Let me, then, respond further.

Here is the definition of parasite...since, apparantly in your weak attempt to appear clever, you don't know it....



par·a·site ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pr-st)
n.
Biology. An organism that grows, feeds, and is sheltered on or in a different organism while contributing nothing to the survival of its host.

One who habitually takes advantage of the generosity of others without making any useful return.
One who lives off and flatters the rich; a sycophant.
A professional dinner guest, especially in ancient Greece.



Thus, for Steve Crist, you know....the subject of this thread, to be a parasite he would have to be feeding off racing fans while providing nothing in return. This is completely untrue, inaccurate, and grossly unfair. Steve's accomplishments for the betterment of racing fans are substantial and evident.

You, on the other hand, seem to be establishing a parasitic relationship with this board. Luckily, antibiotics are on the way.

All these guys(pundits) are making a living off of other handicappers.This is the fact that remains(after all the arguments are thrown around.)If they could make their living off capping,then they would be doing that(instead of getting checks from DRF etc.)

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

All these guys(pundits) are making a living off of other handicappers.This is the fact that remains(after all the arguments are thrown around.)If they could make their living off capping,then they would be doing that(instead of getting checks from DRF etc.)

I still dont understand your point. What is wroing with a supplemental income. They provide data and it is up to the purchaser of that data to make a decision.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

Scuds--my question to you is this...what is wrong with Crist making money off of the bettor? I do not understand why that is so wrong. He makes a product and we buy it. It is no different from someone buying anything. I make money from young people, old people, people who do not have alot of money but understand the importance of maintaining your car. Heck, any of us can change oil. Just go to the local Wal Mart--gets 5 quarts and an oil filter. You can do that for less than $15. Heck, there are people who make fantasy football magazine and people buy them to get the information that they can get for free. It is a business, a transfer of money. I dont understand why it is wrong to sell something if you have found a market.

They sell themselves as expert handicappers(but can't make a living off of handicapping...they can only make a living by being parasites that gorge on other handicappers.)Do they sell "just past performances" as you're walking out of the track,or are you forced to buy a whole DRF (IF YOU WANT PAST PERFORMANCES?)How many years have they forced people to buy a whole racing form(just to pay these parasites,)instead of just selling the necessary past performances?

[2MinsToPost]

yeah it costs $1 to download and then if you make one wager on that track it is returned, however, if you print it it costs how much in ink cartridges?

I agree with Tim, I get more enjoymment personally picking up the DRF the day before and pulling out my Zebra F-301 pen and getting to work. I made the mistake once of printing off a full card and moments later had to spend $15 for a new cartridge.

Originally Posted by 2MinsToPost

yeah it costs $1 to download and then if you make one wager on that track it is returned, however, if you print it it costs how much in ink cartridges?

I agree with Tim, I get more enjoymment personally picking up the DRF the day before and pulling out my Zebra F-301 pen and getting to work. I made the mistake once of printing off a full card and moments later had to spend $15 for a new cartridge.

The cost of printing out 4-5 tracks is WAY more than buying a DRF. I mean its an entire ink cartridge to do that. The DRF is cheaper to buy.

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

They sell themselves as expert handicappers(but can't make a living off of handicapping...they can only make a living by being parasites that gorge on other handicappers.)Do they sell "just past performances" as you're walking out of the track,or are you forced to buy a whole DRF (IF YOU WANT PAST PERFORMANCES?)How many years have they forced people to buy a whole racing form(just to pay these parasites,)instead of just selling the necessary past performances?

There is more to the DRF that past performances. There are articles, op-ed columns, stats on tracks, up-coming races etc etc. I dont think you buy the DRF for the "expert handicapping" you buy the DRF for the articles and past performances.