Rachel Alexandra's two-turn campaign

[Merlinsky]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Yeah, it's still raining here.

I needed something to occupy my mind .. you just can't sit around and dream of an 18-1 season all day.

I'm sure you'd like to not be bored, but I rather selfishly hope you're bored for awhile longer. These analysis are kinda fun to read. Great job.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

If Medaglia D' Oro was around right now ... the current handicap division would be in a world of trouble at any distance.

Since we all know horses just can't run as much as they used to, he'd only manage a start every 4-6 weeks...there are still plently of Grade 1s left for the other horseys!

[johnny pinwheel]

Originally Posted by CrossfireHurricane

Rachel is much like her daddy. An exceptional horse up to 9f but just like her daddy she is vulnerable at 10f.

I don't think Rachel would have finished ahead of Icon Project or CJ this weekend in the 10f Beldame and her connections know it. There really was no excuse to not run her this weekend. It is a dirt race. Fans want to see the best against the best and clearly Icon Project is the best 10f dirt animal in the country. Rachel's connections did racing no favors by ending her racing season before the best racing begins.

i kind of agree about the rachel part. her daddy was good at 10f. they seem to not want to run her 10f. after the preakness i can see why. shes a great horse no doubt. but shes not the icon some make her out to be. she was in trouble in the woodward and still won ,like a good horse should. my guess is that took alot out of her and she would not be ready this weekend. even if she runs again i don't think she will ever take on the boys at 10 f. and the way that horse looked at saratoga the girls would be no cinch either.

[robfla]

Originally Posted by johnny pinwheel

i kind of agree about the rachel part. her daddy was good at 10f. they seem to not want to run her 10f. after the preakness i can see why. shes a great horse no doubt. but shes not the icon some make her out to be. she was in trouble in the woodward and still won ,like a good horse should. my guess is that took alot out of her and she would not be ready this weekend. even if she runs again i don't think she will ever take on the boys at 10 f. and the way that horse looked at saratoga the girls would be no cinch either.

Thanks, I need a good laugh this morning

[TropicalStorm]

I am fairly new to speed figures but based on what I have seen it does not appear that she is anything more than your typical top 3yr old.

It looks like much of her reputation as a great horse had to do with beating bad fillies and overrated colts.

Can anyone provide solid facts and figures that show her to be something unusually fast?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by CrossfireHurricane

I am fairly new to speed figures but based on what I have seen it does not appear that she is anything more than your typical top 3yr old.

It looks like much of her reputation as a great horse had to do with beating bad fillies and overrated colts.

Can anyone provide solid facts and figures that show her to be something unusually fast?

let me get this straight. you know enough to call icon project great, but someone has to convince you that rachel is something special? i hope no one wastes their time, as you obviously have your mind made up, have an agenda, and wish only to be nonsensical and adversarial. have fun with that.

[TropicalStorm]

I never said Icon Project was great. I said I think she can be great. She has no distance limitations and I think she is capable of a 120 type beyer at 10f.

Now if you can't provide facts and figures showing how Rachel is any different than your Street Sense, Curlin, Big Brown types than how can you say she is great and they are not. Clearly they were very good horses but far from great.

[slotdirt]

Someone tell me the last time someone ran a 120 Beyer at 10f on this continent.

[slotdirt]

Hell, someone tell me the last time a filly of any age, shape, or form ran a 120 going any distance, let alone 10 panels.

Rachel Alexandra has five of the top 15 route Beyers run this year, for whatever that's worth, since we're talking Beyer Speed Figures and all.

[Gander]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Someone tell me the last time someone ran a 120 Beyer at 10f on this continent.

It could have only been: Ghostzipper, Candy Ride or Formal Gold.

[slotdirt]

Apparently, Lava Man got a 120 Beyer in the Hollywood Gold Cup back in 2005.

[TropicalStorm]

Nobody has done it since Ghostzapper. He was great. That is the point. Too many people throw the word great around and there has not been a great horse since him.


Icon Project looks to me like an animal that may flirt with that figure.

[TropicalStorm]

I thought the Lava Man figure was a 118 but either way I think people can argue he was great. His longevity must be factored in and he ran at a great level for a good time and he could run on anything.

I put Lavaman more in the Invasor and Saint Liam, just below the greats.

[slotdirt]

Lava Man had a SWEET record outside of Cali, so yeah, he sure could run on anything. Good call.

[TropicalStorm]

Attacking Lava Man for his record outside CA is sort of ridiculous. It is not like all his CA races were at 1 track.

Would you criticize a horse with great wins at Belmont, Saratoga, and Aqueduct but a few poor efforts at Churchill and Gulfstream?

Lava Man ran for a long time and ran a bunch of races and obviously he was a very good horse.

Great? No. But he won big races on a bunch of different surfaces. So yes he could run on anything. Show me all the grade 1 winners on dirt and turf.

[slotdirt]

Originally Posted by CrossfireHurricane

Attacking Lava Man for his record outside CA is sort of ridiculous. It is not like all his CA races were at 1 track.

Would you criticize a horse with great wins at Belmont, Saratoga, and Aqueduct but a few poor efforts at Churchill and Gulfstream?

Lava Man ran for a long time and ran a bunch of races and obviously he was a very good horse.

Great? No. But he won big races on a bunch of different surfaces. So yes he could run on anything. Show me all the grade 1 winners on dirt and turf.

Yes.

[TropicalStorm]

So a horse that can win the Man O War on the turf at Belmont, the Wood at Aqueduct, and the Whitney at Saratoga isn't worthy of praise because he ran poorly in the Clark and Donn?

Of course not. Lava Man was very versatile and perhaps he just did not like getting on planes.

[Linny]

There's a reason Sky Beauty is not in the Hall of Fame...

[slotdirt]

Originally Posted by CrossfireHurricane

So a horse that can win the Man O War on the turf at Belmont, the Wood at Aqueduct, and the Whitney at Saratoga isn't worthy of praise because he ran poorly in the Clark and Donn?

Of course not. Lava Man was very versatile and perhaps he just did not like getting on planes.

Yes, it was that fear of flying that made him run 11th in the Japan Cup Dirt and 16th in the Dubai Duty Free. At least he was consistently bad when he tried to leave California.

[slotdirt]

You know what is funny about this Lava Man sidebar? Rachel Alexandra has run on seven different tracks this year and won on all of them: Oaklawn, Churchill, Pimlico, Fair Grounds, Belmont, Monmouth, and Saratoga.