Black Caviar at Royal Ascot Saturday AM

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

This is interesting, because unfortunately, as you mentioned, Housebuster only ran twice at the 6f distance following his 3yo campaign (for the record, he won a little 6f stakes at 2 and the 6f Spectacular Bid at GP at 3)..

You say that Housebuster failed in his most important sprint test, I presume the '91 BC Sprint. Of course, Housebuster broke down in the race necessitating a leg brace and removal from the track via the horse ambulance. Perhaps we should let that race slide just this one time and turn our attention to the one 6f race he did compete in, namely the '91 Frank De Francis Dash.

Pitted against Housebuster, who had only won the Carter at that point, was1989 sprint champion Safely Kept 3 for 3 on the year. Also shipping in was Clever Trevor, reformed as a sprinter, and 2 for 2 on the year, both in stakes events. From the West Coast, the streaking Robyn Dancer, also 3 for 3 on the year setting a world record and fresh off an 8-length romp in the Triple Bend at Hollywood. D. Wayne Lukas had Sunny Blossom, the 6f track record holder at Santa Anita, entered of several placings in important sprints earlier in the year. The other entrant was Bravely Bold, who took down 4 stakes on the year. He ended up breaking down badly in the race.

Housebuster romped by 5, just shy of the 6f mark at Laurel. Safely Kept missed the break, but was spared having to battle torrid fractions set by Bravely Bold and Sunny Blossom.

Does this make him one of the all-time great sprinters? I guess it's debateable. But since you found cause to throw King Glorious's name in the ring, himself having just two 6f races to his credit (one a Grade 3 in June of his 2yo year, the other a Cal-bred $50k stakes with 3 horses in February of his 3yo year), I'm not so sure you should be campaigning with such fervor to strike Housebuster's name from the discussion.

I mentioned King Glorious was pretty damn fast. I didn't mention him with the best sprinters ever. My feeling is that he probably would have been one but his record doesn't support it. Neither does Housebuster's.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I mentioned King Glorious was pretty damn fast. I didn't mention him with the best sprinters ever. My feeling is that he probably would have been one but his record doesn't support it. Neither does Housebuster's.

One of the problems I'm having with your reasoning is that you seem to hold Housebuster to a special standard, while the other horses you mentioned get a free pass.

Housebuster's stakes record at 6f: 3 for 4
Lost In The Fog: 5 for 8
Artax: 2 for 7

There doesn't appear to be many committed 6f horses in the upper echelons of racing. At least not nowadays.

Recent Sprint Champions:

Amazombie: 3 for 5
Big Drama: 4 for 6
Kodiak Kowboy: 2 for 5
Benny The Bull: 6 for 11
Midnight Lute: 2 for 2
Speightstown: 3 for 5
Aldebaran: 0 for 1
Orientate: 3 for 3
Squirtle Squirt: 2 for 3
Kona Gold: 6 for 17
Lit de Justice: 3 for 4
Cherokee Run: 2 for 4

I guess if we use 6f as the true gold standard, then the debate is between Xtra Heat and Soviet Problem.

[Port Conway Lane]

Where would a horse who won 17 stakes, setting or equaling six track records and winning 35 of 76 starts in a nine-year campaign, earning $1,079,915 fit into the equation ?

[Calzone Lord]

Bold Ruler obviously was a great sprinter.

He was 13-12-1-0 lifetime in sprints. He failed miserably in his first several attempts routing, but ultimately developed to where he could carry his speed further.

A case could be made that this horse...



produced both the greatest male sprinter and greatest female sprinter of all-time.

Aspidistra is the dam of two-time champion male sprinter Dr. Fager and the dam of two-time champion female sprinter Ta Wee.

Dr. Fager was voted champion sprinter in 1967 and 1968. Ta Wee was voted champion sprinter over the males in 1969 and 1970. Between the two horses, Aspidistra was the dam of the champion sprinter four years in a row...she was also risked for a $4,500 claiming tag.

[Arletta]

Make it stop.

[Calzone Lord]

Sorry, I can't help with vaginal discharge

[Bigsmc]

Originally Posted by Arletta

Make it stop.

Make what stop?

This is some of the best racing discussion this board has seen in months.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

Bold Ruler obviously was a great sprinter.

He was 13-12-1-0 lifetime in sprints. He failed miserably in his first several attempts routing, but ultimately developed to where he could carry his speed further.

A case could be made that this horse...



produced both the greatest male sprinter and greatest female sprinter of all-time.

Aspidistra is the dam of two-time champion male sprinter Dr. Fager and the dam of two-time champion female sprinter Ta Wee.

Dr. Fager was voted champion sprinter in 1967 and 1968. Ta Wee was voted champion sprinter over the males in 1969 and 1970. Between the two horses, Aspidistra was the dam of the champion sprinter four years in a row...she was also risked for a $4,500 claiming tag.

Which leaves me with the burning question, was Aspidistra named after the radio transmitter or the houseplant?

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

Bold Ruler obviously was a great sprinter.

He was 13-12-1-0 lifetime in sprints. He failed miserably in his first several attempts routing, but ultimately developed to where he could carry his speed further.

A case could be made that this horse...



produced both the greatest male sprinter and greatest female sprinter of all-time.

Aspidistra is the dam of two-time champion male sprinter Dr. Fager and the dam of two-time champion female sprinter Ta Wee.

Dr. Fager was voted champion sprinter in 1967 and 1968. Ta Wee was voted champion sprinter over the males in 1969 and 1970. Between the two horses, Aspidistra was the dam of the champion sprinter four years in a row...she was also risked for a $4,500 claiming tag.

You know, looking back at some of the Eclipse Award winning sprinters in the 50s, 60s, and 70s, it sure didn't take much to win one.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

You know, looking back at some of the Eclipse Award winning sprinters in the 50s, 60s, and 70s, it sure didn't take much to win one.

The Vosburgh was pretty much all that was necessary.

It was such a great race before the BC when it was 7F and at Aqueduct. This is one of those examples when the good old days really were the good old days.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

The Vosburgh was pretty much all that was necessary.

It was such a great race before the BC when it was 7F and at Aqueduct. This is one of those examples when the good old days really were the good old days.

Yep, that is what it looked like. A lot of winners had little but a Vosburgh win. The Fall Highweight seemed an important race, and I guess big races around one turn at 1m carried some weight as well.