Kentucky's ongoing attempt to end racing in state proceeds..

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I think the logic of people who think we should use lasix is twisted. They race all over the world without lasix. How can you say that we need lasix here when they don't use it anywhere else? Do you think they should start using it in England, Dubai, and Hong Kong? Is our racing the model for the world? I don't think so. It's the exact opposite. We are the laughing stock of the world. To say we need lasix here, when it is not used anywhere else, is a losing argument.

By the way, there of plenty of trainers out there that will tell you lasix is a performance enhancing drug that does mask other drugs. In addition, it totally knocks horses out. Lasix completely dehydrates you. Do you think it a good idea to do any type of rigorous physical task while you are totally dehydrated? It's terrible for a person and it's terrible for a horse.

As Dale Romans said today on ATR, 'Who cares what they do in Europe' -- or anywhere else?'. Should we adopt the Euro too? We have a different sport that generally races on a different surface. The stresses placed on horses here are different than those in the rest of the world. We don't have 6 month seasons where horses are off more than they race. We don't have private backstretches where track-run vets & dispensaries operate. Meanwhile, iinternational outfits train on Lasix readily and would use it on raceday happily.

Seriously still clinging to the 'lasix masks other drugs' nonsense? That crap is old enough to vote. File it with the other grand lie that 'bleeding is hereditary and we need to purge it from the gene pool'. It's amazing that someone who is 'in the business' is perpetuating the same misinformation being peddled by the uninformed on facebook and the like.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Kasept

As Dale Romans said today on ATR, 'Who cares what they do in Europe' -- or anywhere else?'. Should we adopt the Euro too? We have a different sport that generally races on a different surface. The stresses placed on horses here are different than those in the rest of the world. We don't have 6 month seasons where horses are off more than they race. We don't have private backstretches where track-run vets & dispensaries operate. Meanwhile, iinternational outfits train on Lasix readily and would use it on raceday happily.

Seriously still clinging to the 'lasix masks other drugs' nonsense? That crap is old enough to vote. File it with the other grand lie that 'bleeding is hereditary and we need to purge it from the gene pool'. It's amazing that someone who is 'in the business' is perpetuating the same misinformation being peddled by the uninformed on facebook and the like.

If I am not mistaken, didn't one of the vets that you respect most (Steve Allday) say that we don't need lasix?

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

If I am not mistaken, didn't one of the vets that you respect most (Steve Allday) say that we don't need lasix?

He says we can survive without Lasix and that's certainly true. But that's not what is really being discussed. The issue at hand is Lasix as a canard for a small minority of the sport trying to impose its' will and self interest on the rest of us. And destroying the business for the non-idle rich in the process.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Kasept

He says we can survive without Lasix and that's certainly true. But that's not what is really being discussed. The issue at hand is Lasix as a canard for a small minority of the sport trying to impose its' will and self interest on the rest of us. And destroying the business for the non-idle rich in the process.

I think most people in the business completely underestimate the harm that drugs in racing has done to the integrity of the sport. I think all the drugs in racing has absolutely killed the business. I think it has driven tons of fans and bettors away.

Would eliminating lasix reverse this? Would it bring all the fans and bettors back? Of course not. I don't think anyone is claiming that. But I think it would be a good first step. I think racing has to move towards the elimination of most drugs.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I think most people in the business completely underestimate the harm that drugs in racing has done to the integrity of the sport. I think all the drugs in racing has absolutely killed the business. I think it has driven tons of fans and bettors away.

Would eliminating lasix reverse this? Would it bring all the fans and bettors back? Of course not. I don't think anyone is claiming that. But I think it would be a good first step. I think racing has to move towards the elimination of most drugs.

The integrity issue has been mangled by the industry with help from our friends at the various state racing commissions for years. People only know what we tell them and for years all they ever heard about was positive tests with no explanation of what the meds were, that most had zero effect on the raceday performance of the horse in question and no one explaining the penalty structure or even that we operate with virtually no steadfast rules, just "suggestions" that often are plain old guesses.

Because the industry (and most of the ivory tower crowd behind the medication bs) refused to understand its customers and refused to understand that we were a gambling venture first and foremost and a sport second they tried to hide everything medicationwise. Naturally that backfired and tracks are still slow to understand that the Ness and Guerrero's of the world are bad for business at their tracks and cast a poor light on everything. THAT is the drug problem that we have which has nothing to do with lasix or any other type of legal medication!

You see the thing is that virtually no one has any idea what is being given to various horses (legally!) and the idea that eliminating something that no one knows about anyway on "our word" when we just spent the last few months telling everyone Lasix is a performance enhancing drug and most of the results of the last 30 years are tainted isnt myopic, it is sheer stupidity.

Again the idea that modern medicine is bad for thoroughbred racehorses only and is causing people not to bet is beyond dumb.

Only horseracing can spend virtually nothing on surveillence and enforcement and be surprised that people might be doing illegal things and react by banning a legal medication.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The integrity issue has been mangled by the industry with help from our friends at the various state racing commissions for years. People only know what we tell them and for years all they ever heard about was positive tests with no explanation of what the meds were, that most had zero effect on the raceday performance of the horse in question and no one explaining the penalty structure or even that we operate with virtually no steadfast rules, just "suggestions" that often are plain old guesses.

Because the industry (and most of the ivory tower crowd behind the medication bs) refused to understand its customers and refused to understand that we were a gambling venture first and foremost and a sport second they tried to hide everything medicationwise. Naturally that backfired and tracks are still slow to understand that the Ness and Guerrero's of the world are bad for business at their tracks and cast a poor light on everything. THAT is the drug problem that we have which has nothing to do with lasix or any other type of legal medication!

You see the thing is that virtually no one has any idea what is being given to various horses (legally!) and the idea that eliminating something that no one knows about anyway on "our word" when we just spent the last few months telling everyone Lasix is a performance enhancing drug and most of the results of the last 30 years are tainted isnt myopic, it is sheer stupidity.

Again the idea that modern medicine is bad for thoroughbred racehorses only and is causing people not to bet is beyond dumb.

Only horseracing can spend virtually nothing on surveillence and enforcement and be surprised that people might be doing illegal things and react by banning a legal medication.

I strongly agree with you on one thing. I think you are absolutely right that horseracing should be spending a lot of money on surveillance and enforcement.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Kasept

As Dale Romans said today on ATR, 'Who cares what they do in Europe' -- or anywhere else?'. Should we adopt the Euro too? We have a different sport that generally races on a different surface. The stresses placed on horses here are different than those in the rest of the world. We don't have 6 month seasons where horses are off more than they race. We don't have private backstretches where track-run vets & dispensaries operate. Meanwhile, iinternational outfits train on Lasix readily and would use it on raceday happily.

Seriously still clinging to the 'lasix masks other drugs' nonsense? That crap is old enough to vote. File it with the other grand lie that 'bleeding is hereditary and we need to purge it from the gene pool'. It's amazing that someone who is 'in the business' is perpetuating the same misinformation being peddled by the uninformed on facebook and the like.