62% Federal Tax rate??!!

[dagolfer33]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

How can it not affect you directly?

I don't make a mil a year Tim.

[Princess Doreen]

Originally Posted by dagolfer33

I don't make a mil a year Tim.

But, I'll bet you're employed by someone who does.

Can't help but feel there is going to be even more unemployment if such a ridiculous tax increase goes through.

Where is the incentive for businessmen to grow their businesses?

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Princess Doreen

But, I'll bet you're employed by someone who does.

Can't help but feel there is going to be even more unemployment if such a ridiculous tax increase goes through.

Where is the incentive for businessmen to grow their businesses?

moving to lower taxing countries? Similar to why so many wealthy have residences in FL, AZ and Nevada?

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

moving to lower taxing countries? Similar to why so many wealthy have residences in FL, AZ and Nevada?

California has refused to remember their own failed policies towards small businesses....at one time in 90's over 100k business moved out of Cali. Now they want to tax the internet puveyors of goods like Amazon.

[dagolfer33]

Originally Posted by Princess Doreen

But, I'll bet you're employed by someone who does.

You are correct, this would be the definition of an INDIRECT affect. Let's face it. The GOVT, no matter which party is in charge, is always trying to stick a vacuum cleaner hose in my pockets. Riot and dell may disagree with this statement.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dagolfer33

You are correct, this would be the definition of an INDIRECT affect. Let's face it. The GOVT, no matter which party is in charge, is always trying to stick a vacuum cleaner hose in my pockets. Riot and dell may disagree with this statement.

I own my own small business. I pay lots of taxes, and purchase equipment and stock and inventory, and pay people to work for me. I agree.

The difference lays in what we feel is justified to pay, or not

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by Riot

I own my own small business. I pay lots of taxes, and purchase equipment and stock and inventory, and pay people to work for me. I agree.

The difference lays in what we feel is justified to pay, or not

the difference lies

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

I own my own small business. I pay lots of taxes, and purchase equipment and stock and inventory, and pay people to work for me.

do you pay for your employees' health care?

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by dagolfer33

I don't make a mil a year Tim.

trickle down was my thinkin.....throw the stone across the pond...ripples!

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

trickle down was my thinkin.....throw the stone across the pond...ripples!

yes, because we all know that when we give rich folks more money they will share it with the middle class and the poor by creating more well paying jobs and increasing benefits...they are all really secret Santas!

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

yes, because we all know that when we give rich folks more money they will share it with the middle class and the poor by creating more well paying jobs and increasing benefits...they are all really secret Santas!

No... but they're not the Klingon Empire either!

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

No... but they're not the Klingon Empire either!

In the future, the Klingons become our friends, the rich will never be friends of the poor.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

In the future, the Klingons become our friends, the rich will never be friends of the poor.

Somer: way too cynical for someone with your breadth of knowledge

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

Somer: way too cynical for someone with your breadth of knowledge

Timm, unfortunately I've seen the results of trusting rich folks throughout my life. Not saying all are evil, but the ideology that trusting windfalls given to rich folks will benefit us all simply isn't true.

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

yes, because we all know that when we give rich folks more money they will share it with the middle class and the poor by creating more well paying jobs and increasing benefits...they are all really secret Santas!

Subtle, but important difference: it's not "giving the rich more money" - it's taking less from them.

They earned the money. Why should they part with more of it (as a percentage) than anyone else?

[Rileyoriley]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Subtle, but important difference: it's not "giving the rich more money" - it's taking less from them.

They earned the money. Why should they part with more of it (as a percentage) than anyone else?

[clyde]

Originally Posted by Rileyoriley

^^^^ No. 50 on the 100 Richest People in the World list.



Small wonder.

[Rileyoriley]

Originally Posted by clyde

^^^^ No. 50 on the 100 Richest People in the World list.



Small wonder.

You, sir, are now un-invited to the Belmont party with the Belmonts on my private yacht.

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Subtle, but important difference: it's not "giving the rich more money" - it's taking less from them.

They earned the money. Why should they part with more of it (as a percentage) than anyone else?

As Mr Spock would say..."the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few". Especially in this case when the rich don't "need", they covet. In the end, one either favors possessions or people. Talk of what is "fair" to one group at the expense of another is inherently "unfair"...such is the world, not a black and white place but one filled with shades of grey.

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by somerfrost

As Mr Spock would say..."the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few". Especially in this case when the rich don't "need", they covet. In the end, one either favors possessions or people. Talk of what is "fair" to one group at the expense of another is inherently "unfair"...such is the world, not a black and white place but one filled with shades of grey.

Any talk of "need" with regard to income and what can keep due to government confiscation is, often unintentionally, socialistic.

If I am to "earn" a large paycheck, and 62% of it is forcibly taken from me, why the hell would I work hard enough to do that again? I'd work enough to earn a figure in a lower bracket - which I can do, due to the ludicrous progressive tax system. So then it is not just I who lost the income, but also the government. This is one of the mechanisms by which higher tax rates often yield lower revenues.

Another mechanism is that I simply move my business out of the country and avoid this confiscatory tax.

You cannot define what is "fair", especially, as you point out, when the costs are assigned to one group and the benefits are assigned to another non-overlapping group. This is why we need a flat tax: everyone paying the same rate. Earn twice as much, pay twice as much. Earn half as much, pay half as much. Put in a poverty exclusion - like not taxing the first $50,000 or something. Because we can define what is proportional, and that often syncs up with what most people would agree is fair.

By the way, on a more frivolous note:

I am a huge Star Trek fan. When Spock said that statement it was in reference to whether he or Kirk should command the ship since Spock was acting captain, Kirk was an admiral and normally would not interfere, but of course, as always, a critical mission came up. I don't think it was a wholesale endorsement of redistributing wealth.