Privman: Let the Horse of the Year Debate Begin

[Merlinsky]

Originally Posted by Scav

I can't remember but did Azeri clearly have the best year when she won HOY? Wasn't there someone else that was pretty good that year and people bitched and moan about her winning it. I can't remember if she won it the year she got drilled in the Classic or not.

No, she got it in 2002. 2004 was year o' the Ghostzapper. Here's her 2002 Distaff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxD_V...eature=related She was an impressive gal, and I wish we hadn't lost her to Japan. The horses in the Distaff that year included Farda Amiga, Imperial Gesture, Take Charge Lady, Starrer, Summer Colony,  Mandy's Gold, and Two Item Limit. She got (not drilled but a rather respectable) fifth in the Classic in 2004. Beyer was totally dogging on her and I think said something about how she wouldn't finish in the top half of the field, but she did. The fact that her races were on dirt I'm sure mattered. If they were on synthetic, maybe less support for HOY.

I don't remember it being terribly controversial that she won over War Emblem or Medaglia D'Oro, but maybe somebody was saying it. I don't think the vote was very tight. People were complaining more about how that the 3yo colt and older male divisions fell apart. Either one could've gotten it, but the only horse that didn't have issues was Azeri. She did manage to travel for the Apple Blossom. If Zenyatta comes along in that year instead, running on dirt, she probably gets it even running in the Distaff.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Merlinsky

No, she got it in 2002. 2004 was year o' the Ghostzapper. Here's her 2002 Distaff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxD_V...eature=related She was an impressive gal, and I wish we hadn't lost her to Japan. The horses in the Distaff that year included Farda Amiga, Imperial Gesture, Take Charge Lady, Starrer, Summer Colony,  Mandy's Gold, and Two Item Limit. She got (not drilled but a rather respectable) fifth in the Classic in 2004. Beyer was totally dogging on her and I think said something about how she wouldn't finish in the top half of the field, but she did. The fact that her races were on dirt I'm sure mattered. If they were on synthetic, maybe less support for HOY.

I don't remember it being terribly controversial that she won over War Emblem or Medaglia D'Oro, but maybe somebody was saying it. I don't think the vote was very tight. People were complaining more about how that the 3yo colt and older male divisions fell apart. Either one could've gotten it, but the only horse that didn't have issues was Azeri. She did manage to travel for the Apple Blossom. If Zenyatta comes along in that year instead, running on dirt, she probably gets it even running in the Distaff.

i know there was a lot of discussion about it on the message board. tons of folks were unhappy that a horse with zero open races was in the running for hoy. but the group of males that year had spotty records-street cry tailed off after a good spring, left bank made a brief impressive fall run. hers was the only good, year-long campaign.
and i believe ghostzapper won hoy with only four races that year he got the award. some wanted him to get hoy the following year with just a met mile under his belt.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Danzig

hers was the only good, year-long campaign.

It was a good - long - easy one.

[johnny pinwheel]

As usual the 9 pages of tripe as if there is a debate....i remember reading the same sh^t saying she was not going to run in the classic. (it went on for months!)....lol........this is live theater (kind of like the three stooges or its always sunny in philadelphia)lol. I think people just like bitching and stirring the pot. because this sh^t can't be serious???? can it??? of course Blame is it. the winner gets the spoils. there will be some stupid votes of would of , could of , should of. but voters with integrity will vote for blame or the game is worse off than i think it is. this whole internet thing is viral....stupidity spreads quickly............the other horse ran a hell of a race...in fact the naysayers should shut up because you really look stupid. first you said she would not run, now you are bragging like she humiliated herself. Yeah, zenyatta ran like an untested piece of sh^t, making up 18 and half lengths . are you happy now? ...MORONS. Blame was better though and is the champ....i now live in a world where results and reality no longer count.....God bless us all! PS. please keep betting this way too. its getting cold i need vacation money....lol

[slotdirt]

Why do folks keep talking about this awful trip Zenyatta had? Really, was it that bad?

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Why do folks keep talking about this awful trip Zenyatta had? Really, was it that bad?

Her trip was excellent. Every time a deep closer in a collapsing race doesn't get through like Street Sense or Mine That Bird did - people exaggerate the trip.

[tector]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Why do folks keep talking about this awful trip Zenyatta had? Really, was it that bad?

She had the typical type of trip deep, deep closers routinely have in fields of any size (something unfamiliar in SoCal). That's it. Her running style is what it is, and you have to take the good and the bad with it. It is far from ideal which is what makes her record--even with the many tin-can races--even that much more remarkable. It is harder to win constantly if you have a one dimensional running style, either deep closer or need-to-lead (the latter is even tougher, I think, because any rabbit can kill you).

[Princess Doreen]

^^^ Good post.

[Merlinsky]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i know there was a lot of discussion about it on the message board. tons of folks were unhappy that a horse with zero open races was in the running for hoy. but the group of males that year had spotty records-street cry tailed off after a good spring, left bank made a brief impressive fall run. hers was the only good, year-long campaign.
and i believe ghostzapper won hoy with only four races that year he got the award. some wanted him to get hoy the following year with just a met mile under his belt.

Yeah I had a rant about the 4 race thing for Ghostzapper, but I deleted it because it was going on too long, and I was trying to write about Azeri. Running in so few races leading to HOY requires an insane amount of dominance, and even then it's still unsatisfying. I know folks love Uncle Mo, for example, and I really enjoyed what he did as a 2yo, but when I hear HOY speculation for him it just seems bizarre. Favorite Trick got it undefeated as a 2yo over Skip Away, but he ran 8 times to earn it. I don't care if Uncle Mo is the second coming of Seattle Slew--he's run 3 times. You can be a 2yo baby to justify that number of starts, and it'll get you 2yo champ, but Horses of the Year shouldn't win like that. I'd say he needs another G1, maybe a couple more starts, and all the BCC favorites off the board. They bend over backwards wanting an older male dirt router for the HOY. If they hadn't had one, they'd go with Zenyatta over Uncle Mo.

One thing about GZ, he did win from 7 to 10 furlongs in 2004 so I want to give him credit for that range. Also, he seemed so fast that he might honestly have hurt himself if he ran every 3-4 weeks. In a way he did after his Met Mile. Those bones can only stand up to so much, and he had pretty crazy Beyers, e.g a 128 in the Iselin. Letting him do what he wanted to do and letting him do it too often might've caused something catastrophic. I think they were protecting him from himself.