The degeneration of the sport over the last 15 years

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by HomerS

First of all I loved Serenas Song. One of my all time favorites. Danced in every dance have nothing but good memories.

But if anything that shows degeneration of the fan.

Because look at all those losses especially in that last year.

If you lose one race now you are overrated. Two races a hopeless bum. Hell you dont even have to lose as we have seen.

Where exactly is the proof of this? It's the goddamn owners who are so deathly afraid of losing. Real fans don't care if a horse loses a few races as long as they're taking on top competition.

[joeydb]

Good one drugs.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by HomerS

Proof is on the forums. Proof? Its everywhere. Look for any thread with the name Zenyetta in it.

I said real fans. Not internet lunatics who have giant axes to grind against either Rachel Alexandra or Zenyatta.

Originally Posted by HomerS

But the connections of both have shown they are not like the others. Besides the most obvious point (both are running when easily could have been retired already) were their no other spots for Rachel last year then the races she ran? Are you honestly going to say her races last year were easy? As far as Zenyetta there was no easier spot then the Classic?

Its the fault of these connections that there is a dearth of quality horses anymore?

Rachel's campaign last year was extraordinary. Zenyatta's was lame except for one race in her backyard. Both campaigns this year have been lame. So one exciting season out of four, and now Moss and Jackson are suddenly Butch Cassidy and John effing Wayne? Dearth of quality horses? THERE'S A QUALITY HORSE DOWN THE SHEDROW FROM ZENYATTA THAT THEY WON'T GO AFTER. Face Rail Trip. Face Quality Road. Face each other. Do something, but don't run in cupcake ungraded fabricated stakes or stakes you've won three years in a goddamn row.

Originally Posted by Homers

God forbid one of these horses breaks down. Will hear the why didnt they retiire the horse, coudlnt they have found an easier spot, the heartless butchers.

This is pure conjecture. PETA members might say this, DT members are smarter than that and you know it.

[Bigsmc]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

I said real fans. Not internet lunatics who have giant axes to grind against either Rachel Alexandra or Zenyatta.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by HomerS

Smarty Jones lost one race and then all the nonsense about him was written.

I understand your overall point, but with regards to Smarty, I think most of the "nonsense" was written before the Belmont....by his fans.

[miraja2]

One of the (many) things that stands out after looking at Serena's Song's PPs is that at age 2 and 4 she actually ran in races after the Breeder's Cup. The connections treated the BC as I think it should be treated. The BC is a big set of races that a good horse's connections should make an effort to attend if practical, but it should NOT be treated as horse racing's equivalent of the World Series where the completion of the event means the sport goes away for the next 4 or 5 months.

I sure wish more horses of her caliber were running in graded stakes races in November and December (and January & February for that matter) these days.

[Revidere]

I get it. The trainer everyone was crucifying in the 90's for running his horses into the ground is now the example to emulate.

Hmmmm.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by Revidere

I get it. The trainer everyone was crucifying in the 90's for running his horses into the ground is now the example to emulate.

Hmmmm.

The thing is, though, and I know you're aware of it, is that DrugS could have just as easily posted the PPs of Cigar, Skip Away, or a slew of others and had the same effect. DWL may be a bit more "controversial" trainer to include but the point is the same, the horsemen nowadays are not the same.

NT

[Revidere]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

The thing is, though, and I know you're aware of it, is that DrugS could have just as easily posted the PPs of Cigar, Skip Away, or a slew of others and had the same effect. DWL may be a bit more "controversial" trainer to include but the point is the same, the horsemen nowadays are not the same.

NT

Absolutely.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

The thing is, though, and I know you're aware of it, is that DrugS could have just as easily posted the PPs of Cigar, Skip Away, or a slew of others and had the same effect. DWL may be a bit more "controversial" trainer to include but the point is the same, the horsemen nowadays are not the same.

NT

The 90's weren't that long ago Nick and many of those players are still in the game. In my opinion, it has more to do with economics than anything else.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

The 90's weren't that long ago Nick and many of those players are still in the game. In my opinion, it has more to do with economics than anything else.

I think it's more of an epidemic propagated by the 21st Century "super trainers" specifically guys like Todd Pletcher, whose "optimum days between start" index is somewhere between 60 and 3000.

NT

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by Revidere

I get it. The trainer everyone was crucifying in the 90's for running his horses into the ground is now the example to emulate.

Hmmmm.

That's a fair point. 38 starts in 29 months is a bit extreme, and Lukas is not exactly the ideal trainer in my book.

However, I thinking looking at Serena's Song's performances demonstrate that at least some G1-caliber horses can handle an aggressive campaign, and perhaps not every quality runner needs to run less than 5-8 times a year.

[Travis Stone]

Serena's Song raced a lot, shipped a lot, tried a lot and won a lot. If only a few more horsemen were willing to do the things Lukas did.

[Thunder Gulch]

This is the leader in the clubhouse for "Thread of the Year". A lot of great points being made all over.

I believe the drugs, the thoro-patterns, and the egotistical owners all have a prominent part in turning a racing season into a carefully orchestrated attempt at picking soft spots for what should be the best horses in training. This isn't the 40's we're comparing here, we are talking about 15 years ago.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

Serena's Song raced a lot, shipped a lot, tried a lot and won a lot. If only a few more horsemen were willing to do the things Lukas did.

It was a lot of fun when he had a great horse who could stand up to his training.

[Travis Stone]

Not that I'm saying Lukas was the greatest trainer ever, but exactly how many horses did he break down? How many did he "break down" on a national stage, in the spotlight? Is it more than say, other big name trainers in the game today?

[letswastemoney]

When I was a kid, I remember being a huge fan of the Lukas trained Criminal Type. I wish he wouldn't have gotten injured in the middle of the year. Heck if SS, Easy Goer, and Criminal Type never got injured, it would have been a great BC Classic.