Most Talented 3yo since the 90's?

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by paisjpq

easy goer.

That was '89! (I agree though, he rocked!)

[paisjpq]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

That was '89! (I agree though, he rocked!)

sorry spaced on that one...90's--skip away (evem though he was a better older horsethan a three year old)

[Buffymommy]

Originally Posted by paisjpq

sorry spaced on that one...90's--skip away (evem though he was a better older horsethan a three year old)

I liked him too. He would be in my top 5 of the 90s.

More fun would be best 3 Year Old Season Ever:

Man O' War (undefeated and beat the Triple Crown winner in a match race)
Citation (15 in a row, sweeps the Triple Crown and wins at distances from 6 furlongs to 2 miles in the JCGC)
Secretariat (he lost the Wood and the Whitney remember)

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Dixie Porter

Most overated horse in the history of the game. Best PR campaign in the history of the game.

You'd be amazed at the people that bought into those fairy tales after every loss (5 in all).

That is one horse I really wished would have kept on racing. Nice job by Penny with IRS BS.

As u know, I agree with u to an extent. Now most people will say I'm knocking Sec and that's not true. I do believe that he was one of the all-time greats just nowhere near the best ever. Probably not even top 10. I think it's just mostly mystique nowdays that make people want to list him in their top two or three ever. That Belmont race was a freak effort. He was NOT a 2:24 horse. Look at his Woodward and the turf race to get a better idea of how he was at 12f. Still good but not otherwordly. And just imagine if there had been a horse in the Belmont capable of going in 2:27. Then Sec's margin of victory would have been "only" 15. While still dominant, the perception wouldn't be the way it is today because it was 31 lengths. And who knows what he would have done as a 4yo? It's not a guarantee that they automatically improve. The way he ran as a 3yo could suggest that he was already at his peak. If u are going to say he would have improved, would we then have expected 1:57 10f races, 2:23 12f races, or 1:31 miles? Doubtful. And I think it's a mistake to overlook the fact that he lost two of three races when facing older horses on dirt and although he did run 1:45 2/5 in the Marlboro, remember it's Belmont and one-turn and good horses run fast times there. I have seen Go for Wand and Dispersal run 1:45 4/5 there. Secretariat was great. There is no doubt about that. But still overrated.

[sham]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

As u know, I agree with u to an extent. Now most people will say I'm knocking Sec and that's not true. I do believe that he was one of the all-time greats just nowhere near the best ever. Probably not even top 10. I think it's just mostly mystique nowdays that make people want to list him in their top two or three ever. That Belmont race was a freak effort. He was NOT a 2:24 horse. Look at his Woodward and the turf race to get a better idea of how he was at 12f. Still good but not otherwordly. And just imagine if there had been a horse in the Belmont capable of going in 2:27. Then Sec's margin of victory would have been "only" 15. While still dominant, the perception wouldn't be the way it is today because it was 31 lengths. And who knows what he would have done as a 4yo? It's not a guarantee that they automatically improve. The way he ran as a 3yo could suggest that he was already at his peak. If u are going to say he would have improved, would we then have expected 1:57 10f races, 2:23 12f races, or 1:31 miles? Doubtful. And I think it's a mistake to overlook the fact that he lost two of three races when facing older horses on dirt and although he did run 1:45 2/5 in the Marlboro, remember it's Belmont and one-turn and good horses run fast times there. I have seen Go for Wand and Dispersal run 1:45 4/5 there. Secretariat was great. There is no doubt about that. But still overrated.

Perhaps you could share with us ten 3yos that were better than Secretariat.

[somerfrost]

Originally Posted by sham

Perhaps you could share with us ten 3yos that were better than Secretariat.

I've debated this for...well, since 1973. Secretariat was the greatest horse to ever set foot on a track...period! All you had to do was see him run to appreciate him...there was no PR campaign, no smoke and mirrors, just pure talent! I won't post in this thread again as folks have their minds made up one way or another...I've given the stats hundreds of times, broken down every race...some folks have an argument for every fact...so be it! He ran a 2:24 in the Belmont...to say he wasn't a 2:24 horse is ridiculous...he ran the race! And Sham was fully capable of running a 2:25...but not after going under 1:10 for 6f...pace makes the race and Secretariat's pace that day reduced the others to also-rans...name me a horse that could have run with him that day? Sham would run the likes Point Given, Sunday Silence and the other so-called "better" horses into oblivion, only Tiznow of the recent runners would possibly best him, and he would have to catch him!

[repent]

Originally Posted by sham

Perhaps you could share with us ten 3yos that were better than Secretariat.

Diamond Fury
Kings Consul
Tasmanian Tiger
Leading the Parade
Alajwad
Grand Reward
Fusaichi Samarai
whywhywhy
Line of Departure
Van Nistelrooy(both of them)

all horses who exceled on the track and lived up to all the hype.

[Assttodixie]

Originally Posted by Dixie Porter

Most overated horse in the history of the game. Best PR campaign in the history of the game.

You'd be amazed at the people that bought into those fairy tales after every loss (5 in all).

That is one horse I really wished would have kept on racing. Nice job by Penny with IRS BS.

Boss-

Once again, your uncanny knack for horses will dumbfound and confuse these MORONS.

They have no idea like you do that Big Red was on Roids. You have firsthand knowledge that Victor Conte's grandpa was sending the "clear" and the "cream" to Penny and the gang when Barry Bonds was still in diapers. Heck, "red beans" were named in honor of the big horse.

The time in the belmont that still stands today? Mirage!

Derby record that still stands today? Mirage as well!

Unofficial preakness record? Phony!

Marlboro cup? bad day by all the other horses!

Yes, just a great media campaign for an overrated horse.

[King Glorious]

1. Lammtarra
2. Go for Wand
3. Smarty Jones
4. Giant's Causeway
5. Rock of Gibraltar
6. Bernardini
7. Holy Bull
8. Point Given
9. Thunder Gulch
10. Serena's Song

Note-I think that Arazi would have been on this list with proper handling because he had the talent but unfortunately, never got to show his best. To make the list, u have to have talent PLUS accomplishments. Lion Heart was also very nearly on this list. Had he not gotten hurt, he would have won the Travers and that, along with the Haskell win, would have been enough to make it.

Looking at only the 3 Year Old Season:

Holy Bull
A.P Indy
Point Given
Thunder Gulch
Serena's Song

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

Originally Posted by FairPlay

Looking at only the 3 Year Old Season:

Holy Bull
A.P Indy
Point Given
Thunder Gulch
Serena's Song

I like that list, but I would throw Go For Wand and the Rock of Gibralter in there as well...loved the Rock of Gibralter...also liked Tiznow

I wish that we could have seen more from Afleet Alex, Smarty Jones, and Charismatic...

Bernardini may be on the top of that list for me by the end of the year...

A.P. Indy, Holy Bull, Bernardini

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

I like that list, but I would throw Go For Wand and the Rock of Gibralter in there as well...loved the Rock of Gibralter...also liked Tiznow

I wish that we could have seen more from Afleet Alex, Smarty Jones, and Charismatic...

Bernardini may be on the top of that list for me by the end of the year...

Glad you liked the list. I just tried to keep it to 5. There are many other worthy names.

[randallscott35]

Holy Bull. Then Smarty for me.

Holy Bull and Point Given for me in the US.

[Slewbopper]

Originally Posted by eurobounce

Holy Bull and Point Given for me in the US.

I agree......