Jerry Brown's letter to TDN on HOY discussion

[2Hot4TV]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The facts in this case are black and white

RA gets HOY and history remembers undefeated Zenyatta as the fans race horse.

RA has to do alot in the future to erase what Zenyatta did in her broad picture of races. Zenyatta is a closer that managed to retire undefeated and overcome all pace conditions that were thrown at her and finished by beating the males in the Breeders Cup Classic at 1 1/4 miles which at this point RA is suspect without getting weight.

Yes she has alot to overcome in her 4 year old campain.

Lets revisit it this time next year after RA has picked her spots and the BC is on dirt. Will she still be the same world beater that alot of people think she is, or will she be the great 3 yo Filly she was.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV

RA gets HOY and history remembers undefeated Zenyatta as the fans race horse.

RA has to do alot in the future to erase what Zenyatta did in her broad picture of races. Zenyatta is a closer that managed to retire undefeated and overcome all pace conditions that were thrown at her and finished by beating the males in the Breeders Cup Classic at 1 1/4 miles which at this point RA is suspect without getting weight.

Yes she has alot to overcome in her 4 year old campain.

Lets revisit it this time next year after RA has picked her spots and the BC is on dirt. Will she still be the same world beater that alot of people think she is, or will she be the great 3 yo Filly she was.

i don't think so.


i find it amazing that much of the arguments for the one could be made for the other. but those squarely in one camp or the other don't see that.

watch:


zenyatta gets HOY and history remembers undefeated 3 yo rachel as the fans race horse.

zenyatta has to do a lot in the future to erase what rachel did in her broad picture of races. rachel is a tactical horse that managed to go undefeated this year and overcome all pace conditions that were thrown at her and finished by beating the males in the woodward, first ever for a filly.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

ok how many of r.a s races would zen have won..1 maybee 2

[2Hot4TV]

Originally Posted by hoovesupsideyourhead

ok how many of r.a s races would zen have won..1 maybee 2

Looking at Zenyatta's record and if history was to repeat, you would have to say all of them.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV

Zenyatta is a closer that managed to retire undefeated and overcome all pace conditions that were thrown at her and finished by beating the males in the Breeders Cup Classic at 1 1/4 miles which at this point RA is suspect without getting weight.

If you're gonna compare the two, you have to play on a 2-way street.

Didn't Zenyatta get weight in the BC Classic?

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

If you're gonna compare the two, you have to play on a 2-way street.

Didn't Zenyatta get weight in the BC Classic?

She is 1250lbs how much more can a horse weigh?lol

[2Hot4TV]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

If you're gonna compare the two, you have to play on a 2-way street.

Didn't Zenyatta get weight in the BC Classic?

1 pound and she didn't need it. I beleive RA got 6 or 9 pounds which she needed to hold on.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV

1 pound and she didn't need it. I beleive RA got 6 or 9 pounds which she needed to hold on.

Zenyatta was in receipt of three pounds from Gio Ponti and the other males.

NT

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV

1 pound and she didn't need it. I beleive RA got 6 or 9 pounds which she needed to hold on.

They both won.

How are you certain that the weight played an issue in either race?

Maybe I'm missing the significance of weight. Are they like the Lifelines used on "Who Wants To Be A Millionaire"?

Was Calvin Borel allowed to pull out 8 1lb pieces of lead from his saddle and chuck them at Macho Again as he closed the gap?

I better check the replay.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by 2Hot4TV

1 pound and she didn't need it. I beleive RA got 6 or 9 pounds which she needed to hold on.

Is this a suggestion that as a 3 year old filly, Rachel Alexandra beating elder males is somehow diminished by the weight scale? The Woodward is WFA... weight for age, the international scale of equine competition. Elders are assigned 126 pounds; 3yo's 121; females get a 3# allowance. Hence, as a 3yo female, Rachel Alexandra carried 118 while the 7 elder males carried 126. This is the scale of weight. A three year old filly facing elder males, a challenge so outlandish that it more or less hadn't been done in this country in 100+ years, is entitled to the allowance.

Some clarity on Weight for Age:

Weight for Age (WFA) is a term in Thoroughbred horse racing which is one of the conditions for a race. It means that a horse will carry a set weight in accordance with the Weight for Age Scale. This weight varies depending on the horse’s age, its sex, the race distance and the month of the year. Weight for age races are usually Group 1 races, races of the highest quality.

WFA is a method of trying to equal out the physical progress which the average thoroughbred racehorse makes as it matures. The thoroughbred matures extremely quickly compared to the human being. By the age of two the horse has achieved 95% of its mature height and weight, and by the end of its third year it will be fully mature. To allow for this variation in maturity in the context of racing, it is necessary to express it as a function of the weight a horse will carry in a race. It is also necessary to take into account the race distance because stamina comes with maturity, and younger horses are at a greater disadvantage the further they have to run. If no allowance was made, a mature older horse would always beat a younger one.