Improving the product

[VOL JACK]

Originally Posted by Danzig

when i tell people it's 2 bucks to get in, they're shocked. that's it?? yeah, that's it. you can spend a day at the track, and maybe win money back to pay for the trip, and spend a lot less than having three hours at a ball game.

the thing most needed is advertising. sell the product. sell ownership-sell a cheap day long fun fest. sell the fact that you can win huge bucks. a variety of ways to do it.
but they need to get into mainstream advertising. the only time you see ads for racing is during a racing telecast. eff that. we who are watching already know about the sport.
run ads during a baseball game, a nascar race (we're the ORIGINAL horsepower)...

Like Sumitas and W17, you are missing the point. Its not the 2 bucks, its the principle.
I happen to own a small town pharmacy and I value each customer that walks thru the door. How long do you think it would take to go under if I stood at the door all day and charged a $2 admission fee to shop at my store? Although, Sam's Club seems to be getting away with it I am not going to go down that road..

Please, tell me the difference!!

[Danzig]

unlike a pharmacy, it's fun to go to the track.

every entertainment venue charges to get in, right? i'd say compared to every other type of entertainment, 2 lousy dollars won't break a bank.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by Danzig

unlike a pharmacy, it's fun to go to the track.

every entertainment venue charges to get in, right? i'd say compared to every other type of entertainment, 2 lousy dollars won't break a bank.

Gambling venues should not be charging for admission. They should be begging you to come in.

[Bigsmc]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Gambling venues should not be charging for admission. They should be begging you to come in.

Amen

[JohnGalt1]

About the point tha many race tracks should close-- Some states require that a track hold a live meet in order to have simulcasting year around.

[VOL JACK]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Gambling venues should not be charging for admission. They should be begging you to come in.

Funny how us real horse players think alike, and the neophytes look at it like going to the ZOO.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by VOL JACK

Funny how us real horse players think alike, and the neophytes look at it like going to the ZOO.

i guess i'm a neophyte, since i can afford two dollars to get into the track.
if a hard core gambler hasn't got 8 quarters to get in, i don't see how he's going to last long at the window once inside.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i guess i'm a neophyte, since i can afford two dollars to get into the track.
if a hard core gambler hasn't got 8 quarters to get in, i don't see how he's going to last long at the window once inside.

This is so much the wrong attitude that I am genuinely surprised. The horseplayer that enters a racetrack pays PLENTY by wagering. Even if he ( or she ) only puts $100 through the windows in a day they are contributing roughly $20 to the racetrack....are you suggesting they should be expected to pay an additional $2 ( or more ) for the right to help racing in this manner?

But, nowadays it's actually even worse. With the majority of the money wagered these days going in through simulcasting, host tracks receive only a fragment of most of their wagering takeout, thus on-track dollars are even more precious. So, yes, asking people to pay for the right to wager at their facility is puzzling.

But, then again, at least you have the State of NY on your side, as they have effectively forbidden NYRA to allow their players in for free.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

This is so much the wrong attitude that I am genuinely surprised. The horseplayer that enters a racetrack pays PLENTY by wagering. Even if he ( or she ) only puts $100 through the windows in a day they are contributing roughly $20 to the racetrack....are you suggesting they should be expected to pay an additional $2 ( or more ) for the right to help racing in this manner?

But, nowadays it's actually even worse. With the majority of the money wagered these days going in through simulcasting, host tracks receive only a fragment of most of their wagering takeout, thus on-track dollars are even more precious. So, yes, asking people to pay for the right to wager at their facility is puzzling.

But, then again, at least you have the State of NY on your side, as they have effectively forbidden NYRA to allow their players in for free.

i guess i just don't see it as a big deal. on the one hand, it's a small amount, so you might wonder why they bother at all. on the other, it's such a small amount, you wonder how it could keep someone from attending.
as for people on my side, i don't feel i have anyone there as my state only allows me to wager at the track itself. no online, no tvg, nothing. so i'm really hamstrung about how i can spend my money.
this thread is about improving the product. i think the $2 entry fee is a tremendously small part of a far larger problem, a declining fan base.

who knows, maybe if the tracks got rid of the fee, and trumpeted 'free admission', you might get a few more in there. for me personally, i don't have a problem with paying $2 to enter the track.

maybe they could put that fee towards more advertising. or towards horse rescue/retirement.

Originally Posted by Danzig

i guess i'm a neophyte, since i can afford two dollars to get into the track.
if a hard core gambler hasn't got 8 quarters to get in, i don't see how he's going to last long at the window once inside.

The estute hardcore gambler would be better off if the casual
player were let in free. Given info for free. Seminars for easy betting
procedures between races.

And 50 cent beer
certainly would not hurt.

[sumitas]

Originally Posted by Danzig

unlike a pharmacy, it's fun to go to the track.

every entertainment venue charges to get in, right? i'd say compared to every other type of entertainment, 2 lousy dollars won't break a bank.

Really Danzig, 2 or 3 bucks is not gonna kill anyone.

[Split Rock]

I think what is really hurting the racing industry is a few things:

1) Interest in horse racing has waned over the years for a variety of reasons:
a) More gambling options
b) Too difficult and time consuming to try and understand all the idiocyncracies of the game for a casual fan
c) Best horses retire right away and fans don't have a connection with any of the horses
d) Awful customer service at MOST (not all) tracks
e) Too much down time between races with nothing for the casual fan to do (ever tried to bring a date or a friend to the track. Not a very social event while you try and cap and strategize between races)

2) Corruption (lack of believability)

3) Lack of a governing body (until this happens competing interests will cause turmoil (case in point the internet wagering battle))

4) From a marketing standpoint, not understanding how to tap into the interests of non-horse players

5) From a marketing standpoint, not understanding who their core audience is (US). They need to present the product in the way we require. For example:
a) Odds changing during or after the race. Core fans don't like it and the perception is it is past posting. Fix it!
b) Closeups during the race. Core fans want to see their horses battling for the minor awards in the stretch. They do not need to see the color of the eyes of the winner crossing the wire. Fix it!
c) Will pays. Core fans want to know what they are set up to win with the final legs of pick 3's, pick 4's and pick 6's. Possibly even will pays for trifectas? Either way, Fix it!
d) Late scratches. This is awful for couplings and for middle or end legs of multi race wagering. Hard core fans don't even know what the rules are, do they get the post time favorite or a consolation pay? Fix it!
e) Inquiries and DQ's. Core fans want more transparency. Fix it!
f) Delays. Can the track at least inform their patrons what the delay is about and the approximate re-start? Case in point, Hawthorne yesterday. Talk about poor customer service. Fix it!

Anyway, could go on and on.....sorry if it sounds like ranting but until the people in control of this game start to have an agenda to "improve the product" and "attract all types of people" we will be stuck with a sub par game. Currently in appears to be run by wolves tearing apart a roting carcas.

[Stall Mucker]

Took awhile to read through the entire thread. Lots of issues to address here. Some good stuff here. I think we can all agree that the game will never be perfect.
It will be interesting to see what will be addressed in NTRA players panel and even more interesting to see the NTRA implement anything. Sorry, I don't hold much hope.
Let me throw out an idea that a few friends and I have discussed in the past few months.
The subject is NYRA. VLTs will help for awhile but, it's still gonna be sometime before they are up and running.
Why does NYRA not make an acquistion for the downstate OTBs? Money could be made "overnight" and NYRA could then make the improvements necessary for the 3 tracks. The upstate OTBs could be restructured to be more efficient. If anyone remembers, a multi million $ offer was made to MR. Bloomberg for NYCOTB and he balked. Now he's looking to shut them down.