West Point/Violette finished

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Could you image Lear's Princess in this dude's hands? Enough said.

Hasn't Lear's Princess run last in two of her last three starts in McLaughlin's hands? He couldn't do any worse, I suppose.

[the_fat_man]

Last I checked, she ran Dreaming of Ana to a nose, when that one had it all her own way on the front end, and, most recently, 4th behind DoA on a yielding course.

On the other hand, Titan of Industry, has burned up alot of money sucking up behind REAL horses on the turf. Oh, wait, he did beat that STELLAR maiden field at 8:5, didn't he?

But, personally, the race that sticks out in my mind when it comes to Violette is
Immortal Eyes against The Leopard, sprinting at SAR. IE had everything his own way and quit like a PUNK just before the wire.


Nothing personal with RV. KM is certainly a much better trainer.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

Last I checked, she ran Dreaming of Ana to a nose, when that one had it all her own way on the front end, and, most recently, 4th behind DoA on a yielding course.

On the other hand, Titan of Industry, has burned up alot of money sucking up behind REAL horses on the turf. Oh, wait, he did beat that STELLAR maiden field at 8:5, didn't he?

But, personally, the race that sticks out in my mind when it comes to Violette is
Immortal Eyes against The Leopard, sprinting at SAR. IE had everything his own way and quit like a PUNK just before the wire.


Nothing personal with RV. KM is certainly a much better trainer.

I stand corrected on Dreaming of Anna. You're correct, she was 4th of 6 at 4-5 (sucking up, to use your term, huge $$) at Tampa in last.

I don't get the Immortal Eyes/The Leopard example. You're knocking the guy for having his $200K Greatness colt lose to a $2.5 million Storm Cat (who subsequently won a stake - I know it was on turf - and who happened to be the highest-priced 2YO sold in-training in 2007).

In short, the point is not whether KM is a better trainer than RV. I was responding to a quote that said Violette was fired "because he doesn't win." I just don't think that statement is accurate.

[VOL JACK]

Will be interesting to see what will become of Saratoga Russell, now that hes in the hands of KMc.
In defense of RV, hes done better with the west point stock than their Kentucky/ fair grounds trainer.

[the_fat_man]

Whatever the case; if it's not obvious to some here --and THIS IS the home of MISSING-the-OBVIOUS-- that KM is a bit of a better trainer that RV, it certainly seems to be WP's position. We can persist with irrational exchange or we can just take the facts at face value:

VIOLETTE is OUT!!! Kicked to the CURB.

Truth hurts. Deal with it.

[geof]

Hello, I'm new to the forums here on the same day I receive a call from WP telling me my horse (Tatter Tutt) will be getting KM as his new trainer.

Violette did a great job spotting Tatter Tutt to his 5 wins in the past 6 months but I had a hard time with his last descision to run him @ 7F last week!!

[hockey2315]

You should be happy. . . KMc is a superior trainer to Violette

[ELA]

Anyone hear anything yet as to "what really happened" here?

I'm not going to get into the pissing match of who is a good trainer and who is not. I think stats, results, performance, qualified and educates opinions, etc. speak for itself -- when people actually know what they are looking at, talking about, etc. Sure, there are elements that distort stats and facts, and that happens. Not time and time again though. Some trainers overachieve and some underachieve.

As far as West Point pulling their horses from Violette -- I didn't hear anything about it until I read it here. I have no idea why this might have happened. Not that I should either as I have zero connections to either, and I don't just go asking around the backstretch either.

I did always find one thing extremely ironic -- and that was the Violette/Finley/NYTHA/Empire issue. The CliffNotes version -- Rick Violette is a long standing board member of the NYTHA, and as a trainer board member, a vocal one. In the past, and during the entire saga, most often you heard from Bomze, the "in house" counsel" Alan Foreman, or Bob Flynn (then executive director). After Richard Bomze steps downs, Violette takes over as the NYTHA President. At the same time, Terry Finley is also on the board of the NYTHA. However, while he's on the NYHTA board, he also joins FONY and/or Empire. He just didn't join a committee or get nominated to the board -- he becomes a shareholder -- and is then still part of the NYTHA board that decides and throws it's backing behind Empire. The soap opera plays out for a few seasons, and later, the NYTHA pulls its backing from Empire and begins to play ball with NYRA. This might have been an ingredient here, although most of the saga is over -- excluding the VLT's, LOL. The entire situation and how it played out had problems, so it's not just this aspect.

Notwithstanding the specific players, and I am not referring to anyone specific, I felt there were always potential conflicts of interest here. Whether it was incestuous relationships, conflicts, or what, it was just to hard not to have them. There were of course initially factions on the NYHTA Board -- which in reality should not be the case at all. That was compounded and made worse when the NYHTA Board decided to have the entire organization endorse and support Empire. This lead to more animosity and division.

I have no idea what went on here. Maybe we might soon read or hear about what happened. I also don't know about what happened with Cristiano either.

Eric

Originally Posted by Cardus

It's NICE that you are HERE to explain the OBVIOUS to the rest of US.

YES, IT, IS.

[parsixfarms]

Eric,

You posted what I was thinking (politics) last night when I first saw this item. If one's worried about potential conflicts, keep in mind that McLaughlin is also on the NYTHA board.

[ELA]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

Eric,

You posted what I was thinking (politics) last night when I first saw this item. If one's worried about potential conflicts, keep in mind that McLaughlin is also on the NYTHA board.

Yes, I am well aware of that. However, like I said, I have no idea if politics were involved here so that didn't really come into play as far as I am concerned.

You have a similar situation with another board member and trainer -- both serve on the NYTHA board. However, as long as there is integrity in the process, you will have an efficient and effective board.

Originally Posted by AeWingnut

5 wins from 9 starts - that ain't half bad.

I wouldn't care if he voted for Hillary if he was getting results.

LOL. Now that's politics, LOL.

Eric

[cakes44]

Originally Posted by VOL JACK

Will be interesting to see what will become of Saratoga Russell, now that hes in the hands of KMc.
In defense of RV, hes done better with the west point stock than their Kentucky/ fair grounds trainer.

Assuming you are talking about Dallas Stewart, I could not agree more. That guy is awful and gets plenty of well-bred and/or high priced horseflesh.

[VOL JACK]

Originally Posted by cakes44

Assuming you are talking about Dallas Stewart, I could not agree more. That guy is awful and gets plenty of well-bred and/or high priced horseflesh.

Hes exceptionally good at getting absolutely nothing out of the blue-bloods.

[The Bid]

You would think Overbrook would expect more.

Going from Violette to KMC isnt a lateral move.

[geof]

I just received an update on my horse. I'm pissed that RV missed this. There are other horses that KM said looked thin and not healthy. I will do a count on the transfered horses and let you know which ones are affected if anyone wants to know. Have the feed costs gone up that much?????