CRIST: Changes dilute Cup's appeal

[31lengths]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I saw this coming with the "Win and your in " nonsense which is strictly a PR campaign. Though I still have no problem with the addition of races (though the marathon idea is questionable), the separation by sex/days and renaming the Distaff seems to make no sense. It as if they are trying to "trick" people into watching/attending. Just as the Sunshine Millions is a contrived "rivalry" between CA and FL, this is like a madeup gimmick that just has no real purpose.

I doubt that it is aimed at established fans like us.
I do believe that it is 100% a gimmick to attract new fans (somehow) .
Like they're "spicing" it up somehow....

[AeWingnut]

Originally Posted by 31lengths

I doubt that it is aimed at established fans like us.
I do believe that it is 100% a gimmick to attract new fans (somehow) .
Like they're "spicing" it up somehow....

aim high shoot low

are these mythical new fans going to take a day off to experience their first race?

[Holland Hacker]

Well I WAS considering making the transcontinental trip from NJ to Cali for the '08 Breeders Cup but now I think I'll take a pass. It is absurd that the BC Limited actually thinks this is a "good" idea.

[Cannon Shell]

Racing always misses the boat with their marketing so why would they get it right this time? They simply seem to forget that most racing fans are smarter than the average joe (KRIM as a prime example) especially compared to the average NASCAR fan (sorry cajun) yet they continue to try to dumbdown the game for mass appeal. Racing is complicated and a good part of the allure is the challenge of trying to figure it out. Rather than attempting to identify that type of potential customer (many who would be older than the demographic that they lust after) they give us a supposed championship day disguised as Ladies Night as though it were a happy hour promotion. As opposed to using modern technology like HDtv, they give away t shirts, clocks and waste paper baskets. Rather than ask people who are fans what they think or want, they piss away money listening to some junior exec at a second tier marketing agency.

[King Glorious]

Maybe it's just me but I don't see a single problem with this. We as racing fans were going to watch the races on Friday and Saturday no matter which races were on which days anyway. I see nothing wrong with trying to market things in a different way. Say for example Rags to Riches had finished the year out and ran in the BC but not in the Classic. In all of their marketing and advertising, the BC could tell fans to come out to see all three TC race winners.....only Rags would be in a different race and that race would be overshadowed by the Classic, the race for HOY. Rags would have been reduced to second fiddle. By having her run on the first day, they can basically showcase her. I don't see anything wrong with that. What's so wrong with trying to market two days instead of just one?

[Danzig]

a lot of folks work on fridays. i look forward to the bc, and treat it as a rare afternoon to watch race after race of what's supposed to be the best of the best.
so, what, now i go home and fast forward thru a bunch of filler to get to post time for those races, so i can hurry and watch a days races from friday before bed time?
also, a lot of fans enjoyed seeing that distaff..oh, excuse me, filly and mare classic-why shouldn't it be on the big day? why is it relegated to friday? to an afterthought? or in this case, a prelude to the big day.

so now those people buying those expensive tix to the saturday races, won't be getting what they used to get. i bet they mind!

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

so now those people buying those expensive tix to the saturday races, won't be getting what they used to get. i bet they mind!

I'm guessing that like the rest of sports that tickets will only be sold for both events, not individually.

[Linny]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Maybe it's just me but I don't see a single problem with this. We as racing fans were going to watch the races on Friday and Saturday no matter which races were on which days anyway. I see nothing wrong with trying to market things in a different way. Say for example Rags to Riches had finished the year out and ran in the BC but not in the Classic. In all of their marketing and advertising, the BC could tell fans to come out to see all three TC race winners.....only Rags would be in a different race and that race would be overshadowed by the Classic, the race for HOY. Rags would have been reduced to second fiddle. By having her run on the first day, they can basically showcase her. I don't see anything wrong with that. What's so wrong with trying to market two days instead of just one?

To me, having Rags race on Day 1 (in your scenario) is to make her "second fiddle." Sorry but the biggest race "the day before" doesn't stand equal to the Classic or anyhting on Saturday. The Personal Ensign is run on the Fri before the Travers, does anyone care?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Linny

To me, having Rags race on Day 1 (in your scenario) is to make her "second fiddle." Sorry but the biggest race "the day before" doesn't stand equal to the Classic or anyhting on Saturday. The Personal Ensign is run on the Fri before the Travers, does anyone care?

I hate to break it to everyone but Rags to Riches is not a 'crossover fan' attraction (not crossdressing). Her 15 minutes are up until she does something notble again.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Racing always misses the boat with their marketing so why would they get it right this time? They simply seem to forget that most racing fans are smarter than the average joe ...yet they continue to try to dumbdown the game for mass appeal. Racing is complicated and a good part of the allure is the challenge of trying to figure it out.

I would have agreed with this before observing how racing fans showed very little enthusiasm when presented with the opportunity to bet with a 4% takeout last summer, prefering instead to "figure out" how to beat a 16-20% takeout elsewhere.

--Dunbar

[brockguy]

With so many years of stability in the Breeders Cup, you have just so many changes over the past number of years that it has gotten a bit crazy. I suppose most people are thinking what the hell have they got in store for next year??

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Dunbar

I would have agreed with this before observing how racing fans showed very little enthusiasm when presented with the opportunity to bet with a 4% takeout last summer, prefering instead to "figure out" how to beat a 16-20% takeout elsewhere.

--Dunbar

I couldn't blame anyone for not betting Ellis Park if they offered free bets. Even though a lot of fans read the form and dont really know what they are doing, at least they can read unlike the vast majority of the NASCAR fan base (sorry Cajun and Slotdirt)

[letswastemoney]

If they did that 4% takeout thing at a major circuit track (SA, Hol, Bel, Churchill), I believe it would work. I just don't like Ellis cards because I'm not familiar with the horses or the jockey and trainer patterns.

[Payson Dave]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I couldn't blame anyone for not betting Ellis Park if they offered free bets. Even though a lot of fans read the form and dont really know what they are doing, at least they can read unlike the vast majority of the NASCAR fan base (sorry Cajun and Slotdirt)

Cajun is really good at looking at the pictures though

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by AeWingnut

aim high shoot low

are these mythical new fans going to take a day off to experience their first race?

There can only be one reason why it's Fri-sat and not Sat-Sun and that's ESPN. You know ESPN isn't going to sacrifice their NFL primtetime pre-game and everything else they do to show horse racing. I bet the BC would love to do Sat-Sun if allowed to.

And considering everything else they (BC) have done, that's the least of the worries I think.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by GBBob

There can only be one reason why it's Fri-sat and not Sat-Sun and that's ESPN. You know ESPN isn't going to sacrifice their NFL primtetime pre-game and everything else they do to show horse racing. I bet the BC would love to do Sat-Sun if allowed to.

And considering everything else they (BC) have done, that's the least of the worries I think.

And why should ESPN want to bump NFL for horse racing? Have you seen the ratings for horse racing over the years? They can't even pull a bigger audience than the Kenosha County Tractor Pulling Championships. The damn National Spelling Bee probably gets higher ratings. Going to Sunday would KILL the BC. Believe that.

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

And why should ESPN want to bump NFL for horse racing? Have you seen the ratings for horse racing over the years? They can't even pull a bigger audience than the Kenosha County Tractor Pulling Championships. The damn National Spelling Bee probably gets higher ratings. Going to Sunday would KILL the BC. Believe that.

Kenosha County? Impressive local knowledge

I'm still not sure a Sunday prime time, even against the NFL wouldn't do better numbers than a Friday matinee like we have now.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by GBBob

Kenosha County? Impressive local knowledge

I'm still not sure a Sunday prime time, even against the NFL wouldn't do better numbers than a Friday matinee like we have now.

It wouldn't even be close.

The fans that are racing fans that want to watch will still watch. That's not going to change. Hell, we watched Curlin run on a Thursday morning from Dubai. We'll watch some Friday races. I personally would rather have the day split up than have 14 races on one day with 30-45 minutes between races. I'd like them to go back to just the original seven but since that's not going to happen, I like Fri-Sat much better than Sat-Sun.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

It wouldn't even be close.

The fans that are racing fans that want to watch will still watch. That's not going to change. Hell, we watched Curlin run on a Thursday morning from Dubai. We'll watch some Friday races. I personally would rather have the day split up than have 14 races on one day with 30-45 minutes between races. I'd like them to go back to just the original seven but since that's not going to happen, I like Fri-Sat much better than Sat-Sun.

no, WE didn't. you did, others did, but as a collective, we didn't all watch him.


at least, i didn't. i was at work. don't you people work?!

[hurricanefrank]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I'd like them to go back to just the original seven but since that's not going to happen, I like Fri-Sat much better than Sat-Sun.

hear hear!