Arlignton Poly

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

JJP hit the nail on the head. Why in the world would Southern California, with some of the best weather in the world, need an all weather surface? The whole thing is becoming a joke, much like most of the races on the stuff.

west coast tracks were notoriously tough on horses--the surfaces were too hard. whether it was the location, weather, or what....take note of how many less euros shipped to the bc when it was in cali. i remember the months leading up to the last time it was held out west. everyone was complaining, they didn't want to ship out there and compete on that track. remember that mineshaft retired rather than go out there? no one liked the surfaces out there.
mandella won half the card that day--he had a homefield advantage.

[cmorioles]

Clearly, less Euro horses shipped to California because of the much longer journey and the warm weather. Most are turf horses anyway, so I don't think the surface had a whole lot to do with it.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Clearly, less Euro horses shipped to California because of the much longer journey and the warm weather. Most are turf horses anyway, so I don't think the surface had a whole lot to do with it.

not just euros, a lot of east coasters didn't want to go. they didn't like the track, and how hard it was. euro turfers generally don't do well, altho this was the year high chaparral and johar dead-heated. but it was only the cali connections who were happy to have the bc out there that year.
next year will be the first time on an artificial surface for the bc, i guess we'll see how it plays out...but i'm thinking you'll see more attendance by euros. after all, if for some reason the races get rained off, they won't have shipped all that way to scratch, they'll have a familiar surface to run on.

don't get me wrong tho, i'm 'old school' and was not thrilled to see dirt decried and replaced. but it's there now, so i just hope they get it RIGHT.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Danzig

not just euros, a lot of east coasters didn't want to go. they didn't like the track, and how hard it was. euro turfers generally don't do well, altho this was the year high chaparral and johar dead-heated. but it was only the cali connections who were happy to have the bc out there that year.next year will be the first time on an artificial surface for the bc, i guess we'll see how it plays out...but i'm thinking you'll see more attendance by euros. after all, if for some reason the races get rained off, they won't have shipped all that way to scratch, they'll have a familiar surface to run on.

don't get me wrong tho, i'm 'old school' and was not thrilled to see dirt decried and replaced. but it's there now, so i just hope they get it RIGHT.

U are kidding right? The Europeans dominated the turf racing that year. Six Perfections won the Mile, Islington led a sweep in the F/M Turf and in addition to High Chaparral dead heating for the win in the Turf, Falbrav ran third.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

U are kidding right? The Europeans dominated the turf racing that year. Six Perfections won the Mile, Islington led a sweep in the F/M Turf and in addition to High Chaparral dead heating for the win in the Turf, Falbrav ran third.

no, i was saying they weren't happy with it being out there with the heat, and the hard track. i know who won it. don't you remember the weeks leading up to the bc, when a lot over there were saying they weren't coming? you think johar could have dead-heated with HC any where else?!

[JJP]

Getting back to the comment that Americans are always complaining or whining or whatever was said, it should be pointed out comparing our synthetic racing to Europe's is ridiculous.

We Americans were "sold" on the idea that this would be dirt racing, just safer. The Euros had nothing to compare it to, since they've never had conventional dirt. They were getting a chance to race in the winter, when they wouldn't otherwise. We've had winter racing here for years. And while Poly makes sense for a mostly winter track like Turfway, its plain stupid for tracks like Santa Anita and Keeneland to have it. Almost all the horses with 5 or more races here have established dirt form. When you see a horse like Sun Boat become a graded stakes winner on dirt, or Student Council absolutely bury Lava Man, you know there's something wrong. Its not just the running styles that people don't like; its the lack of transferability of conventional dirt form to synth that is bizarre. And while the strong acceleration of early speedballs and deep closers were admired, it appears those styles will give way to the "preferred" one-paced grinding style that wins so many synth races.

Give me Mountaineer, Ellis, Hawthorne any day over the carpet tracks.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by JJP

Getting back to the comment that Americans are always complaining or whining or whatever was said, it should be pointed out comparing our synthetic racing to Europe's is ridiculous.

We Americans were "sold" on the idea that this would be dirt racing, just safer. The Euros had nothing to compare it to, since they've never had conventional dirt. They were getting a chance to race in the winter, when they wouldn't otherwise. We've had winter racing here for years. And while Poly makes sense for a mostly winter track like Turfway, its plain stupid for tracks like Santa Anita and Keeneland to have it. Almost all the horses with 5 or more races here have established dirt form. When you see a horse like Sun Boat become a graded stakes winner on dirt, or Student Council absolutely bury Lava Man, you know there's something wrong. Its not just the running styles that people don't like; its the lack of transferability of conventional dirt form to synth that is bizarre. And while the strong acceleration of early speedballs and deep closers were admired, it appears those styles will give way to the "preferred" one-paced grinding style that wins so many synth races.

Give me Mountaineer, Ellis, Hawthorne any day over the carpet tracks.

Is the safety and longevity of the horses of any concern to you?

[NoChanceToDance]

Originally Posted by JJP

Getting back to the comment that Americans are always complaining or whining or whatever was said, it should be pointed out comparing our synthetic racing to Europe's is ridiculous.

We Americans were "sold" on the idea that this would be dirt racing, just safer. The Euros had nothing to compare it to, since they've never had conventional dirt. They were getting a chance to race in the winter, when they wouldn't otherwise. We've had winter racing here for years. And while Poly makes sense for a mostly winter track like Turfway, its plain stupid for tracks like Santa Anita and Keeneland to have it. Almost all the horses with 5 or more races here have established dirt form. When you see a horse like Sun Boat become a graded stakes winner on dirt, or Student Council absolutely bury Lava Man, you know there's something wrong. Its not just the running styles that people don't like; its the lack of transferability of conventional dirt form to synth that is bizarre. And while the strong acceleration of early speedballs and deep closers were admired, it appears those styles will give way to the "preferred" one-paced grinding style that wins so many synth races.

Give me Mountaineer, Ellis, Hawthorne any day over the carpet tracks.

Now i know for sure, that these tracks aren't preparing these surfaces properly.

One thing that Poly is not is a surface that favours one paced horses.

This comment almost made me laugh.

What are these tracks doing to the poly out there???? Harrowing 2 feet deep?

[Scurlogue Champ]

Originally Posted by Danzig

no, i was saying they weren't happy with it being out there with the heat, and the hard track. i know who won it. don't you remember the weeks leading up to the bc, when a lot over there were saying they weren't coming? you think johar could have dead-heated with HC any where else?!

He could have dead heated with him at Delta Downs on the dirt probably. Anywhere else and he gets crushed.