So much for horses needing 4 to 5 weeks rest

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

Any excuse to name drop. LOL

You know me.

[Scurlogue Champ]

In Australia and England they run them every weekend or 14 days when they are on a campaign.

But don't be talking about that in America, those foreign trainers are just wrong.....

Makybe Diva won the Cox Plate at 1 1/4 miles and the Melbourne Cup at 2 miles 9 days apart when she was 7 years old.

[pmayjr]

I wish these owners and trainers of million dollar horses could agree to run their horses more often. Like the way it used to be. To me horses (at least on the high-end stakes level) are like Major League pitchers.

Eventhough they run less and less frequently, they still get hurt and come down with injuries... and subsequently get retired. Pitchers run on 5 days reast, and rotations are bigger so they don't have to throw as much... and yet pitchers still have the same arm problems.

So does the amount of rest ultimately help them, or does it work inversely? Maybe since horses don't run enough and pitchers don't pitch enough, they don't build up the proper endurance to get through these injuries??? Agree? Disagree? Apples and Oranges Cajun?

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by pmayjr

I wish these owners and trainers of million dollar horses could agree to run their horses more often. Like the way it used to be. To me horses (at least on the high-end stakes level) are like Major League pitchers.

Eventhough they run less and less frequently, they still get hurt and come down with injuries... and subsequently get retired. Pitchers run on 5 days reast, and rotations are bigger so they don't have to throw as much... and yet pitchers still have the same arm problems.

So does the amount of rest ultimately help them, or does it work inversely? Maybe since horses don't run enough and pitchers don't pitch enough, they don't build up the proper endurance to get through these injuries??? Agree? Disagree? Apples and Oranges Cajun?

I think the attitude needs to change from "my horse can't lose if he doesn't race" to "my horse can't win if he doesn't race".

[Scurlogue Champ]

horses can race into condition instead of popping off 12 .48 second works before a start.

bullshit is what it is

[Riot]

Originally Posted by moodwalker

In Australia and England they run them every weekend or 14 days when they are on a campaign.But don't be talking about that in America, those foreign trainers are just wrong.....Makybe Diva won the Cox Plate at 1 1/4 miles and the Melbourne Cup at 2 miles 9 days apart when she was 7 years old.

True, but they also seem to get time off back at the farm. Here everyone wants to seem to race year-round.

How many US horses in training get to leave the track (if not injured) and get let down, then get brought back into training the next year?

[Scurlogue Champ]

Originally Posted by Riot

True, but they also seem to get time off back at the farm. Here everyone wants to seem to race year-round.

How many US horses in training get to leave the track (if not injured) and get let down, then get brought back into training the next year?

Time in the paddock is invaluable to a race horse in my opinion. I completely agree.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Riot

True, but they also seem to get time off back at the farm. Here everyone wants to seem to race year-round.

How many US horses in training get to leave the track (if not injured) and get let down, then get brought back into training the next year?

Plenty do but it doesn't effect the way they are campaigned when they do come back. Actually the horses that stay in training tend to be the ones raced more frequently even when the horses that had their vacation come back.

[Scurlogue Champ]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Plenty do but it doesn't effect the way they are campaigned when they do come back. Actually the horses that stay in training tend to be the ones raced more frequently even when the horses that had their vacation come back.

I suspect it is because most vacations are taken out of necessity (injury), not just letting the horse down.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by moodwalker

I suspect it is because most vacations are taken out of necessity (injury), not just letting the horse down.

No, I'm thinking of stakes horses the past couple years that have been given a break all winter. Most of the top stakes horses that don't go to Dubai wait until May or June to comeback. Then they wind up making four or five starts the rest of the year if they are lucky. The horses that stay in training that stay healthy wind up racing more than 4 or 5 times from May on despite never getting a vacation. In the case of Sun King I highly doubt he will race anymore between May and October than he did last year despite getting the winter off this year and staying in training last year.

[Riot]

Think it is more of a matter of "work" them up to a race, rather than race them into shape in the US?

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

No, I'm thinking of stakes horses the past couple years that have been given a break all winter. Most of the top stakes horses that don't go to Dubai wait until May or June to comeback. Then they wind up making four or five starts the rest of the year if they are lucky. The horses that stay in training that stay healthy wind up racing more than 4 or 5 times from May on despite never getting a vacation. In the case of Sun King I highly doubt he will race anymore between May and October than he did last year despite getting the winter off this year and staying in training last year.

Back in the days of Secretariat and Forego, major racing on the East Coast was over in early November (Aqueduct ran to the end of the month, but the big races were earlier). Hollywood Park had no fall meeting except for trotters, Oak Tree was oriented towards turf horses and late-developing 2yos. Most horses who had been part of championship-type campaigns got at least a couple of months off, often more - Secretariat didn't come back until March of his 3yo year (still got in 3 races before the Derby, spaced at 2 weeks, the typical spacing for the time). Others showed up at Hialeah or Santa Anita in mid-January. Late starters, like Majestic Prince who didn't debut until November (I think) at Bay Meadows ran consistently through the winter and spring.

Only the rare horse could keep racing through the fall and winter and still be competitive in the spring classics, horses like my hero Jim French, a gritty little horse who thrived on racing. If only Canonero's plane had gotten stuck a bit longer, Jim-boy would have won the Kentucky Derby, since he ran second to the Venezuelan shipper.

[Pedigree Ann]

Originally Posted by moodwalker

In Australia and England they run them every weekend or 14 days when they are on a campaign.

But don't be talking about that in America, those foreign trainers are just wrong.....

Makybe Diva won the Cox Plate at 1 1/4 miles and the Melbourne Cup at 2 miles 9 days apart when she was 7 years old.

And the highest finishing Aussie-based horse Maybe Better (third to the two Japanese runners) in last year's Melbourne Cup had qualified to get in by winning a race the Saturday before the Tuesday of the Cup. That's a 12.5f race THREE DAYS before a 2 mile race. Or course, the Cup was the culmination of the spring carnival for older horses and Maybe Better was spelled afterward.

[Payson Dave]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

You know me.

Tell Maxine and Carlos that I said Hi...

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Payson Dave

Tell Maxine and Carlos that I said Hi...

I'm not in Florida. I only see Carlos in NY these days.

[cmorioles]

Every single study I've ever done shows that the sooner a horse comes back off of a good performance, the better they perform. This whole bounce thing is a bit perplexing, and usually just gives trainers another excuse they didn't previously have at their disposal. It seems to have replaced my personal favorite, "the track was cuppy".

[TheSpyder]

Why don't they have races that are handicapped for time off. For example, if you run 7-14 days since your last race you get 10 pounds off, 14 -21 days - zero, 21-48 add 10 pounds, 48-96 - add 20 pounds etc.??