What's Wrong With This Picture?

King Glorious · #1 10-06-2009, 11:35 PM

Technically, a horse from Canada can come down here and never win a race in the United States and still win an Eclipse award but if an American goes up there and wins the Sky Classic and the Canadian International, he can't win a Sovereign award. How much sense does that make? How much sense does it make that in 1996 Singspiel won the Canadian International, never won a single race in the US, and won the Eclipse but not a Sovereign?

Bigsmc · #2 10-07-2009, 04:39 AM

If a tree falls in a forest and nobody is there to hear it, does it make a sound?

Discussing Eclipse Awards is like beating your head against a wall. Now you want to introduce the Soverign Awards into the equation?

Danzig · #3 10-07-2009, 06:27 AM

you have to have a minimum number of starts to qualify for the sovereign. not a bad idea, and something that should be considered for eclipse voting.

Monarchos1 · #4 10-07-2009, 07:16 AM

Three starts in Canada are required to win a Sovereign Award. I agree with the basic concept of minimum starts, though I think it is unfortunate that Careless Jewel will be ineligible this year because of the 3-start minimum.

GPK · #5 10-07-2009, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigsmc

If a tree falls in a forest and nobody is there to hear it, does it make a sound?

Discussing Eclipse Awards is like beating your head against a wall. Now you want to introduce the Soverign Awards into the equation?

Right, because anyone with half a brain knows that Icon Project is the greatest horse in the world and already has HOY wrapped up.

Indian Charlie · #6 10-07-2009, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigsmc

If a tree falls in a forest and nobody is there to hear it, does it make a sound?

Discussing Eclipse Awards is like beating your head against a wall. Now you want to introduce the Soverign Awards into the equation?

Or, as my local goat milk soap farmer/producer says:

"If a man says something in the forest but there's no woman around to hear him, is he still wrong?"

GPK · #7 10-07-2009, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Or, as my local goat milk soap farmer/producer says:

"If a man says something in the forest but there's no woman around to hear him, is he still wrong?"

I can tell you from experience, yes, he is still wrong.

Indian Charlie · #8 10-07-2009, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GPK

I can tell you from experience, yes, he is still wrong.

Well, yeah, that's a given.

parsixfarms · #9 10-07-2009, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cardus

You'd think that since NAFTA was enacted, this situation would not exist. The rule should be the same in each country.

What do we do with those starts at Caliente?

Riot · #10 10-07-2009, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Technically, a horse from Canada can come down here and never win a race in the United States and still win an Eclipse award but if an American goes up there and wins the Sky Classic and the Canadian International, he can't win a Sovereign award. How much sense does that make? How much sense does it make that in 1996 Singspiel won the Canadian International, never won a single race in the US, and won the Eclipse but not a Sovereign?

I say we invade Canada, and fight for the right of foreign horses to win Canadian awards!

King Glorious · #11 10-07-2009, 01:51 PM

The point was that the Canadians have it right as far as awarding championships. America needs to change their rules. As they currently are, it's just too vague and leaves too much too individual interpretation. Should they be for American based horses only? Should you have to have the majority of your starts here? Should there be a higher minimum number of starts? When a horse can win a title in one country while never winning a race in that country, something's wrong with the system. I feel that when it comes time to vote, a voter should ask themselves two very simple questions:

1-Who is the best horse to run in that division that year? Not most times in this country or most grade one wins or most historical achievements or weight carried or number of tracks run on. Who is the BEST horse? Period. After they answer that question, ask the second one

1-Is that horse eligible to win the award? If he's the best and he's eligible, he should get the vote.

End of story.

Riot · #12 10-07-2009, 01:53 PM

I agree that Eclipse Awards should highlight American soil racing. Perhaps like 'Zig said, minimum number starts to be considered.

King Glorious · #13 10-07-2009, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot

I agree that Eclipse Awards should highlight American soil racing. Perhaps like 'Zig said, minimum number starts to be considered.

I think it should not only be considered, it should be adopted. I'd say four starts minimum in this country. And make them the United States racing awards, not North American. Singspiel should never have won an Eclipse here without winning a race in the United States.

Indian Charlie · #14 10-07-2009, 02:01 PM

And add on that they must be born and bred here in the good ol' US of A!!

Cannon Shell · #15 10-07-2009, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

The point was that the Canadians have it right as far as awarding championships. America needs to change their rules. As they currently are, it's just too vague and leaves too much too individual interpretation. Should they be for American based horses only? Should you have to have the majority of your starts here? Should there be a higher minimum number of starts? When a horse can win a title in one country while never winning a race in that country, something's wrong with the system. I feel that when it comes time to vote, a voter should ask themselves two very simple questions:

1-Who is the best horse to run in that division that year? Not most times in this country or most grade one wins or most historical achievements or weight carried or number of tracks run on. Who is the BEST horse? Period. After they answer that question, ask the second one

1-Is that horse eligible to win the award? If he's the best and he's eligible, he should get the vote.

End of story.

The point you may have missed about the Soverign Awards or Canadian racing in general is that they only have 1 major track, Woodbine.

Plus why do people care so much about these awards anyway?

Cannon Shell · #16 10-07-2009, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot

I agree that Eclipse Awards should highlight American soil racing. Perhaps like 'Zig said, minimum number starts to be considered.

There is a minimum number already. One.

MISTERGEE · #17 10-07-2009, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

And add on that they must be born and bred here in the good ol' US of A!!

Yes, and I just ate a hot dog, had a slice of apple pie, and will drive home in my chevy to watch baseball