Stewards- Country Star

[philcski]

Thought the stewards absolutely made the wrong decision on today's 7th race. Country Star was weaving through the stretch like a drunken sailor, and caused interference with both the 2nd AND 3rd place finishers, yet they left her up. I hate to be cynical but it smells to me like they were 'playing favorites' with the connections, if it had not been Frankel/Stonerside I think they rightfully take her down.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by philcski

Thought the stewards absolutely made the wrong decision on today's 7th race. Country Star was weaving through the stretch like a drunken sailor, and caused interference with both the 2nd AND 3rd place finishers, yet they left her up. I hate to be cynical but it smells to me like they were 'playing favorites' with the connections, if it had not been Frankel/Stonerside I think they rightfully take her down.

I thought she was definitely erratic, but it was a tough call since she never really touched anyone.

What a terrible bet that mediocre horse was at 4-5 though. Pissed me off that she managed to win, as I played a Pick 3 specifically for the purpose of beating her.. Had the second and third place finishers and that overhyped rat manages to hold on.

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

I thought she was definitely erratic, but it was a tough call since she never really touched anyone.

What a terrible bet that mediocre horse was at 4-5 though. Pissed me off that she managed to win, as I played a Pick 3 specifically for the purpose of beating her.. Had the second and third place finishers and that overhyped rat manages to hold on.

i would have never bet her, but why try to beat her ? why not sit it out ? she was clearly the most likely winner, was obviously a short horse, getting a race in for something much bigger, and still managed to win.

[3kings]

Originally Posted by hrfan

i would have never bet her, but why try to beat her ? why not sit it out ? she was clearly the most likely winner, was obviously a short horse, getting a race in for something much bigger, and still managed to win.

You stated yourself she was probably short and pointed for something bigger. Isn't that enough of a reason to try to beat her in P3's. She seemed vulnerable and if she doesn't win, the multi-race wagers should pay very well.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by hrfan

i would have never bet her, but why try to beat her ? why not sit it out ? she was clearly the most likely winner, was obviously a short horse, getting a race in for something much bigger, and still managed to win.

Really? What exactly made her 'clearly the most likely winner'? She wasn't the fastest horse in the race on grass, and the move to turf reeked of desperation. She was a complete bet-against at 4-5.

It's also laughable that you think she was 'obviously a short horse'. Four five-furlong breezes in 24 days, and Frankel's horses hardly ever 'need a race'.. Doesn't sound like an 'obvious' short horse to me.

Sooner or later, people might have to stop making excuses for this filly and come to grips with the possibility that she's just not very fast.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Really? What exactly made her 'clearly the most likely winner'? She wasn't the fastest horse in the race on grass, and the move to turf reeked of desperation. She was a complete bet-against at 4-5.

It's also laughable that you think she was 'obviously a short horse'. Four five-furlong breezes in 24 days, and Frankel's horses hardly ever 'need a race'.. Doesn't sound like an 'obvious' short horse to me.

Sooner or later, people might have to stop making excuses for this filly and come to grips with the possibility that she's just not very fast.

I think you're REALLY jumping to conclusions here. If you want to accuse her of being babied, pampered, or fragile then I'm with you. However, she hasn't been given enough time to prove herself "fast" on conventional dirt. She hasn't even made a start on fast dirt!

She's pointing to the Gazelle and perhaps she'll be grossly exposed there, especially with Music Note pointing to the same place. I can tell you that the Stonerside people really think a lot of her and have since Day 1.

NT

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

She's pointing to the Gazelle and perhaps she'll be grossly exposed there, especially with Music Note pointing to the same place. I can tell you that the Stonerside people really think a lot of her and have since Day 1.

NT

Yup

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I think you're REALLY jumping to conclusions here. If you want to accuse her of being babied, pampered, or fragile then I'm with you. However, she hasn't been given enough time to prove herself "fast" on conventional dirt. She hasn't even made a start on fast dirt!

She's pointing to the Gazelle and perhaps she'll be grossly exposed there, especially with Music Note pointing to the same place. I can tell you that the Stonerside people really think a lot of her and have since Day 1.

NT

Wait a minute, so telling people to CONSIDER that she MIGHT not be very fast is 'REALLY jumping to conclusions'? Hmmm, I disagree. I'd say that calling her 'clearly the most likely winner' today and an 'obvious short horse' sounds a lot more like conclusion-jumping.

Stonerside can think whatever they want about her, all I know is what I see, and what I've seen is SIX STRAIGHT mediocre-to-lousy races from her. Maybe she'll end up a good horse on fast dirt, but until then, I don't think it's outlandish to SUGGEST that she's not very fast.. Talk about sensitive.

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Really? What exactly made her 'clearly the most likely winner'? She wasn't the fastest horse in the race on grass, and the move to turf reeked of desperation. She was a complete bet-against at 4-5.

It's also laughable that you think she was 'obviously a short horse'. Four five-furlong breezes in 24 days, and Frankel's horses hardly ever 'need a race'.. Doesn't sound like an 'obvious' short horse to me.

Sooner or later, people might have to stop making excuses for this filly and come to grips with the possibility that she's just not very fast.

shes a good horse, better then most now a days

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by hrfan

shes a good horse, better then most now a days

What do you base this on?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by hrfan

shes a good horse, better then most now a days

She is almost as good as Pebbles

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bcX2...eature=related

[philcski]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Really? What exactly made her 'clearly the most likely winner'? She wasn't the fastest horse in the race on grass, and the move to turf reeked of desperation. She was a complete bet-against at 4-5.

It's also laughable that you think she was 'obviously a short horse'. Four five-furlong breezes in 24 days, and Frankel's horses hardly ever 'need a race'.. Doesn't sound like an 'obvious' short horse to me.

Sooner or later, people might have to stop making excuses for this filly and come to grips with the possibility that she's just not very fast.

I agree with you completely on this one, regardless of the results of today. Today's race was horribly slow, especially considering a bunch of no-talent 35K N2L's went 1.3 seconds faster. However, it doesn't change that the stewards were once again inconsistent in their decisionmaking today, where a horse that has intefered with others and possibly (likely?) affected the outcome and didn't get taken down.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

I thought she was definitely erratic, but it was a tough call since she never really touched anyone.

What a terrible bet that mediocre horse was at 4-5 though. Pissed me off that she managed to win, as I played a Pick 3 specifically for the purpose of beating her.. Had the second and third place finishers and that overhyped rat manages to hold on.

There is no rule saying that you actually have to touch or make contact. Intimidation or failure to maintain a straight course to the detriment of others is in most rules books. Of course there are not that many stewards that ever bother to read the rule book...

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by philcski

Thought the stewards absolutely made the wrong decision on today's 7th race. Country Star was weaving through the stretch like a drunken sailor, and caused interference with both the 2nd AND 3rd place finishers, yet they left her up. I hate to be cynical but it smells to me like they were 'playing favorites' with the connections, if it had not been Frankel/Stonerside I think they rightfully take her down.

The question is rarely whether they fouled, it's usually whether they think somebody else would have won if they didn't get fouled. My opinion is she wasn't gunna get beat. She had quite a bit left(Frankel's usually do....I know what Joey was trying to do, but Frankel is usually simply a bully in this particular type of spot.) That's why I can't wait for this guy to retire. Loves to bring in this comebacking fresh chalk. Not exactly entertaining stuff. He's never really understood that this is supposed to be entertainment, but that's just my opinion.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

The question is rarely whether they fouled, it's usually whether they think somebody else would have won if they didn't get fouled. My opinion is she wasn't gunna get beat. She had quite a bit left(Frankel's usually do....I know what Joey was trying to do, but Frankel is usually simply a bully in this particular type of spot.) That's why I can't wait for this guy to retire. Loves to bring in this comebacking fresh chalk. Not exactly entertaining stuff. He's never really understood that this is supposed to be entertainment, but that's just my opinion.

Frankel will retire when he croaks. I am not sure how his winning with short priced horses off of a layoff undermines the entertainment factor. I suppose if he intentionally stiffed them a few times it would be more entertaining. what is this pro wrestling?

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Frankel will retire when he croaks. I am not sure how his winning with short priced horses off of a layoff undermines the entertainment factor. I suppose if he intentionally stiffed them a few times it would be more entertaining. what is this pro wrestling?

Well, I can't explain to a trainer how boring this is for fans, because trainers get 10% of the 1st place money. It's not boring to you guys. It makes for a pretty useless race for us. One guy said pass the race. I would say pass the race. Joey tried to beat the Frankel, and lost. Your attitude is typical of trainers. They don't care if racing is that competitive. Short uncompetitive fields are in your best interest. Large competitive fields are in our best interest. Frankel's been jamming this chalk down people's throats in these bully situations forever. He is no friend of those wanting good competitive racing(again I don't expect you to care if the racing is very competitive.) Trainers n' fans have highly differing self interests.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Well, I can't explain to a trainer how boring this is for fans, because trainers get 10% of the 1st place money. It's not boring to you guys. It makes for a pretty useless race for us. One guy said pass the race. I would say pass the race. Joey tried to beat the Frankel, and lost. Your attitude is typical of trainers. They don't care if racing is that competitive. Short uncompetitive fields are in your best interest. Large competitive fields are in our best interest. Frankel's been jamming this chalk down people's throats in these bully situations forever. He is no friend of those wanting good competitive racing(again I don't expect you to care if the racing is very competitive.) Trainers n' fans have highly differing self interests.

This is not your best work. First of all Trainers are trying to win, it isnt our job to make races competitive just as it isnt the head coaches job to make a game that is a blow out closer so it will be more interesting for the fans. Secondly these races are the BEST races to bet as an over-hyped horse with a consistently over bet trainer in a tough situation is a great bet against especially because you are getting greater value on the other runners. Frankel probably wins 30% of the time in these situations and is probably over bet 80% of the time. You do the math.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

This is not your best work. First of all Trainers are trying to win, it isnt our job to make races competitive just as it isnt the head coaches job to make a game that is a blow out closer so it will be more interesting for the fans. Secondly these races are the BEST races to bet as an over-hyped horse with a consistently over bet trainer in a tough situation is a great bet against especially because you are getting greater value on the other runners. Frankel probably wins 30% of the time in these situations and is probably over bet 80% of the time. You do the math.

In this particular type of class-break situation(stakes winner in a optional claimer,) the chance of beating him is not as you say. I wish it was. It really is a useless race. Can't wait until he is out of the game(this type of race is why.) A trainer can't relate.

[Linny]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Well, I can't explain to a trainer how boring this is for fans, because trainers get 10% of the 1st place money. It's not boring to you guys. It makes for a pretty useless race for us. One guy said pass the race. I would say pass the race. Joey tried to beat the Frankel, and lost. Your attitude is typical of trainers. They don't care if racing is that competitive. Short uncompetitive fields are in your best interest. Large competitive fields are in our best interest. Frankel's been jamming this chalk down people's throats in these bully situations forever. He is no friend of those wanting good competitive racing(again I don't expect you to care if the racing is very competitive.) Trainers n' fans have highly differing self interests.

Yeah, Frankel needs to start being a bad trainer and losing races so horseplayers can see competitive races. As Chuck says, it's not the trainers' roles to create a "fun betting race" for the bettors.
The filly damn near lost, it was a pretty contentious stretch run, the better horse won. She's a G1 winning filly in a NW2x for a trainer who's about 30% off the layoff. Trying to beat her makes sense if you are more afraid of being accused of being a chalk eating weasel than of tearing up tickets.
If you think she's a vulnerable fave, bet against but when she beats you it's moronic to scream about how bad she was.
It goes without saying that trainers and players have different interests. Trainers make money by running against "lesser" stock than their own.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

He looks for incredibly soft spots more than most. Could find a baby's soft spot in 1.5 seconds. They all do it, but this guy lives for it. It's crappy for the game. Bad race. Delay...Frankel Delay....A competitive race will follow after this one. We appreciate your understanding, and interesting betting races will resume shortly.