You have to watch "The Hustler"

then check out the magazine of the same name that arose from it.

"Money won is twice as sweet as money earned"....

"There's been a mistake, I want my money back!" (I think said in a Scottish accent)

'Byzantine' was a word thought up by 16th Century historians to describe the Roman Empire that remained after the 4th Century loss of the western provinces. The capitol of the empire had been moved by Constantine the Great to a new city named in his honor near the site of an earlier Greek city of Byzantium, which is where the historians got the idea.

Most people have the idea that the Empire was 'Greek' in nature, because it eventually became Greek-speaking (Latin was the official language up until the 7th Century) but in fact many people of influence and in the bureaucracy moved to Constantinople from Rome when the government moved. Greek was the language of the Church at Constantine's time (the New Testament books were originally written in Greek) and it was the 'lingua franca' of the Eastern Mediterranean, so it eventually took over.

As the centuries went on, the bureaucracy of the Empire became more and more complex and inpenetrable, while court etiquette became more and more intricate. To the simple barbarians from the western tradition, the whole thing was baffling in the extreme. Hence the term 'Byzantine' to describe anything full of needless complexity, as well as suggesting a certain amount of intrigue - those unmanly Eastern Romans preferred diplomacy to heroic, manly combat to settle disputes!

Your history lesson for the day.

Any day, when stuck at work, one can read references to "The Cincinnati Kid", "The Hustler", and "The Sting" is a great day.

A quote like "bite me andrew" only makes it more enjoyable!!

Gleason was so perfect as the "Fat Man". The elegance he shows in moving around the table, the smallest inflections of his boidy and voice...

George C. Scott, top of his game from the first frame to the last

The anguish on Newman's face when he loks at the cast on his thumb and hand.

and let us not go into McQueen, Karl Malden and Edward G. in "The Kid" or the entire cast of "The Sting".

Byzantine - Yeah Baby!

this may be a stupid question.

If someone has both horses that dead heat in a pick 4, do they get the P4payout twice?

Yes, but ... see the other thread under that race, or turn on ATR right now!

Or, read Steve's Derby Trail front page editorial.

yes i read steve's editorial... that is where I formed the question from!! It sucks for whomever had turf war.