Not the under attack? Because that's literally what happened.

It's interesting reading the arguments.

Half the time, when I do (read threads like these) I can appreciate it...the equivalent of listening to the great orators. Some of your arguments are pieces of art.

There are the other times though when I feel like well what does it matter? How does one say this was better than that? It's like choosing John or George... how exactly would that work when they were both brilliant yet so individual?

I loved Commentator. I guess it was the Met Mile that I was at the track for (out here, not there) and my friend was such a huge fan... a perfectly well-adjusted and reasonable woman who turned into well... like some lady at a Baptist Church getting all into it and "getting happy" as I think it's called... man she was screaming COME ON SON! COME ON SON! and as she did she swung her enormous purse around like she was possessed. At one point a corner of it nailed me in the face...my lip was bleeding but who cares he was winning haha!

After Divine Park ruined our day she looked at me and pointed out that my lip was bleeding. (No. Really?).

I can't count the number of times we would go to see Lava Man run.

The way I remember it he was one of two horses that electrified the crowd the most (the other wasn't Zenyatta it was Rock Hard Ten. Maybe it was a different kind of crowd in the space of a few years or something.... who knows.).

NIck you are far too nice to be mean :p so I will point out that 1. when you post this refrain it feels very Greek Chorus to me and 2. doesn't the fact that you remember it say something about it? I mean in a positive way?

I think it has a little to do with the geography, at times, cause I'll tell you if you were there that day? It didn't matter where you were or who you were... Lava Man was all that mattered. Everyone was behind that horse and the kind of anticipation that day? The build up to the race and then the actual race itself?

Vic's emotional call matched the day, reflected the day, represented everyone who was there... the way his voice cracked and the simultaneous joy and relief ... I just think if you had been there you'd hear it in the context of the day and might appreciate it a little more. :)

Anyway I did love both horses and don't really care who was better.

I think the two of them share beloved status by their vast numbers of fans and so the whole argument is a bit silly.

So I've got Commentator's record vs open stakes company as 15-5-1-4 if my math is correct?

All time great...

And Perfect Drift's 2003 year, which was far better than any year Commentator put together, was conveniently left off NTamm's PPs.

And I'll assume, because I've clearly lost my mind, that in Commentator's best years, 2005 and 2008, that they did not have a Breeder's Cup, because I don't see them on his PPs?

I never said that Perfect Drift was better.

Money won is important. It's certainly not the only important factor but it is an important factor. I don't know how a person could compare two horses and not use money won as one of things you would look at. You obviously can't look at money won if you are comparing a modern horse with a horse from 60 years ago, but if you are comparing two horses that ran in the same general time frame then I would certainly look at it. I would say money won and number of graded stakes wins would be two of the most important things.

That being said, I would still probably pick Ghostzapper as the best horse in the US in the last 15 years. He made $3.4 million, won 6 graded stakes races including 4 grade I races. He had 9 wins from 11 starts. His career wasn't that long but he was spectacular. And he easily won what was probably the deepest field in terms of talent in the BC Classic when he beat Roses in May and Pleasantly Perfect.


Curlin was a great horse. I would put him in the top 5 or so best horses in the US in the last 15 years.

Hard Spun was better.

Agreed. Hard Spun was a beast.

Okay so clearly Perfect Drift and Lava Man are the arguing points. Maybe even throw Game On Dude in there. No one has argued the 9 other horses on my list, and that is only since 2003. How in the world is Commentator among the all-time greats if he might not even be among the top 10 since 2003 according to nearly everyone on here, which was my original point?

My post about Perfect Drift lacked his '03 running lines cause I could only screengrab so much. I'll post the rest tonight.

There's really only one person who has said that Commentator was an all-time great in this thread. Myself, and just about everyone else have offered that what Commentator lacked in durability he made up for in brilliance. He just didn't do it very often at all.

who in the world is calling commentator an all time great?

PG1985.

He would've been a SCARY good miler. One of my favorites. Absolutely crazy that 2 of my top 5 favorites are Porter owned. :o

It's kind of funny how Hard Spun went from an under appreciated speedster during his running days to a now somewhat overrated runner in peoples memories.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...rly-from-break

He's coming back early apparently. Sounds like Los Al Mile, then BCC. Not loving that. All those major 3yo graded stakes and he goes in one ungraded stake and into the Classic? He's not a delicate flower. Meh.

This is not true Nick. I said since 2000.

Probably would have turfed well.

Not in the conversation for best horses in the country...really? Grade 2 horses, the races they won and the figures they achieved strongly rebut that argument.

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985 View Post
I agree with one thing in that post. Commentator is one of the GOAT.


"one of the GOAT" now means "one of the 13 greatest since 2000?"

Well, duh.