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-   -   peegardn's college top 10 (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16776)

Cannon Shell 10-17-2007 10:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pgardn
I cant say the SEC is overrated when no other conference has the depth and quality they do. Name one conference that has the depth and quality of the SEC? Maybe just maybe the Pac-10 thats it. So you can call them overrated, but none of the other conferences come close.

If you answer the Big East I will throw up.

The Big 12 draws the vast majority of its players out of Texas. So the pool is diluted a great deal.

The Big 10 is still playing defense in 3rd gear, except for Ohio State.

The ACC has some really bad teams. But I would rate them below the Pac-10.

SEC... thats it. They get the best players from all of the southern states that are football crazed. From Florida to Texas.
Say what you will but the SEC teams are good but not much better than 30 other teams throughout the country. The fact that the SEC is bigger with 12 teams may lead to depth. Fact is that the gap is narrowing quickly.

pgardn 10-17-2007 11:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
Say what you will but the SEC teams are good but not much better than 30 other teams throughout the country. The fact that the SEC is bigger with 12 teams may lead to depth. Fact is that the gap is narrowing quickly.
In the Big 12 it leads to dilution of talent. Practically every team has kids from Texas. Oklahoma has over 50 % of its players from Texas. Nebraska used to have close to that (not anymore and they are bad). ATM, Texas Tech, Texas are almost all Texas.

Add TCU, SMU (not Big 12), Baylor, Oklahoma ST., Colorado (use to draw a lot more from Texas also) Even Kansas, Kansas ST. Missouri have a bunch of good players from Texas.
This was ONe reason that when Texas entered the Big 12 they entertained the idea of going to the Pac-10 first. Recruiting wars are ridiculous.

ARyan 10-17-2007 11:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
Louisville has beat Uk every year for a while, pounding the hell out of them on a couple occasions, and had them beat this year until a blown coverage in the final seconds. No excuse but they are clearly as good as UK. LSU is the best team in the country supposedly but I saw first hand how good they really are. Good team with a diverse offense and a lot of speed on defense. But I have no doubt that USF could give them fits and I have no questions that Louisville would put up 30 pts on them. The difference between the top 50 teams is not that great.

I think that the SEC is the single most overrated division or conference in sports. They are a good conference with a lot of good teams but they refuse to schedule tough non conferences teams, almost never on the road and when they do, often they lose. The SEC as a conference is 7-4 in non conference "legit" games. The only 11 games against teams that are semi legitimate they are 7-4, mostly in close games. ol miss escaped Memphis, UK went to the final minute against Louisville, Alabama held on against Houston, SC struggled with UNC...There are some mandated games left in which the SEC schools are far from locks . Ga Tech/GA, WV/Ol Miss, SC/Clemson, FL/FSU, Vandy/Wake are all games that could easily go in the favor of the non SEC team. In fact they will probably only be favored in 2 of them.

Of course the tradition and all that crap may matter to someone and certainly influences voters in the polls but the reality out on the field is that the SEC is not nearly as far ahead of everybody else as its boosters may realize.

The West is clearly stronger in the NBA, The AL is stronger in MLB, The AFC is much stronger in the NFL. The SEC is not nearly clearly better than the other major conferences, though the Big Ten appears to be a shell of its former self...
I can agree with you, I guess I am just not sold on the Big East, and on Rutgers and USF. As I said, does anyone remember Maryland in 2001, Tulane in 1998, Utah in 2004?

I think we both agree that the parity in College Football has grown to the point where no game is a guaranteed win for any top 50 vs. top 50 team. I enjoy that.

Cannon Shell 10-18-2007 12:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARyan
I can agree with you, I guess I am just not sold on the Big East, and on Rutgers and USF. As I said, does anyone remember Maryland in 2001, Tulane in 1998, Utah in 2004?

I think we both agree that the parity in College Football has grown to the point where no game is a guaranteed win for any top 50 vs. top 50 team. I enjoy that.
The difference is that Utah and Tulane are always going to be limited because of location and in Tulane case size of the school. Maryland has no excuse though they are a better program than Vandy or either of the Mississippi schools. The fact is Rutgers should be good. They are a rich state school sitting in the middle of a gold mine worth of talent. The coach they brought in has done a great job and looks like he is staying. USF is a relatively new school who has done nothing but improve. Plus they too are located in a area where the talent level is great. Add in the fact they play in a pro stadium and have a good coach...why wouldn't they be good? West Virginia is a good program with a good coach. Louisville may have lost its most important asset when Petrino left but have a high national profile and have done a great job of both keeping homegrown talent and getting kids from all over the country. Syracuse needs to make a change on the top but they could easily go back to being a good program . UConn only has been around in Division 1 for a few years but is already pretty good. Pitt has Wandstad, enough said.

hockey2315 10-18-2007 12:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
The difference is that Utah and Tulane are always going to be limited because of location and in Tulane case size of the school. Maryland has no excuse though they are a better program than Vandy or either of the Mississippi schools. The fact is Rutgers should be good. They are a rich state school sitting in the middle of a gold mine worth of talent. The coach they brought in has done a great job and looks like he is staying. USF is a relatively new school who has done nothing but improve. Plus they too are located in a area where the talent level is great. Add in the fact they play in a pro stadium and have a good coach...why wouldn't they be good? West Virginia is a good program with a good coach. Louisville may have lost its most important asset when Petrino left but have a high national profile and have done a great job of both keeping homegrown talent and getting kids from all over the country. Syracuse needs to make a change on the top but they could easily go back to being a good program . UConn only has been around in Division 1 for a few years but is already pretty good. Pitt has Wandstad, enough said.
UConn will be like USF in a few years. . .

ddthetide 10-18-2007 06:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
The difference is that Utah and Tulane are always going to be limited because of location and in Tulane case size of the school. Maryland has no excuse though they are a better program than Vandy or either of the Mississippi schools. The fact is Rutgers should be good. They are a rich state school sitting in the middle of a gold mine worth of talent. The coach they brought in has done a great job and looks like he is staying. USF is a relatively new school who has done nothing but improve. Plus they too are located in a area where the talent level is great. Add in the fact they play in a pro stadium and have a good coach...why wouldn't they be good? West Virginia is a good program with a good coach. Louisville may have lost its most important asset when Petrino left but have a high national profile and have done a great job of both keeping homegrown talent and getting kids from all over the country. Syracuse needs to make a change on the top but they could easily go back to being a good program . UConn only has been around in Division 1 for a few years but is already pretty good. Pitt has Wandstad, enough said.
marylands problem right now, they can't keep the home grown kids. one of auburn's rb is from the eastern shore of md. sc, clemson and Alabama regularly have kids from the dc area. md was always famous for having the best del-ny-nj kids, outside of psu. those kids are not coming to md anymore. the acc needs md to get better.
wvu and a couple other schools in the big east have an advantage in entrance test scores. they can take kids with test scores that can't qualify for other schools. wvu is also more inclined to take "questionable" kids.

Bigsmc 10-18-2007 07:05 AM
Interesting exercise in today's St. Pete Times. They asked Danny Sheridan and Bodog to set lines for USF playing the Top 15 at a neutral site. These are lines as they relate to USF. Favored over both ACC schools hmmmmmmmmmm.

Code:
                  Sheridan            Bodog
OSU                +8                  +13
BC                  -2                    -3
LSU                +7                  +17
OU                  +8                  +13
USC                -1                  +1.5
UK                  -3.5                -1
ASU                -3                  +1.5
WVU                +6                  OFF
ORE                +2                    +2
VT                  -1                    -4
CAL                  +2                  +7
KAN                  -1                  -6.5
SOCAL              +2                  +14
UF                  +6                  +12

The Bid 10-18-2007 08:04 AM
Ohio State doesnt need points from a team that got beat by Stanford, however it is a nice gesture

Bigsmc 10-18-2007 12:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bid
Ohio State doesnt need points from a team that got beat by Stanford, however it is a nice gesture
Um Bid. Those odds are for USF against the teams down the left column. No OSU-USC odds there.

Mortimer 10-18-2007 12:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigsmc
Um Bid. Those odds are for USF against the teams down the left column. No OSU-USC odds there.

Why the disparity between the two linemakers?


Don't know BODOG. ....never thought supposedly well known linesmakers could be so far apart on a lot of those.

The Bid 10-18-2007 12:37 PM
I thought all the odds were against set if each team played USC

Of course we all know Ohio State would need points if that were the case. I should have known

Bigsmc 10-18-2007 01:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer
Why the disparity between the two linemakers?


Don't know BODOG. ....never thought supposedly well known linesmakers could be so far apart on a lot of those.
No clue Morty. They are quite far apart with some of them. BODOG is an offshore internet site.

Mortimer 10-18-2007 01:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigsmc
No clue Morty. They are quite far apart with some of them. BODOG is an offshore internet site.

Oh.





Thanks.......seems like somebody might not be doing so hot. You would think some agency would rate them over a year....they probably do.

Mortimer 10-18-2007 01:23 PM
OH MY GOD!!!






My spy name types!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

horseofcourse 10-18-2007 05:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
The difference is that Utah and Tulane are always going to be limited because of location and in Tulane case size of the school. Maryland has no excuse though they are a better program than Vandy or either of the Mississippi schools. The fact is Rutgers should be good. They are a rich state school sitting in the middle of a gold mine worth of talent. The coach they brought in has done a great job and looks like he is staying. USF is a relatively new school who has done nothing but improve. Plus they too are located in a area where the talent level is great. Add in the fact they play in a pro stadium and have a good coach...why wouldn't they be good? West Virginia is a good program with a good coach. Louisville may have lost its most important asset when Petrino left but have a high national profile and have done a great job of both keeping homegrown talent and getting kids from all over the country. Syracuse needs to make a change on the top but they could easily go back to being a good program . UConn only has been around in Division 1 for a few years but is already pretty good. Pitt has Wandstad, enough said.
I think Schiano will be the next Penn State coach whenever JoePa decides to step down...be it 2 years, 4 years or 19 years if he wants to try to coach into triple digits. He'll stay at Rutgers until then. I could be wrong, but I thought I heard some rumors regarding that scenario.

Cannon Shell 10-18-2007 05:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by horseofcourse
I think Schiano will be the next Penn State coach whenever JoePa decides to step down...be it 2 years, 4 years or 19 years if he wants to try to coach into triple digits. He'll stay at Rutgers until then. I could be wrong, but I thought I heard some rumors regarding that scenario.
I doubt Joe ever steps down. He may croak on the job but I think he will stay till they drag him out or carry him out.

ddthetide 10-18-2007 09:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by horseofcourse
I think Schiano will be the next Penn State coach whenever JoePa decides to step down...be it 2 years, 4 years or 19 years if he wants to try to coach into triple digits. He'll stay at Rutgers until then. I could be wrong, but I thought I heard some rumors regarding that scenario.
does schiano have psu ties? personally i think he's dumb to leave rutgers. ru and psu recruit the same players, he's winning the battle now and he's king of ru for as long as he wants to stay.

pgardn 10-18-2007 11:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigsmc
Interesting exercise in today's St. Pete Times. They asked Danny Sheridan and Bodog to set lines for USF playing the Top 15 at a neutral site. These are lines as they relate to USF. Favored over both ACC schools hmmmmmmmmmm.

Code:
                  Sheridan            Bodog
OSU                +8                  +13
BC                  -2                    -3
LSU                +7                  +17
OU                  +8                  +13
USC                -1                  +1.5
UK                  -3.5                -1
ASU                -3                  +1.5
WVU                +6                  OFF
ORE                +2                    +2
VT                  -1                    -4
CAL                  +2                  +7
KAN                  -1                  -6.5
SOCAL              +2                  +14
UF                  +6                  +12
THis is very interesting.
To me it shows they got
LSU, OSU, OU, USCAliforn, and Florida as the top teams.

I would still just go with Ohio State, Oklahoma and LSU. LSU giving points against anyone at a neutral site.

Coach Pants 10-19-2007 12:04 AM
So Boston College is at Virginia Tech
Auburn at LSU

Ohio State has to go undefeated due to SOS.

It could be Oklahoma - South Carolina/Kentucky but these two have to win the SEC championship game....Arizona State? Nah. Then there is West Virginia.

Oklahoma - West Virginia? Bleh.

King Glorious 10-19-2007 02:00 AM
Well, I'm absolutely convinced now. South Florida was unquestionably deserving of the #2 ranking in the country. What a joke.

ALostTexan 10-19-2007 02:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Glorious
Well, I'm absolutely convinced now. South Florida was unquestionably deserving of the #2 ranking in the country. What a joke.
Party is over, beeeoootchesssss.....

Bigsmc 10-19-2007 07:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ALostTexan
Party is over, beeeoootchesssss.....
It was a fun party though....

ARyan 10-19-2007 09:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by horseofcourse
I think Schiano will be the next Penn State coach whenever JoePa decides to step down...be it 2 years, 4 years or 19 years if he wants to try to coach into triple digits. He'll stay at Rutgers until then. I could be wrong, but I thought I heard some rumors regarding that scenario.
I have heard this too. Very strong possiblity that he is the replacement when JoePa chooses to step down. Schiano and JoePa are very very close.

ARyan 10-19-2007 09:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddthetide
does schiano have psu ties? personally i think he's dumb to leave rutgers. ru and psu recruit the same players, he's winning the battle now and he's king of ru for as long as he wants to stay.
From what I know, he is very close to Joe. Close enough that he is a regular Thanksgiving Dinner guest. The word is that when the Penn St job opens up, Schiano wants it, and he is who Joe wants to replace him.

ARyan 10-19-2007 09:21 AM
Interesting read on this subject...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/column...ris&id=3069139

pgardn 10-21-2007 09:31 PM
1. Ohio State (57) 8-0 1,612
2. Boston College (2) 7-0 1,494
3. LSU (5) 7-1 1,479
4. Oklahoma 7-1 1,421
5. Oregon 6-1 1,355
6. West Virginia 6-1 1,228
7. Arizona State (1) 7-0 1,156
8. Virginia Tech 6-1 1,111
9. USC 6-1 1,107
9. Florida 5-2 1,107
11. South Florida 6-1 980
12. Kansas 7-0 960
13. Missouri 6-1 925
14. Kentucky 6-2 719
15. South Carolina 6-2 649
16. Hawaii 7-0 573
17. Texas 5-2 497
18. California 5-2 444
19. Michigan 6-2 401
20. Georgia 5-2 394
21. Virginia 7-1 315
22. Alabama 6-2 263
23. Auburn 5-3 248
24. Penn State 6-2 209
25. Rutgers 5-2 174
Others Receiving Votes
UCLA 77, Boise State 72, Wake Forest 50, Connecticut 26, Clemson 21, Wisconsin 17, Air Force 11, Brigham Young 6, Texas Tech 6, TROY 4, Tennessee 3, Fresno State 3, Oklahoma State 3, Kansas State 2, Purdue 1, Cincinnati 1, Texas A&M 1.
Dropped From Rankings
Tennessee 20, Texas Tech 22, Cincinnati 23, Kansas State 25.


No way BC should receive 1st place votes.
If they get first place votes so should Kansas and Hawaii.
Auburn is an incredibly good 3 loss team.

How in God's name does Texas ATM receive a vote?
That Associated Press reporter deserves castration.

Mortimer 10-21-2007 09:36 PM
ror!!

Fine work.





It's such a hoax after the number one finest team in all the land.




And in all the polls.


















Ya gotta love those 3 loss teams!

pgardn 10-21-2007 10:25 PM
And I also see my alma matre is one of the highest ranked 2 loss teams at #17. They have no offensive line, no running attack. Colt McCoy will be lucky to get through the season alive.

horseofcourse 10-22-2007 07:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Glorious
Well, I'm absolutely convinced now. South Florida was unquestionably deserving of the #2 ranking in the country. What a joke.
Yes, they were absolutely deserving. Were they the second best team...I don't think so...but the facts remain they had beaten Auburn on the road and West Virginia. Again, an Auburn team Forida couldn't beat and LSU beat on the last play of the game. I said long ago I thought both Rutgers and Cincinnati could possibly beat them...but until that happened they certainly deserved their ranking. Now that that has happened they are where they should be now.

Seattleallstar 10-22-2007 11:16 AM
my top 10

1.Ohio State on the basis of being undefeated
2.LSU--i hate to admit it probably the best team right now
3.Arizona State--til they lose to USC they stay here
4.Oregon--til they lose to USC they merit being here
5.USC--rolling over ND was a positive sign, hoping they roll over the pac-10 and move on to the BCS title game
6.Oklahoma---surprising team so far, just wondering how much longer it will last
7.Kentucky---if it were not for their loss, id have them as the #1 team in the nation.
8.Florida--playing very well considering the tough teams they face, can beat any team in nation, but it seems like they can also be beat just as easily by any other ranked team
9.VA Tech---just had to fill this spot
10.Auburn--2 losses I know but they could of beat LSU, and they are a very capable team, only tough team they might have left will be Georgia

Crown@club 10-22-2007 11:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattleallstar
my top 10

1.Ohio State on the basis of being undefeated
2.LSU--i hate to admit it probably the best team right now
3.Arizona State--til they lose to USC they stay here
4.Oregon--til they lose to USC they merit being here
5.USC--rolling over ND was a positive sign, hoping they roll over the pac-10 and move on to the BCS title game
6.Oklahoma---surprising team so far, just wondering how much longer it will last
7.Kentucky---if it were not for their loss, id have them as the #1 team in the nation.
8.Florida--playing very well considering the tough teams they face, can beat any team in nation, but it seems like they can also be beat just as easily by any other ranked team
9.VA Tech---just had to fill this spot
10.Auburn--2 losses I know but they could of beat LSU, and they are a very capable team, only tough team they might have left will be Georgia
Talking about overrating the Pac-10!!!!

King Glorious 10-22-2007 01:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by horseofcourse
Yes, they were absolutely deserving. Were they the second best team...I don't think so...but the facts remain they had beaten Auburn on the road and West Virginia. Again, an Auburn team Forida couldn't beat and LSU beat on the last play of the game. I said long ago I thought both Rutgers and Cincinnati could possibly beat them...but until that happened they certainly deserved their ranking. Now that that has happened they are where they should be now.
We will just have to disagree on how teams should be ranked. I don't want to see all of the unbeatens up there simply because they haven't lost. If I had a ballot, I would rank them according to how good I thought each team was, regardless of record. To me, voting South Florida as the second best team when I don't think they are anywhere close to that is as silly as voting Karl Malone the MVP award but acknowledging he's not as good as Michael Jordan. If, for example, going in, I have them ranked:

1-LSU
2-Florida
3-South Florida

and then Florida loses on the road to LSU on a last minute touchdown while South Florida is out beating Central Florida, SF would not move up over Florida. The way the polls do it is stupid, IMO.

Mortimer 10-22-2007 03:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Glorious
We will just have to disagree on how teams should be ranked. I don't want to see all of the unbeatens up there simply because they haven't lost. If I had a ballot, I would rank them according to how good I thought each team was, regardless of record. To me, voting South Florida as the second best team when I don't think they are anywhere close to that is as silly as voting Karl Malone the MVP award but acknowledging he's not as good as Michael Jordan. If, for example, going in, I have them ranked:

1-LSU
2-Florida
3-South Florida

and then Florida loses on the road to LSU on a last minute touchdown while South Florida is out beating Central Florida, SF would not move up over Florida. The way the polls do it is stupid, IMO.




SECKEY MOUSE Syndrome.



It's quite ugly to watch.

Cajungator26 10-22-2007 08:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer
SECKEY MOUSE Syndrome.



It's quite ugly to watch.
It sure is. 41-14. Does that ring a bell?

Mortimer 10-22-2007 08:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cajungator26
It sure is. 41-14. Does that ring a bell?



Sorta/kinda...although a dusty one. It's going back in time.

What are ya....like a Noodle fan?





Current events tell us Ohio State is number one in all the land...




...and all the polls.

Cajungator26 10-22-2007 08:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer
Sorta/kinda...although a dusty one. It's going back in time.

What are ya....like a Noodle fan?





Current events tell us Ohio State is number one in all the land...




...and all the polls.
The fat lady hasn't sang yet, mi amigo and until she does, they're frauds just like they were last year.

Mortimer 10-22-2007 08:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cajungator26
The fat lady hasn't sang yet, mi amigo and until she does, they're frauds just like they were last year.


Aw...a frowny , muggy face reply.


Da pooh bay-beeeee.

Cajungator26 10-22-2007 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer
Aw...a frowny , muggy face reply.


Da pooh bay-beeeee.
Sorry, Morty Poo, but the fact remains that being #1 only matters in the end. But hey! Congrats on being undefeated so far... kudos to you guys for beating everyone on your cupcake schedule. MUAH! :D

Mortimer 10-22-2007 10:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cajungator26
Sorry, Morty Poo, but the fact remains that being #1 only matters in the end. But hey! Congrats on being undefeated so far... kudos to you guys for beating everyone on your cupcake schedule. MUAH! :D

Take a look at ths:



Date Opponent Result/Time Record/Tickets TV
September 1 Western Kentucky W 49-3 1-0 (0-0)
September 8 Troy W 59-31 2-0 (0-0)
September 15 No. 22 Tennessee W 59-20 3-0 (1-0) CBS
September 22 at Mississippi W 30-24 4-0 (2-0)
September 29 Auburn L 20-17 4-1 (2-1)
October 6 at No. 1 LSU L 28-24 4-2 (2-2) CBS
October 20 at No. 7 Kentucky W 45-37 5-2 (3-2)


This is Flory-Dahs schedule to date.


Where did you get the first 2 from....the ovens of Pillsbury???


Mississippi....oh now there's a big one.

Unranked and 3 loss Auburn.



Now if you're going to tell me how highly ranked the rest were then I'm going to tell you those rankings were fraudulent.

Tan-ah-see being the biggest fraud ever hatched.

Cannon Shell 10-22-2007 10:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattleallstar
my top 10

1.Ohio State on the basis of being undefeated(What about BC, Kansas, ASU,Hawaii?all undefeated)2.LSU--i hate to admit it probably the best team right now(They are lucky to play every game in the state of LA, could easily have 3 losses in a row)
3.Arizona State--til they lose to USC they stay hereMay lose this week
4.Oregon--til they lose to USC they merit being hereMay lose this week
5.USC--rolling over ND was a positive sign, hoping they roll over the pac-10 and move on to the BCS title gameonly div 1 games count so ND win meaningless)
6.Oklahoma---surprising team so far, just wondering how much longer it will lastSurprising? they have been in top 10 since July)
7.Kentucky---if it were not for their loss, id have them as the #1 team in the nation.(Which loss doesn't count? S. Carolina or Fla?)
8.Florida--playing very well considering the tough teams they face, can beat any team in nation, but it seems like they can also be beat just as easily by any other ranked teamMaybe the only thing you said that makes sense)
9.VA Tech---just had to fill this spot
10.Auburn--2 losses I know but they could of beat LSU, and they are a very capable team, only tough team they might have left will be Georgia(Which of their losses doesn't count? they have 3.
Redboarding with facts...


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