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  #21  
Old 06-12-2006, 05:34 PM
Cunningham Racing
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oracle80
But they won't have any champions in the Us this year.
This is a very bold statement....if Bernardini wins the Travers and BC Classic, then he'll be Horse of the Year IMO...also, Shawanda is close to her return at Ascot and if she comes for the BC F&M Turf in November, she'll win that race and could also be a champion...Plus, you have Songster and henny Hughes who are both legit BC Sprint candidates...I would disagree against the predicting that they'll have no 2006 champions in early June...the second half of the year is in front of us...
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  #22  
Old 06-12-2006, 05:45 PM
oracle80
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cunningham Racing
This is a very bold statement....if Bernardini wins the Travers and BC Classic, then he'll be Horse of the Year IMO...also, Shawanda is close to her return at Ascot and if she comes for the BC F&M Turf in November, she'll win that race and could also be a champion...Plus, you have Songster and henny Hughes who are both legit BC Sprint candidates...I would disagree against the predicting that they'll have no 2006 champions in early June...the second half of the year is in front of us...
Joel with all due respect he won a Preakness that was marred by Barbaro breaking down and Bro deerek being compromised by getting hurt in the gate.
Sweet NS wandered like a drunken sailor down the lane. Flower Alley hasn't even cranked up yet but soon will. To predict that a three year old will best his elders at this point is not something I'm willing to do.
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  #23  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:12 PM
Cunningham Racing
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oracle80
Joel with all due respect he won a Preakness that was marred by Barbaro breaking down and Bro deerek being compromised by getting hurt in the gate.
Sweet NS wandered like a drunken sailor down the lane. Flower Alley hasn't even cranked up yet but soon will. To predict that a three year old will best his elders at this point is not something I'm willing to do.
Bernardini is the most talented horse in the country...period...I firmly believe that...he beats Barbaro in the Preakness if that colt doesn't break down...firmly believe that.....we'll see at year's end.

My prediction of Bernardini being the best horse is bold, but I also thought he'd win the Preakness and I was awarded by hitting the EX, TRI and SUPER...your prediction is bold, too, which is fine..I'm just saying that you are throwing a blanket over a significant amount of talented horse flesh if you are saying halfway through the year that they won't have an Eclipse horse....Have you even seen any of their babies run?...No, cause they won't run until Saratoga. So, what if they have a BC Juvenile or Juvenile Fillies winner that hasn't debuted yet?..Certainly not out of the question considering they spent hundreds of millions of dollars at auction on the crop of 2-year-olds they are about to unveil.....shaky prediction, but we'll see..
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  #24  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:17 PM
oracle80
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cunningham Racing
Bernardini is the most talented horse in the country...period...I firmly believe that...he beats Barbaro in the Preakness if that colt doesn't break down...firmly believe that.....we'll see at year's end.

My prediction of Bernardini being the best horse is bold, but I also thought he'd win the Preakness and I was awarded by hitting the EX, TRI and SUPER...your prediction is bold, too, which is fine..I'm just saying that you are throwing a blanket over a significant amount of talented horse flesh if you are saying halfway through the year that they won't have an Eclipse horse....Have you even seen any of their babies run?...No, cause they won't run until Saratoga. So, what if they have a BC Juvenile or Juvenile Fillies winner that hasn't debuted yet?..Certainly not out of the question considering they spent hundreds of millions of dollars at auction on the crop of 2-year-olds they are about to unveil.....shaky prediction, but we'll see..
Shaky?
Well Joel I live in saratoga. And pletcher has more talent in this barn up here in saratoga than the sheikh has throughout the world. YOu think Scat daddy and Minefield are great? Wait til Saratoga. Hes got babies breaking watches every morning, and many of them. Todd's 2Yo's will sweep every grade one in the Northeast this year, every one. You ain't seen anything yet. Wait until you see the Pletcher show this summer. Its a gonna be a smash hit.
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  #25  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:20 PM
Cunningham Racing
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oracle80
Shaky?
Well Joel I live in saratoga. And pletcher has more talent in this barn up here in saratoga than the sheikh has throughout the world. YOu think Scat daddy and Minefield are great? Wait til Saratoga. Hes got babies breaking watches every morning, and many of them. Todd's 2Yo's will sweep every grade one in the Northeast this year, every one. You ain't seen anything yet. Wait until you see the Pletcher show this summer. Its a gonna be a smash hit.
Yeah, I know he has The Green Monkey and many others...saw several of them train...that is come to be expected every year....I've talked to people out of that camp...Scat Daddy is the goods in that barn....
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  #26  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:21 PM
oracle80
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cunningham Racing
Yeah, I know he has The Green Monkey and many others...saw several of them train...that is come to be expected every year....I've talked to people out of that camp...Scat Daddy is the goods in that barn....
Hes the best, but there are more, many more.
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  #27  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:23 PM
oracle80
 
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I'd take any action on a two year old US champ prop(either sex) Pletchers barn vs all the Sheikh's horses, anywhere, any country.
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  #28  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:27 PM
oracle80
 
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Does anyone wanna call me out on either prop?
Pletcher's barn vs Sheikh over all eclipses
Pletcher's barn vs Sheikh two year old champs(both sexes)

Go for it.
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  #29  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:31 PM
oracle80
 
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What? No takers? Geez. With all these worshippers of foreign sheikhs I thought someone would wanna take that action. Guess not.
USA!!!!
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  #30  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:37 PM
Betsy Betsy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oracle80
Joel with all due respect he won a Preakness that was marred by Barbaro breaking down and Bro deerek being compromised by getting hurt in the gate.
Sweet NS wandered like a drunken sailor down the lane. Flower Alley hasn't even cranked up yet but soon will. To predict that a three year old will best his elders at this point is not something I'm willing to do.
I have to ask what made you change your tune on Bernardini; right after the Preakness, you had no hesitation in claiming Bernardini's performance to be phenomenal and that he might very well have beaten Barbaro. Now you turn around 180 degrees and his race wasn't that good?

I'm glad that racing writers have been able to put aside their feelings and look at Bernardini's performance in the cold hard light of reality - it was brilliant. There is still so much more racing left but Bernardini is championship quality, of that I have no doubt. He's got the chance now to prove it on the track, as it should be.
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  #31  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:37 PM
blackthroatedwind blackthroatedwind is offline
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I think it will be very interesting to see what they do with Discreet Cat and Bernardini after their projected next starts in the Jim Dandy and Haskell respectively. Assuming both stay sound, an obvious " if ", I wonder if they will race against each other in the Travers.

My guess is that with the Woodward now being run in Saratoga you will see one of them in the Travers and the other take on elders in the Woodward the following week. Just a guess but I think it makes some sense.
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  #32  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:38 PM
oracle80
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind
I think it will be very interesting to see what they do with Discreet Cat and Bernardini after their projected next starts in the Jim Dandy and Haskell respectively. Assuming both stay sound, an obvious " if ", I wonder if they will race against each other in the Travers.

My guess is that with the Woodward now being run in Saratoga you will see one of them in the Travers and the other take on elders in the Woodward the following week. Just a guess but I think it makes some sense.
Black,
Don't you see one going in the Haskell and being saved for fall racing and one going Jim Dandy then Travers?
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  #33  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:40 PM
oracle80
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsy
I have to ask what made you change your tune on Bernardini; right after the Preakness, you had no hesitation in claiming Bernardini's performance to be phenomenal and that he might very well have beaten Barbaro. Now you turn around 180 degrees and his race wasn't that good?

I'm glad that racing writers have been able to put aside their feelings and look at Bernardini's performance in the cold hard light of reality - it was brilliant. There is still so much more racing left but Bernardini is championship quality, of that I have no doubt. He's got the chance now to prove it on the track, as it should be.
It was a great race. But to be beat elders in the BCC is another story. I personally think Flower Alley will slay all comers when he returns and I think the late comeback is by design. I think he wins the Whitney, the JCGC, and the BCC. His talent is immense, and his BCC as a 3yo against older truly unappreciated.
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  #34  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:45 PM
liamc7 liamc7 is offline
Yearling
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattleallstar
it seems like the past month they have won alot of major races here in the US, and even a few big ones in Europe. Looks like they are finally doing something right, and managing their talent much better.
When and if ever Coolmore decide to take American racing seriously watch out.
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  #35  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:45 PM
blackthroatedwind blackthroatedwind is offline
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The Woodward basically is " fall racing ".

I just feel like with horses this good they will not run in races like the Super Derby or Pennsylvania Derby and will point for a combination of the Travers, Woodward and Jockey Club Gold Cup. Considering Discreet Cat's obvious issues I could easily see them waiting the additional week for the Woodward and then going directly to the BC.
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  #36  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:47 PM
oracle80
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liamc7
When and if ever Coolmore decide to take American racing seriously watch out.
They will and Tood will be training most of them. His operation is a machine. You ought see those TAP sets out every morning. Ferocious beasts.
Like I said, if anyone wants any Pletcher vs Sheikh action in ecplipses at even money count me in.
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  #37  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:48 PM
oracle80
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind
The Woodward basically is " fall racing ".

I just feel like with horses this good they will not run in races like the Super Derby or Pennsylvania Derby and will point for a combination of the Travers, Woodward and Jockey Club Gold Cup. Considering Discreet Cat's obvious issues I could easily see them waiting the additional week for the Woodward and then going directly to the BC.

I guess you are right. Hes some horse, no doubt. But I will take Flower Alley against anyone alive in the BCC right now.
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  #38  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:49 PM
blackthroatedwind blackthroatedwind is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oracle80
It was a great race. But to be beat elders in the BCC is another story. I personally think Flower Alley will slay all comers when he returns and I think the late comeback is by design. I think he wins the Whitney, the JCGC, and the BCC. His talent is immense, and his BCC as a 3yo against older truly unappreciated.
What is so immense about Flower Alley's talent? Where is his monsterous performance?

Don't get me wrong, he is a nice horse, and ran very well last year, but he hardly strikes me as a world beater. And, sorry, I find his late start troubling, and wonder what the true story may be. We already saw one disasterous return by one of that barn's stars, Indian Vale, and let's face it, the connections have not had an abundance of success in keeping horses together for long periods of time.
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  #39  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:51 PM
oracle80
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind
What is so immense about Flower Alley's talent? Where is his monsterous performance?

Don't get me wrong, he is a nice horse, and ran very well last year, but he hardly strikes me as a world beater. And, sorry, I find his late start troubling, and wonder what the true story may be. We already saw one disasterous return by one of that barn's stars, Indian Vale, and let's face it, the connections have not had an abundance of success in keeping horses together for long periods of time.

Well his Travers was awesome as was his BCC. I hear he had a breathing problem in the JCGC and tend to believe it after his BCC. I thinkhis BCC performance would have won 85% of BCC's ever run. And I think that they set a campaign designed for HOY. Melnyk has too much cash to race one like that who isn't right.
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  #40  
Old 06-12-2006, 06:56 PM
Cunningham Racing
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oracle80
Does anyone wanna call me out on either prop?
Pletcher's barn vs Sheikh over all eclipses
Pletcher's barn vs Sheikh two year old champs(both sexes)

Go for it.
I will for BC Juvenile Fillies, but not Juvenile....the reason is that I think Scat Daddy will win the Juvenile and have thought that since I saw him train at CD...I thought that First Samurai would win the Juvenile last year before he even debuted just by watching him train at CD in the mornings...obviously, he was the favorite but didn't win.....I LOVE Scat Daddy.

I'll prop bet Pletcher's fillies VS. Darley's fillies...niether is likely to win because of the law of numbers, but maybe we can say best finish between Pletcher fillies and Darley fillies, or do they have to win?

..You actualy have an advantage because I know Pletcher has that 1.2 million Johanessburg filly that Coolmore LOVES..

My ear is open...what are the conditions?..
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