#21
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been watching the belmony replay show, garret gomez has been absolutely horrible, Pletcher was better off making Luzzi or Decarlo the stable jock
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#22
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Problem appears to be what I predicted, the style of riding in NY. In Ny its long been a tradition(started by Angel Cordero and Jorge Velasquez) that you don't just ride your own horse, you ride the others as well. By this I mean that you will often see Prado and Velazquez lock guys on main competitors in a trap or jackpot and keep them locked in. If you want to get a hole in NY you have to get lucky and have the horse in front of you drift out or in, cause those guys arent letting you out, no way no how. Garrett likes to "make things happen" with his style of riding. Likes to save ground and try to split horses. When it works(like on Artie in the BC) he looks like a genius, when it doesn't work(like in the BC sprint when Edgar swung the door shut as he heard him coming and said "where do you think you are going?") he doesnt look so hot. Its a completely different ballgame here. |
#23
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only jockey out west that could handle the job would be PVAL!
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#24
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[QUOTE .... a trap or jackpot and keep them locked in.... Its a completely different ballgame here.[/quote]
ok, trap I understand. locked in, I follow, What the heck is a "jackpot?" got me there... |
#25
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One example of the NY style of riding was what Edgar did to Pval on Derby Day in the Woodford Reserve. Edgar was on Good Reward and absolutely kept Pval hemmed in the whole way, refused to let him out and believe me it was on purpose. The blimp shot showed it pretty good. Pval knew he was in a jam 1/2 mile into the race and if you watch the blimp shot he is leaning to his right trying to get out and trying to get Prado to give him a hole. Prado wouldnt budge, he knew what he was doing. Even turning for home, Prado had him locked up. By the time he finally shook clear, it was too late, game over. Can't wait to bet Cacique back in the Manhattan. |
#26
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#27
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Maybe Edgar ought to focus more on winning the race with his mounts like Good reward as opposed to contributing to someone else's downfall (P Val and Cacique). If I recall Good Reward was up the track in this race. Was it a big consolation for Edgar knowing he helped beat the race favorite or is he bed buddies with Garret Gomez and set the whole thing up so his sweetiepie would win with English Channel?
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#28
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Look he has no way of knowing if his horse is gonna fire or not in the lane. Reward is a quirky horse who actually won the Manhattan last year. What he did was lock in one of his main competitors so that if he had run he would get the jump on him. Oh, and I don't think he has any buddies when he is out there in a race, hes a warrior in the saddle. He and Johhny even get into it with each other at times. Thats how it should be. As far as Gomez goes, ask him if he though Edgar was his buddy on Cup day when he got the door smacked right in his face when he tried to come between Edgar and another horse. Every jock in Ny knows, you don't try to split Edgar and someone else, that door is gonna close in your face if you try it. |
#29
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Gomez
Oracle:
If you have such a bias against Gomez or for that matter any other jockey or trainer why play him? If you believe he is on the best horse and can't stand the guy just pass the race. If he is on the favorite who you don't like that should give you an even bigger opportunity... I am sure all of us have gone through periods when a particular jockey was costing us $$$ and if that is the case one should just not play the guy... Gomez has certainly won some big races in the last year and not just at the So Cal circuit.... I am not a big fan of his just because of his past and trouble that he has gotten in. Yes, Johnny V is the best there is... But with White Mercedes Pletcher his horses average what 3-2.... |
#30
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Sorry Oracle 80
Sorry, Meant Seattle All Star
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#31
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White Mercedes, LOL! Thats very funny.
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#32
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Any jockey could have ridden Barbaro in the Derby. Some would have won by more, some less depending on the style. The only jockey that could have botched up that ride is Mike Luzzi.
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#33
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Stat- In over three weeks of riding in NY he has won with TWO mounts for Pletcher at Belmont. One Safari Queen was 6-5(and that wasnt a great ride) and Honey Ryder at 3-2. Now thats a fact Jack. only TWO winners for Todd at the meet. The other 7 have been for other trainers. The level at which he is spoken of by some leads to to evaluate him as if he were the very best or one of the best. I can give you three horses he blew this weekend with bad rides. Two of em I bet, and one I didn't and cashed on because he blew the ride. Hes not Johnny, not even close. His mistakes are always mental. Noone is gonna tell you hes not amazingly strong and agile, ist pretty obvious that he is. But at the very highest level of the game you have to sharpen your mental skills as well. He needs plenty of work in this area. |
#34
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By the way PSH
By the way, my clocker tells me if he doesnt win at least three races tomorrow that he should be run outta town on a rail.
Both of his two year olds should win. The turf horse in the first as well. |
#35
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Thank you Oracle.
3/1, 3/5 and 2/1 on the morning line though. I suspect the only horse who has a chance of going off better than even money is the horse in the first race because of the large field. The 2 year olds will be 1/5 and 3/5 respectively. Why even bother carding races like this, its whats ruining the sport and turning people over to auto racing |
#36
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Exactly!! I was so mad a Pval at the 1/2 mile pole in that race 'cause I knew he had Cacique trapped at the rail.
Maybe I'm way off here(especially considering this has been a Gomez bashing thread!), but I'm starting to think Pval doesn't ride as well in large fields as he does in the typical small fields you see on the west coast. Now, I'm make a generalization based on Pval's rides on Cacique in the Kilroe mile and Woodford Reserve, but in both cases, I thought Pval didn't handle the large fields too well. He went way wide in the Kilroe and got trapped in the Woodford... I can't wait for Cacique to run in the Manhattan too, but I'm hoping someone else has the mount if it's a large field again. One example of the NY style of riding was what Edgar did to Pval on Derby Day in the Woodford Reserve. Edgar was on Good Reward and absolutely kept Pval hemmed in the whole way, refused to let him out and believe me it was on purpose. The blimp shot showed it pretty good. Pval knew he was in a jam 1/2 mile into the race and if you watch the blimp shot he is leaning to his right trying to get out and trying to get Prado to give him a hole. Prado wouldnt budge, he knew what he was doing. Even turning for home, Prado had him locked up. By the time he finally shook clear, it was too late, game over. Can't wait to bet Cacique back in the Manhattan.[/quote] |
#37
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Oracle 80
Oracle 80:
Can i infer from previous posts on this thread that you own Western Expression and possibly other horses? If so, best of luck on Friday with Western ..... PSH |
#38
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MY clocker is also my friend and he trained for over 30 years. Hes the most repected guy in NY by the trainers. Hes a private clocker and when the trainers wanna know what their horse REALLY worked in as well as how he looked doing it, Joe's the guy they ask. Hes on the OTB channel show in August up here as well. One of my best friends and mentors, taught me a lot of the inside things and about training and how to really understand how training works. Hes hooked up with clockers at other tracks, they trade info with one another. When its a baby race, hes my source on the firsters. When its a two year old race or a race with fir |
#39
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#40
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Anything with speed... |
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