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#41
10-02-2006, 12:39 PM
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The mechanics of a champion racehorse are definitely there. At least, I see them, and so do many others. 
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#42
10-02-2006, 12:41 PM
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Horses like Simpatico Bribon and Invasor were actuallyb trying to win the race and trying to do so from the 3/8 pole to the wire....while a horse like Testamony, who did not have to ship and was familiar and confortable with the surroundings, wasn't trying to win the race so he didn't take out of his conventional style and comfort zone.... If the best horses always finished in the order they were supposed to run this game would be extinct....By your theory, a horse like Super Frolic is better than Sun King then if the only time they ran against each other Super Frolic clearly beat him by finishing 4th when Sun King faded well back in last yera's BC Classic, right?...No....Sun King was TRYING to win the race and got caught up in an ambitious pace before getting his head handed to him by Saint Liam and Flower Alley on the far turn, while Supah Blitz enjoyed a perfect trip and picked up the pieces for 4th at 70-1 while never threatening to win the race....it happens all of the time, man....you know that...
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#43
10-02-2006, 12:45 PM
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#44
10-02-2006, 12:47 PM
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If there is a horse alive who gets too much commentary and debate over, its Discreet Cat.
He beat a maiden field that looked great at the time, but the 2nd place horse Superfly is still eligible for entry level allowance conditions, the 3rd horse Ivanoksky just won the other day FINALLY for maiden 45 on the grass, and the 4th horse is still a maiden. His race in Dubai to me is like a tossout, as are all dubai races. I find it sickening that Brass Hat's connections have to give back 1.2 mill, while horses like Alwutamakel, Testimony, etc all run huge races on that day every year. I'm not buying anything they try and sell each year on that day. Invasor simply didnt fire. His comeback at the Spa, well he beat Accountforgold, who came back and got beat in the same allowance condition the other day by an ordinary horse. The race on Sunday, well again it was great, but beating Valid Notebook won't get you a plaque on Union Avenue up here. Until this horse actually runs against, and beats someone, hes just a freakish horse whos shown he can run awesome figs agaisnt noone. And I've seen a few of those over the years. I think hes one of the fastest horses I've ever seen to be honest. But at some point it would be really nice if he actually faced someone worth facing, I mean its October of his 3 year old year and hes run 4 times.
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#45
10-02-2006, 12:49 PM
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#46
10-02-2006, 12:50 PM
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Joel, I really don't think anyone takes that day seriously anymore. After Almutawakel won off like the "champion" he was(LOL!!) and couldnt hit the board in a money allowance race that fall at Belmont, well, all I can say is thats SOME form reversal. And after The most disgraceful thing I've ever seen in the Brass Hat debacle, I'd have to say anyone who brings a truly good horse over there has to be kidding. I don't think its a very level playing field over there. That being said, I have no gripes with calling Discreet cat potentially one of the fastest milers in decades, provided he actually beats someone besides Valid Notebook, Superfly, Testimony(LOL!!), and Accountforgold. Thats not exactly an allstar cast there.
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#47
10-02-2006, 12:52 PM
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I believe he is the best horse we've had in our game the last 25 years...I really do...and when I say 'best horse' I mean that in a veryb thorough way...I look at him physically, how talented he is, his pedigree and what he will offer in the breeding sheds, etc.....the full cycle of how he could impact our sport....and I've come to the conclusion that there has been no better in my lifetime.....he is horse that could change our industry....100% impactful on and off the track in the breeding sheds...these don't come along but maybe once every 20-30 years....I know thats high praise and may will highly disagree, but I've been saying this since May and it is funny how everytime he cruises that I get less and less people disagreeing with me .... BTW, the Shieks have convictions that run deeper than trying to win a race IMO...I just don't see them as being the character of people to feel like they have to cheat...I just don't...t makes no sense at all....They cut people's hands off over there whe you steal...I just cannot see it....those people over there have a MUCH stricter civil code and value system than Americans do on average....just saying... Also, they love when the American's come to World Cup day..Why would they jeopardize that? Money is never an issue with them, and if cheating did happen there, I would bet aboyut anything that the high-ups had NO knowledge of it.....think about it... Last edited by Cunningham Racing : 10-02-2006 at 01:02 PM.
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#48
10-02-2006, 12:54 PM
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#49
10-02-2006, 12:57 PM
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 here we go with people taking things persinally again....the funny thing is that i just noticed you telling m,e I needed 'medical attention' in a post earlier in the thread... This is when i retire from a thread...when the ridiculousness begins...Thanks for the conversation guys....see you in another thread down the road.... This is very dispaoointing it always results to more than a debate 
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#50
10-02-2006, 12:59 PM
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#51
10-02-2006, 01:01 PM
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But there is such a thing as a perfect horse.
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#52
10-02-2006, 01:04 PM
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Oh, golly gee, you mean horses chasing sometimes don't run their best efforts, and tire from chasing a leader they can't beat and lose to an inferior horse who simply sucked up? Gee willakers...I didn't know that. Thanks for f'n clueing me in. Come on, Joel, you can do better than that.
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#53
10-02-2006, 01:08 PM
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Buffy isn't here so I feel obligated...
Now, be nice... 
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#54
10-02-2006, 01:10 PM
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Guy I know shipped a horse to a small track near here for a stakes race. Brought in a NYRA jock also. Funny thing happened at the gate, they tailed him and teh asst starter wasnt real good with him in the gate, geez who'd figure? He broke bad of course and lost all chance.
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#55
10-02-2006, 01:10 PM
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Than don't ask me questions about how Testimony could beat a horse like Invasor if you don't want to hear the reason, got it?
You started this, Andy...everything was a fair debate until you started throwing your frequent jabs about how i kiss Godolphin's a ss and that I 'need medical attention'.... I guess I should have taken it that you were insulting my intelligence by asking me a question that would provide a handicapping 101 answer.... I expected more from a figure like you....
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#56
10-02-2006, 01:15 PM
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Lemme put this another way, so you can see it from someone elses point of view. Testimony is just awful, incredibly awful. For him to run 2nd in any kind of grade one race, well, the others wouldnt have to get tired from chasing, they'd have to fall down. The "101 lecture" as it was put, was an insult to the intelligence of anyone whose seen testimony's form in every other race hes ever run. We all know how horses can spit the bit when they middle move or chase other horses, and how horses can suck up in a big race by saving ground and just riding the last 1/8th out to pass the dead horses. But have you ever SEEN Testimony? Him running 2nd is in the same league with Almutawakel winning the Classic(ever see his form?!!!!). I think its safe to say that many of us detected a long time ago that the home track horses run shockingly good races that day that they never reproduce.
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#57
10-02-2006, 01:20 PM
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You are the biggest Godolphin cheerleader NOT on their payroll. Do you deny that? Come on! You, like me, seem to be suspicious of everyone....but somehow you have decided Godolphin runs a clean operation. You love them....it's obvious. I hate them....that's also obvious.
Now you are taking the " medical attention " comment personally? I don't think so, I think you know I was kidding around but it seems to work for your agument now. It would be one thing to suggest that you believe Testimony sucked up because the viable competitors all tired from chasing...but to explain it to me in the manner you did seemed a little over the top. But, I will concede that I MAY have overreacted, and ask you....how come Testimony wasn't able to suck up one bit in either of his US races...both of which had contentious paces?
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#58
10-02-2006, 01:24 PM
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I don't care, man....I'm a good-natured dude and when people repeatedly come on hear and start negative drections to the debates it gets pretty old at this point.....I don't mean to insult anybodys intelligence and he should know that by now...he asked a question ad I answered it sincerely as to what I thought happpened...I mean, hell, anybody who saw the race could see that DC was the easy winner when they straightened for home....the others were flailing and it set up for some rat to run up for a cheap placing.....
The bottomline here is that I am shocked and a little disapopointed that I was jabbed in a negative way by the person who did it...I could easily see others and it wouldn't surprise me as much....I'm not trying to be a drama queen, but everything I have written in this thread has been light-hearted and not wth any negative intentions, yet I still cannot avoid stuff like the following wrote back to me: <<<Don't f'n lecture me and talk down to me....especially with that kind of crap.>>> ...and crap about needing medical help.....it just gets old with all of this negativity on these damn threads.... I'm just disappointed right now.....
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#59
10-02-2006, 01:25 PM
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#60
10-02-2006, 01:26 PM
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Linear Mode
