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  #61  
Old 08-20-2017, 12:33 PM
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knickslions2 knickslions2 is offline
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Originally Posted by RHT2004 View Post
Thanks.
What's the thanks for? Did he send you some more monopoly cash to make more $600 fake bets in selection thread?

In response to ateam did I exaggerate of course. This db makes it hard to like Arrogate and deserves to get his nuts busted. He ruins most threads and it's getting old. As for Arrogate he ran much better indeed but collected deserves Praise for this effort when most said distance was too much.
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  #62  
Old 08-20-2017, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by RHT2004 View Post
Thanks.
Why are you saying thank you to Ateam? Everything he said is correct but you didn't say any of that. You said Arrogate was a mortal lock. You scoffed at the idea that Collected would get the 1 1/4. You said it was silly when I said that Baffert wouldn't have entered Collected if he knew Arrogate was 100%. You were wrong but you will never admit it. People who post imaginary bets, dump $2000 on a Friday and continue to just up their bet amounts till one eventually hits just don't admit they are wrong. Dahoss had you pegged years ago and he was right. Keep posting imaginary bets, bet at the OTB in your backyard, bet $100 WPS when there is no show pool. We get it, this is the only way you can get attention. So in spite of having a decent opinion most people on here that have followed your wagers will continue to think you are a clown.
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  #63  
Old 08-20-2017, 12:51 PM
RHT2004 RHT2004 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knickslions2 View Post
What's the thanks for? Did he send you some more monopoly cash to make more $600 fake bets in selection thread?

In response to ateam did I exaggerate of course. This db makes it hard to like Arrogate and deserves to get his nuts busted. He ruins most threads and it's getting old. As for Arrogate he ran much better indeed but collected deserves Praise for this effort when most said distance was too much.
You have called him overrated multiple times, talking about 4 good races. Someone other then me calls you out and you back off. Be a man.....
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  #64  
Old 08-20-2017, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by RHT2004 View Post
You have called him overrated multiple times, talking about 4 good races. Someone other then me calls you out and you back off. Be a man.....
Be a man??! Are you serious? Does being a man make up **** to get attention? I respect ateam and he knows what my point is here.
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  #65  
Old 08-20-2017, 01:37 PM
RHT2004 RHT2004 is offline
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Why dont we stick to racing and drop the personal crap.
Arrogate is better. He chased wide while Collected dictated things. Collected ran OK. Better then i thought he would. Fair?
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  #66  
Old 08-20-2017, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by RHT2004 View Post
Why dont we stick to racing and drop the personal crap.
Arrogate is better. He chased wide while Collected dictated things. Collected ran OK. Better then i thought he would. Fair?
I'll talk racing. Collected ran better then okay . 115 beyer ain't bad
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  #67  
Old 08-20-2017, 02:04 PM
RHT2004 RHT2004 is offline
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Originally Posted by knickslions2 View Post
I'll talk racing. Collected ran better then okay . 115 beyer ain't bad
He's turned into a nice horse.
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  #68  
Old 08-20-2017, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by RHT2004 View Post
He's turned into a nice horse.
Always was a nice hoss. Try reading The form
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  #69  
Old 08-20-2017, 03:04 PM
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So exactly why did Smith choose to run wide? He had many chances to tuck him in, and definitely lost the horse more than a half-length of ground going around there.
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  #70  
Old 08-20-2017, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by cakes44 View Post
So exactly why did Smith choose to run wide? He had many chances to tuck him in, and definitely lost the horse more than a half-length of ground going around there.
For those who actually watched the race, it didn't matter if the horse was wide or glued to the rail, Smith was working on that horse long before the top of the stretch. From there, you can then blame Smith for a bad ride, but we won't hear that from anyone, bc it in fact wasn't a bad ride, the horse just didn't fire, again.

From a gambling standpoint, and ultimately the reason we all play this game, this horse has been overrated in BOTH his last 2 starts @ 1-9 and 3-5, based on the simple fact that he didn't win.

-bt-
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  #71  
Old 08-20-2017, 03:51 PM
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declansharbor declansharbor is offline
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RHT yet again gettin' beat up from the feet up, but how many horses on earth could run a 115 beyer and still be getting lumped into the "failed to fire" category? None? ... We can all agree on him tossing a clunker in the SD Hcp, obv, but is it too far out of the realm of possibility that the horse's time on the shelf did him ZERO good? He looked beyond short first off the bench, and yesterday he fell just short of wrangling in an improving horse that looked comfortable while setting fractions that wouldn't be deemed 'skull busting' in a G1.

Is Arrogate the all-time great most were declaring him to be after his come from behind in Dubai? Probably not. I think his win in Dubai, seeing that it wasn't in his usual up-front style, catapulted his status in the eyes of a lot of racing talking heads (ESP in an era where people are just frothing at the mouth to declare horses as all-time greats).

I said it in a previous post about Arrogate after his last loss. I highly doubt he catches California Chrome in the Classic had it not been for Smith going to the right hand stick mid stretch. Smith didn't employ the right hand stick yesterday until Collected had the race won already (Smith DID smack him right handed on the turn for home but then went lefty to keep him from drifting into Accelerate). I truly believe that has at LEAST something to do with his half length loss last night.
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  #72  
Old 08-20-2017, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -BT- View Post
For those who actually watched the race, it didn't matter if the horse was wide or glued to the rail, Smith was working on that horse long before the top of the stretch. From there, you can then blame Smith for a bad ride, but we won't hear that from anyone, bc it in fact wasn't a bad ride, the horse just didn't fire, again.

From a gambling standpoint, and ultimately the reason we all play this game, this horse has been overrated in BOTH his last 2 starts @ 1-9 and 3-5, based on the simple fact that he didn't win.

-bt-


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  #73  
Old 08-20-2017, 04:12 PM
NTamm1215 NTamm1215 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -BT- View Post
For those who actually watched the race, it didn't matter if the horse was wide or glued to the rail, Smith was working on that horse long before the top of the stretch. From there, you can then blame Smith for a bad ride, but we won't hear that from anyone, bc it in fact wasn't a bad ride, the horse just didn't fire, again.

From a gambling standpoint, and ultimately the reason we all play this game, this horse has been overrated in BOTH his last 2 starts @ 1-9 and 3-5, based on the simple fact that he didn't win.

-bt-
He lost a Grade I by a neck and got a 114 Beyer. If you think he didn't fire, I can't put it more simply - you're wrong.
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  #74  
Old 08-20-2017, 04:32 PM
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If he fired, how come Baffert was so disappointed?
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  #75  
Old 08-20-2017, 04:35 PM
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Pretty amazing how many different opinions came out of this single race.
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  #76  
Old 08-20-2017, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin View Post
I am skeptical that his below par performances are due to the track. Don't get me wrong. I am a big believer in horses for courses and in horses not liking certain tracks. I'm just not sure that this is one of those cases. But let's assume you are right and Arrogate doesn't like the surface. I have never heard of horses improving on surfaces that they don't like. If a horse doesn't like a track he's not going to improve over it with practice.
That's exactly how I feel. I was taught years ago that horses like or dislike tracks for different reasons. Maybe they have trouble getting the footing. Maybe the track stings their feet. Any number of reasons. I was also taught that the best effort a horse will give on a track they don't like is the first race. Horses make mental notes and they try to protect themselves and the more they run on something that's not comfortable, the worse they will do.
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  #77  
Old 08-20-2017, 06:01 PM
NTamm1215 NTamm1215 is offline
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Originally Posted by herkhorse View Post
If he fired, how come Baffert was so disappointed?
I would imagine because he expected him to win. Perhaps he was underrating Collected's performance as well. His interview with Nick Luck before the race was awkward. He ignored his question about what happened in the San Diego and just sort of talked around everything he was asked.
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  #78  
Old 08-20-2017, 10:30 PM
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While I don't think he is the same horse anymore I would still bet him in the BC if he runs. It an only give the gambler better odds with all this losing.

Could be another Tiznow who ran two third place finishes before winning the BC.
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  #79  
Old 08-21-2017, 08:30 AM
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Got a laugh out of Baffert as quoted in Bloodhorse:

"We watched the races a few times, and Collected still won."
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  #80  
Old 08-21-2017, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NTamm1215 View Post
He lost a Grade I by a neck and got a 114 Beyer. If you think he didn't fire, I can't put it more simply - you're wrong.
The problem with the beyers guys is that being math nerds, they don't factor in the hoss flesh part of it. Something is bothering that hoss. His ears pinned back before the race showed his displeasure, and he ran like it. If he was right, he woulda smoked that hoss. It only shows he can run a 113 pissed off.
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