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Old 06-09-2015, 11:31 AM
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Indian Charlie Indian Charlie is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Southern Maine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freddymo View Post
Beyers take on ATR is the pace was slow AP had it his own way and the race was historically ordinary.
The pace was indeed pretty relaxed and easy for AP. It usually is in the Belmont. Ordinary though? No.



Quote:
Originally Posted by freddymo View Post
He applauds the achievement but clearly thinks AP speed is ordinary for G1 horses. By doing this he suggests that all that his big Fig horses like Materialty and Frosted didnt fire, which is certainly plausible I guess.
Yeah, I find that pretty convenient for him to explain away just how truly historically bad his Florida Derby opinion is. It's really an offense to common sense, and I normally don't give a crap about what people's opinions are (in the sense of getting bent out of shape).

Quote:
Originally Posted by freddymo View Post
I personally dont think the pace was slow and while Materiality maybe be finished his Derby was perceived very highly for his bad trip etc. and for you to just say he couldnt run reasonably fast for a 6f's 5 weeks after his OK derby is a bit of a reach for my palate.
I personally felt his Derby trip was entirely overblown, though I can see why people feel the way they do, and I might be wrong.

The rest of that paragraph, I am confused by. He was pretty close up to the lead for at least half of the race, so, he did, in my eyes, fire and ran a decent enough race until he quit. He had five weeks to prepare for that effort? How is it a reach to say he couldn't prepare in five weeks to run 3/4's in 113 and change? That's workout speed. Maybe I'm not understanding your point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by freddymo View Post
I think its fair to say Beyer doesnt think AP has ever run a really fast race to date.
That's part of my problem. To me, it seems like he is lacking objectivity, which is a must when working with numbers, like he does. He's run several very fast races, but because he THINKS AP hasn't, he adjusts his numbers downwards.

Again, maybe I'm missing something, but using the Brooklyn to downgrade the Belmont seems pretty far fetched in this instance.
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