[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by JJP

Its not that they weren't good. Its just when you claim those were three of the top 5 in the past 20 years, you're gonna hear about it. Of those three, I'd say Java Gold was the most deserving. Beating Broad Brush and Gulch was solid in the Whitney although IMO Nostalgia's Star and Polish Navy were no world beaters by any stretch for the JCGC. The Travers was a strong field too. Brilliant but brief career.

As for KG, I'd take what any jockey says with a grain of salt. And after Sunday Silence and Easy Goer, there wasn't much to beat in the Haskell (or Ohio Derby for that matter). Sunday Silence had a pretty good turn of foot; I really doubt KG would've beaten Sunday Silence at a mile.

Go for Wand was very solid too although I'm not big on throwing around unadjusted times. Just IMO, she didn't distinguish herself as being better than the true superstar mares. Maybe as good, or close to, but not better.

I know I'll hear about it but it doesn't bother me. As I said, it's just opinions. I thought that him beating Nostalgia's Star and Polish Navy in the Marlboro were more impressive than the Whitney. Polish Navy had just come off of a win against older in the Woodward, where he had beaten Gulch (and I believe Bet Twice also) to confirm even more that the 3yo's were a better and deeper group than the older horses that year. Nostalgia's Star, while not a great horse, was a solid older horse (Strub, Hawthorne Gold Cup plus numerous other placings in good races).

As for McCarron's comments, take them as u will. Because he had ridden KG and Sunday Silence, I thought he was in a good position to make a call there. I also had asked Gary Stevens for his opinion before the Santa Anita Derby. He said that he thought that if KG was there, he'd have been favored over Sunday Silence too. Of course, this was before everyone found out just how good SS really was. There was absolutely nothing that KG beat in either the Ohio Derby or the Haskell except for maybe Music Merci. I wasn't touting the quality of those fields though, only answering your question.

With GfW, I would agree with u that a single race time is no way to judge a horse. But when u are able to string together three races like that, that's more than just fast tracks or favorable circumstances. And just the fact that she was able to run step for step with Bayakoa told me that everything she had done was legit. Bayakoa was truly one of the most outstanding mares to come along in the past 20 years. I think easily top five (very underrated in my opinion) and she was a more mature 6yo horse at the time they faced each other. Of course it's all speculation on how much, if any, GfW could have improved in the next year or two had she continued on but even the slightest improvement and I think the question of who was the greatest female runner of all-time would have one universal answer.