I don't think anyone is saying it moves him up for sure. But the fact that those two horses have gone on to win some very important races speaks well to the quality of horses that he's beaten. I'm not sure how anyone can dispute that fact. While people can question the quality of competition that IWR was beating in NY, we can question how strong the Arkansas Derby was, we can question what was down in Louisiana....we can't question that Pioneer was beating some really good horses. Whether he will move up or down or stay the same is to be seen. But I don't think those subsequent performances by his vanquished foes hurts him at all and they would make anyone take a second look at him. I guarantee that if IWR and Papa Clem had come to the dirt and flopped, EVERYONE would be pointing to that and saying "see, you can't trust the form of those Cali horses on the junk." GUARANTEED.
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The real horses of the year (1986-2020)
Manila, Java Gold, Alysheba, Sunday Silence, Go for Wand, In Excess, Paseana, Kotashaan, Holy Bull, Cigar, Alphabet Soup, Formal Gold, Skip Away, Artax, Tiznow, Point Given, Azeri, Candy Ride, Smarty Jones, Ghostzapper, Invasor, Curlin, Zenyatta, Zenyatta, Goldikova, Havre de Grace, Wise Dan, Wise Dan, California Chrome, American Pharoah, Arrogate, Gun Runner, Accelerate, Maximum Security, Gamine
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