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Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
You know as well as I do that wins and losses are a poor measuring stick especially for middle of the road pitchers. Loshe was much better than Livan was last year.
Loshe- 192 innings 207 hits 57 bbs 122 k's 4.62 ERA hitters had a .279 avge against and .339 OBP
Livan- 204 Innings 247 hits 79 bbs 90 k's 4.93 era hitters batted .308 with a .371 OPB.
When you consider that Loshe played in Cincy and then Philly last year which are 2 stone cold hitters parks and considering that he played with an awful Cincy defense behind him for most of the year the edge is even greater. Livan used to K around 180 in a similar amount of innings, that drop is a horrible sign for a guy who allows as many hits as he does. He seems to be suffering from pitching 250 innings a year all these years. The Livan of 3 or 4 years ago is much better than Loshe ever was but he looks cooked.
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When they are both pitching for a bad team then record is a bit more of a factor. Livan's K's were way down and his WHIP was horrible yet he still managed an ERA close to Lohse's. Regardless, it isn't who is better, it is what they will cost. And if Lohse wants a multi-year deal then I think they are far better off bringing in Livan to be insurance on a one year deal.