Clearly there was no intention to come over?
 

Not sure I agree

Sar Race 10, watch the race. Should be the race queued up on the page, if not just click race 10 on the 27th.

https://www.nyra.com/saratoga/racing/replays#

I have absolutely no clue how Maggie Wolfendale says that the horse spooked and came over and the rider did not make the move himself. If that is what Ortiz said to her then he is full of it. You see the rider look over, not once but twice cause he wanted to be on the part of the track Andy says you needed to be on this weekend. He then says I am going while not in the clear and cuts off the other horse which could have been catastrophic but thankfully no one was hurt.

Man, you can hurt someone with that move.

This is a situation where the riders need to police themselves cause that was silly.

Interesting that of all the times Irad has been caught wide going into the first turn in his career, this would be the time he decides to try to murder someone. Couldn't have been the horse freaking out, which is painfully evident if you watch her strides, it must've been that Irad suddenly became the most dangerous rider in America. I say ban him for life.

lol, lil overkill there. He seems inside alot to me, and I have seen him push his way out, saw it earlier in the card I believe on another CB horse.

and then we have Drayden Van Dyke heard over 5 paths, and would have been ok if he had not bumped a horse off stride, DQ in the stake at Del Mar.

Then we have a rider not ride out a two year old for Baffert who was 2/5 and the betting public gets shafted as he was nailed on the wire.

Interesting day.

is there any video of the Nero race, it seems to be the front runner for worse ride of the year by what everyone is saying

nevermind I found it and will watch

Nero
 

I don't think it was a horrible ride by Garcia, but I can't tell if Garcia shut him down early of if Nero pulled himself up after he drew away initially in the stretch

its pretty bad, he never asked the hose really from the 1/8th pole then wrapped up on him when only a length so clear

i mean if you were a conspiracy theorist you would say the horse was pulled in some kind of scheme.

i just can't tell if he shut it down too early or if Nero pulled himself up

wouldnt you shake the reigns or show him the whip if he was doing that. He could have been 4 clear if he wanted, he was so over confident when he was only a little bit ahead...guess we will see if he is on him next time.

good point, remember Martin Garcia rode American P in his maiden race too which was a loss but I don't think he was to blame that time.

Probably will see Smith, or Espinoza on next

I see we've reached "jockeys are all devious crooks" hour. Must've been a bad day.

Garcia was overconfident and he won't be on the horse next time. He also amazingly didn't see a horse closing from 15 lengths behind up the rail. It was a great ride by Kent on a nice runner to beat him by a nose. And the horse did him no favors when he stopped to a gallop suddenly. I have a hard time believing Baffert or Coolmore is as apoplectic about it as the internet is.

Clearly the jockey MOVED the horse over. You can see it plain as day.

If I was a steward, I'd give him a six month suspension. I have no patience for that kind of riding.

The people that bet that horse got screwed though.

lol, man, your comment....yea baffert does not get upset at all with riders, he is very calm, a regular Mandella clone.

how about protecting the betting public? Dude should at least get 7 for that ride, cant have that happen, not with the shape this sport is in.

I'm all for that. Just stop with the tinfoil hat stuff.

What is tinfoil about it? There's no question that in other jurisdictions both Irad and Garcia would absolutely have the book thrown at them and then some. With the example of Irad, if he can do something like that 10 times and maybe get DQ'ed once with no or a small suspension, you can damn well bet he's going to continue riding that way.

I think you nailed it with the comment many riders will do what they can as long as they get away with it.

Under the guise of "did it cost a horse a placing" has allowed for a lot of latitude by the riders since the stewards dont dq a horse unless that standard has been met. I would prefer there still be a stiff penalty even if a horse is not dq'd.

In terms of hearding, I am fine with it as long as two things do not happen, you do not take the other horse off the path they are on and you dont bump them.

I would also be a fan of a "foul is a foul" dq...this would clean things up right quick.

careless riding can get people hurt. I made a post about another rider I thought was dangerous in socal, so this isnt some kind of vendetta.

The tinfoil part is pretending you can read the jockey's mind and laying out the absolute most cynical interpretation imaginable as fact. Saying that Irad was trying to hurt people and Garcia was stiffing his horse. Just disgraceful and embarrassing, coming from people who have probably never been on a horse in their lives.

Who said he was "trying" as intentionally trying to take down Davis...his move was careless and could have resulted, it was intentional that he was trying to get onto the rail.

Who said Garcia was stiffing the horse, I said you need to ride your horses out so it does not look suspicious to the many casual fans that watch these races.

read rather than set up straw man arguments.

I have worked with better horses than most, that much I am sure of.

Cute. Your insinuations were that Irad was willing to take Davis down just to get over to the rail (completely dismissing out of hand the horse freaking out, which is laughably apparent from the head-on) and that Garcia was more than just overconfident and may have "pulled the horse in some kind of scheme." Real brave to insinuate those things, then back off and pretend you're just playing devil's advocate. Again, embarrassing, and something that only the anonymity of the internet would allow.

I don't think it has anything to do with hiding behind the internet. We, let alone the stewards, have every right to question Garcia why he "failed to ride his horse to the finish" properly. Same goes for Irad and his careless/reckless riding; it is definitely not "laughably apparent" the horse spooked. Even if it seems more likely that the horse spooked than not, don't gloss over the fact that Irad is notorious for this type of riding in the first place.

its pointless discussing with you, the pretty pony forum is missing you.

And the OTB full of miserable derelicts blaming jockeys for every one of their losing bets is missing you.

Questioning rides is perfectly fine, and I do it plenty. But to definitively project these sinister motivations onto jockeys when there are more plausible explanations is just lame and irresponsible.

So you don't think there's an issue with the fact that something like this happens and most immediately cry foul towards Irad's tactics because one can easily imagine him doing that? I think that is the main point. Say it is clear cut that the horse spooked. The fact that a lot of individuals immediately assume Irad did it on purpose shows there is a problem with his riding style that sooner or later may unfortunately be devastating.

A lot of individuals? I counted two faceless people on a message board. Can you point to someone who put their name on suggesting Irad tried to saw off Davis on purpose?

he tried to go the rail on purpose, stop making this like it was some kind of assassination attempt.

there were many, but there is no reason to pull other peoples opinions into this simple discussion.

the most aggressive I will say was some guy named Kurt Hoover, doubt you ever heard of him.

Richard Migliore. He must be a person who has "probably never been on a horse in their lives", as you suggested.

I think he has the wrong interpretation, but yeah, at least he put his name on it and is someone with experience to speak from.

I wonder if he thinks Garcia stiffed Nero like all the internet detectives too.

So who has the right interpretation? Not faceless people or experienced people, so it must only be those that agree with you?

I haven't read any one on this thread say he was stiffed. I haven't said that, 10 pnt hasn't and neither Seattle. Rather, we are all questioning why Garcia rode in the manner that he did, regardless of whether it was deliberate or sheer overconfidence. I'll say it again, we have every right to question that ride just as it should be questioned by the stewards. To be not even touch an odds-on horse until it was too late is an egregious error and I can guarantee that in any other jurisdiction the 7 day ban that 10 pnt is suggesting would be incredibly LIGHT. Let me remind you that Douglas Whyte, a jockey who is 100x more accomplished than Garcia received a 1 month ban for stopping to ride TWO STRIDES too short of the wire.

Watching the replay, I can't see how someone would think that Irad did that purposely. Did he try to get his horse from the 10 post over to the rail somewhere midpack to try to save ground? Yes. Do many riders try to do that? Yes, and more probably should.

I just don't see him trying to steer the horse into Davis's horse, seems to me that Irad's horse was lugging in and he was trying to get the horse to go back left but the horse had its own ideas.

To me this is just not herding but rather a horse doing what it wants to do and a 112 lbs. or so guy who can't get his horse outside, not a rider riding unsafely to intimidate another horse to back off. Having said that the DQ was fair under the circumstances but I just don't agree that the rider should be punished for what appears to me to much more likely be an uncooperative horse instead of a dangerous ride.

I can't believe you didn't get the memo that Irad is a criminal and everyone knows it.

So, irrespective of this one race, you think he is a clean rider? Also, pretty sure that you are the only person in this thread to call anyone a murderer or criminal.

Wow just hear Richard Migliore's comments about the ride. He turned my post into words on Steve's show as the content is the same about rider error.

Hopefully those involved learned a valuable lesson.

I think he rides aggressively like every other successful jockey in New York. I don't think there's any evidence to suggest he's a dirty rider or is putting anyone in an abnormal amount of danger.

But that's beside the point. The ease at which people throw around accusations that jockeys are, at best, indifferent to potentially causing major injuries/deaths is just gross. If you think Irad is out there intentionally putting people in danger, that's on you to prove it, not me to disprove it. That's a very serious allegation and one that's much easier to make from behind a keyboard rather than on the back of a horse.

I don't think anyone here has said that. At least what I am trying to say is that his over aggressiveness, which has been built up in part by the stewards' softness towards him, increase the chances of a serious incident at some point. The next time he is stuck in traffic and decides to bull his way through...it takes a single bad step for catastrophe to occur. Do I think his aggressiveness is used in a manner to deliberately hurt another jockey? Absolutely f****** not, and please don't continue to put those words in my mouth because I have never said that.

Then Bafferts comments about Nero....he jumped off that question so fast. lmao.

Thought Mig was excellent today.

Appears Ortiz getting 5 day suspension..

As little as he said, was pretty clear what his thoughts were.

Truly embarrassing ride by Garcia.