Breeders Cup should only be held at
 

Belmont Park and Churchill Downs

will you please lay off the crack, you need to relax and stop trying to start ****

I agree 100%...

The BC at Lone Star was a nightmare, but when it was at CD, it was much better, because they can handle it...

It would be logistically impossible, but they should have the dirt races at CD and the turf at Belmont...

It was a real treat to have it at Arl. despite the weather. Don't fix what ain't broke.

Scav..

Actually, Jerry's not off the mark here... There's been plenty of discussion on that topic.. California and Florida are awkward because Euros have their winter coats in and racing in warm temps isn't fair to them, and the configurations are inconsistant at some of the "other" guest tracks...

A BEL-CD-'Guest Track' rotation is probably the way to go...

I know, but he is saying this stuff to start issues, like his poly thread earlier.

As far as my opinion on only Belmont and CD, I couldn't disagree with it more. The point of the BC is to give the fans racing at the highest level on one day. While shouldn't people in Texas (Lone Star) or Illinois (Arlington) get the unique opportunity to see this live, in their backyard. Think about this, 2004 was the ONLY TIME I could see a horse like Storm Flag Flying live, or Azeri, or Rock of Gibrator, without having to travel or pay an arm and a leg. The other minor part of the BC is to get attention on the sport and gain new fans, having it at only two places wouldn't do that

I agree 100%

That's what the 'guest track' portion of the rotation is for.. Santa Anita, Arlington, Lone Star once every 8-10 years is fine.. Maybe get Fairgrounds in that mix sometime soon.. It's not that different from the way things are anyway really.

i didn't read it that way but that rotation would be perfect

I like a rotation including Mountaineer every once and a while ;)

I will agree that Gulfstream has a pretty miserable win % for European horses. But what makes u say that California is unfair? Consider these numbers:

European horses have won seven of 36 races at Churchill (19.4%). They've won seven of 30 at Belmont (23.3%). They've won five of 22 at Santa Anita (22.7%). If u add in Aqueduct and Hollywood, here are the numbers:

Churchill-7/36 (19.4%)
California-8/43 (18.6%)
NY-8/37 (21.6%)

I don't see that as unfair at all. A couple of noses or heads here and there and the percentages could shift pretty easily. I've heard the argument for years about how the Europeans are at a disadvantage when the races are in the warm weather sites but I have seen too many big races from them, especially in California, to believe it's true. I think that to take the BC away from one of the top two racing centers in the country would be ridiculous.

Now that Gulfstream has gone through the renovation, are they pushing to get the BC one of these years? Alos, what about Del Mar possibly getting it one year? You could handle it like Lone Star did, have a special one month race meet to go along with the BC being hosted there.

I agree with the concept.
they are far and away the most fair locations for the event.
but I do think their is room for an occasional "guest" track.
Im talking like once every 5 years, so that it is an actual event.
kind of like how its a big deal when the US Open is held at a public course.

the only guest tracks that I think would be deserving of some consideration would be the 9f tracks WITH A DIRT COURSE (Arlington and Gulfstream).
forget about ever giving it to HolyPark again.
how the hell are you going to host a BC at a track that basically now has 2 turf courses and no dirt?

tracks that I have never been to that may deserve a shot would be Deleware and Colonial.
I dont know what the surronding areas are like so I dont know if they could host such an event.
I just know that everyone that goes to those tracks, seems to like them.


Repent

they are putting in poly.
where would the dirt horses run?
maybe you could let Del Mar run the BC turf races and freaking Turf Paradise in AZ run the BC dirt races.

Repent

exactly why they should do it there. they shouldn't run the bc at any racetrack that still has a conventional dirt surface.....including ch. downs and belmont park.
this is the biggest day in horse racing and the non-turf races should be run on the greatest invention mankind has made sense the wheel.......polytrack.:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

the only ppl who like polytrack are those that care more about the safety of horses than the racing of horses.
its crap.
we breed for dirt in this country.
thats why we have the best dirt horses in the world.
now we are taking away the surface that these horses' very existence is predicated on.


you like poly,
then go open up your very own polytrack breeding farm.
you can stand that great horse Great Hunter for $50 as the farm's main attraction.

Repent

KG,

My complaint with SA as a regular rotation host has been the outrageous advantage the track has given the West Coast horses when it's been run there as much as the weather. And of course last time at Arcadia there was forest fire smoke and ash to deal with...

How about:

Churchill
Belmont
Santa Anita
"Guest Track"
Churchill
Belmont
Arlington
"Guest Track"

then repeat.. SA and AP every 8 years.. BEL/CD every 4 years.. Woodbine, Lone Star, Monmouth every 12 years.. something along those lines..

wow i assumed everyone would know that i was being sarcastic. did you really think i believed that the bc races should be run on polycrap or that the stuff was the best invention sense the wheel....i was totally kidding.

we all care about the safety of the horses....but it is a dangerous sport. the polydudes want to make things safer by destroying the sport. to me....that's moronic.
sorry repent, i guess i should have made my sarcasm a little clearer.

I would love to see it in Europe one of these years, Dubai would be absolutely awesome, although I don't think they would get much US support if they did this

Anybody who replaces "since" with "sense" in a sentence whos advocating something gives you a pretty good idea that you shouldn't buy what he is selling.

sounds like a very good system to me....

Dude with all the guys and gals wearing purple sneakers drinking the Kool aid around here, its very hard to tell the difference. Welcome to the team, glad to have you on the side of those intelligent or street smart enough to spot a con job a mile away.
Notice the Nyers aint weighing in real heavily on the side of Poly.
Its because from the time we go to kindergarten they warn us to spot the con artists and scammers. If you aren't street smart in NY, some other kindergartener will scam you out of your cookies and milk.
A wise man told me once(trainer whose won a lotta huge races) than any time you get some English guys wearing suits trying to sell you something, that you should run away just as fast as you can, because its a scam.
The guy never once gave me advice that wasn't right. I just wish I had listened to more of it sooner.

as i told repent, i was being sarcastic, which i tried to indicate with all of my :eek: :eek: .

as for my foolish spelling.....i guess i'll give it some more :eek: :eek:'s
i am just not one of those people who goes back and reads my posts over and checks for spelling/grammatical mistakes before i post it.
i have to do that crap at work. here i just type and submit.

Same here...

I run enough spell check shiat here, why worry about it on this message board? LMAO

What about Monmouth Park in this rotation? They are located in the North East so you would not have the weather changes for the Euros. Also, they have a nice facility and are hosting the BC next year.

yeah i really shouldn't have brought it up though, because i don't want this thread to turn into just another polybackers vs. smart people debate. we already have enough threads like that.....let's get back to bc locations.....

Lets do everyone a favor and never hold it on the poly**** until CD and Bel sell out. :D

I LOVE your avatar Antitrust. Good choice;) :D

I guess I haven't seen this tremendous advantage for West Coast horses. Was it not the same way at Belmont when My Flag, Inside Information, Unbridled's Song, and Cigar all won in 1995? I think that naturally, when u have the races on one coast, the horses from that region will have an advantage. Part of it has to do with them being in their normal surroundings and some of it has to do with fewer out of town horses shipping. I just think that the best horses usually win the races and I think it would be wrong to not include SA in the normal rotation because Southern California is still one of the two biggest racing markets that we have along with NY.

BLAHHHH,
I wish this was the gong show because I'd put the gong on you as fast as i could swing the thing.
The dirt races out there are next to impossible for East Coasters to win.
You are talking about a place wheer Skywalker won the Classic, as did Arcangues, and Success Express and Action This Day(sorry Honu, truly I am,but..) won the juvenile races. Are you joking here or what?

You guys can just BITE ME! I liked when it was in Florida. I can actually attend one. Can't afford to travel and spend the big bucks like some of you do.

It should be at different tracks. I am not complaining when it is in NY, KY, Cali, etc...

Reason I think it should be at different tracks is so you don't have "Belmont-lovers" or "churchill-lovers" type horses that win.

Euros can get a body clip!

its a valid statement, having it at Gulfstream in Florida would be the worst thing possible. The idea of a guest track is something that wouldnt be that bad, if it were these 3

Santa Anita
Lone Star
Arlington--acutally Arlington can be rotated into the CD,BEL BC deal

Belmont and Cd have been the least biased tracks and horses ship form everywhere and win with all running styles, which is what makes them the best venues.

I agree Buffy...the purpose of creating the BC was to promote racing...you don't do that by restricting access! I haven't given up hope that someday...Penn National! When they bid out stuff like the olympics, all kinds of cities compete, they spend millions of dollars to build, construct, renovate facilities that are then subsequently put to good use long after the games are past...same with the BC! That should be the model, not some exclusive "good old boys club" consisting of the elite tracks! I have no problem with holding it in Europe or even...sigh, I hate saying it...Dubai but lets spread the wealth here first! A little creativity and a little less "we can't do that because..." would save this sport!

You guys go to a BC at a place like Lone Star and see how enjoyable it is standing in long lines and it's over 90's at the end of October...

CD is very convenient for me, but I would go as far as to just have it at Belmont...I can watch on TV, it's actually better that way...It's not about everyone having access, it's about the horses having the best chance to win and accomodating the attendees...If it was always at BEL, I would probably not go again, but big deal, it's not all it's cracked up to be anyway...

nothing was built at Arl but a bunch of rented bleachers. Trees were cut down and not replaced even though they had promissed to put them back.

Of course it is easier now to cut the lawn in the park areas but on days that are sunny and 90 plus it's miserable outside.

For those that haven't been to Saratoga you are surrounded by a virtual forest which greatly adds to the beauty and feel of the place.

I miss those damn trees!

Thanks!!! Steve helped me find it. After the Breeders Cup I will change it to a new winning picture of him!!! Go Berni Go! (that should be the ntra's new motto).

Here's a picture of the winner for you (no need to wait until AFTER.) :D

was that the last race that Perfect Drift finished first in? (just kidding.. i like that gelded Balletto).

Care to make a wager on PD and Berni? 10 bucks... whoever finishes ahead of the other at the wire wins.

Oh yea.. I'll take Berni ;)