Discreet Cat earns 115 Beyer Speed Figure
 

..for that public workout in the Jerome....ouch....

He and Bernardini seem to be on a different planet from a talent standpoint...period..

Its a shame if they skip the BC...what a race it would be between he and his stablemate, whom both may be 2 of the best horses we've seen in a while...

Fitting time for Invasor to get sick...not sure if it was a fever or McLaughlin reading Bernardini's PPs on why he isn't running in the JCGC Saturday....Either way, now Bernardini has an even easier prep only having to drill Dylan Thomas before the BC Classic....Frankly, Discreet Cat is the only intriguing horse out there that actually has the god-given ability to beat Bernardini in the Classic IMO, so we as racing fans need to hope that they choose to run Discreet Cat in the BC too...what a showdown it would be....:)

I just hope Godolphin pays you....... something.

There is only one reason why I would for Discreet Cat to run in Louisville on November 4th, and that is that I could see possibly the greatest race between two potential superhorses of all time live and in person.

I really think that they should put him in the Cigar Mile though as I have already stated like 10 times.

I literally jumped out of my burka when I saw his beyer.

ALLAH AKBAR!!!

And of course Invasor is not sick! You'd play sick too if you had to face the exceptional horses from the savior of Islam.

Man, I just butchered that post with incoherent thoughts and speech...It's getting late and I've still got 1 more paper to go...

I wish I was...I read your post about Discreet Cat...funny, but you clearly aren't fans of theirs or any of the 'big boys' of racing, which is fine....I'm usually an underdog type of guy, but in this case the two horses that I think are the best horses in the world (and I have thought this for some time now..not just jumping on this bandwagon as of last month - but most know this) are these two colts - both owned by the Sheik..

Its funny that because I predicted this assault on America in May in a story I wrote that it makes everybody believe that I have to be such a supporter of them....I also picked the Yankees to win the World Series and I HATE those mother freakers...

People always have something to say...its natural to knock in this game...A wise old Fair Grounds-based trainer once told me that, "You can't be involved in this game unless you were born with a great ability to knock other people"

...you know, he's proving himself right on that statement everyday I live and work in this industry...and no, I'm no different..I just think the level of negativity is hilarious at times :D

By the way, Joel, when I mentioned a horse's Beyer figures recently in the course of a discussion you responded in a semi-horrified manner that you couldn't believe someone as supposedly knowledgable as myself would pay any mind to the Beyer figures.....but somehow now that one legitimizes a Godolphin horse they are meaningful to you.

So, Joel, which is it?

I'm also a little curious as to how you already know his Beyer number.

Hey, do you remember our bet...DC vs. Corinthian. Can we pretend that I never said that Corinthian could actually beat DC?:D Besides, you know the REAL reason why I made that bet....

Oh yeah, and mother freaker is a cute word Joel;)

Shhh...It's a conspiracy...

Nah, I'm just playing with you BTW. Cajun, and some of the others aren't on the board to joke around with me tonight, and I'm in the mood. You'll have to excuse me tonight;)

Now, you boys can have ya'lls DC thread back. I'm done for a little while.

:cool: Yep, and you wouldn't have been in the capacity to hold up on your part of the wager either had they faced off ;)

Nope, not at that time, but I will in four weeks if you were talking about location...

If it was the other kind of capacity, I'm young and will do as I please... I have my whole life ahead of me...

Besides, I need to have a little fun with the year that I have had...:p

If your still wondering that BTW it is posted on the DRF's web site Just click on the tap Leaderboard then click again at the top "Best Beyer"



RP

Pretty sure BTW is practically the one posting them there. (*cough*)

I think he meant that CR had it before it was up there on public display somehow...

Joel,

That was a disgusting display of talent. I hope they decide to run him in the BC Mile. I just think it would be great for racing to see him square off with Gorgeous George.

BTW, I know you have been with these two since the start of their careers.

From what I hear, Goldolphine is going to skip the BC with Discreet Cat. I hear it is about an 85% chance the horse is going to go in the Cigar Mile. They will keep him around until the Dubai World Cup and then we prob won't ever see him again.

Godolphin may have Discreet Cat but us NY'ers have Funny Cide and Dave :p

Isn't there an engagement ring on your finger? :p

There is another "Cat" out there that could be a threat to either or both at any distance. If he ever returns remember Surf Cat.

There's my girl. Yep there's an engagement ring, but that doesn't mean that I can't go out to eat, chat, and have a good time:p :D

Besides, I'm not married yet, and won't be for a long while even if I do stay with this guy. I'm not rushing into that...

Can't blame you there. Been there and done that. Stay away from cheaters... they're no fun. :eek:

Are you going to the BC Cajun? I'll behave while I'm there...maybe. I know that I'll be drunk off my a s s most of the time, eating at all the nice restaurants, and, of course, playing the ponies while I'm there. It's going to be a good time.:D It is a much needed vacation.

the Beyer seems a little inflated to me
they are two very good 3 y/o's
it would be sporting of the Shaw to enter both in BCC
I'd like to see a Volponi type win
damn did PG pass? I must have missed that

Nope, unfortunately, I won't be going. I'll be busy in November... lots of Nascar races that I'll probably be going to. :D

I got lucky in that my schedule let up. I didn't think I was going to be able to go until last week... I figured I that I would go to the BC instead of to the Derby, although I may get to go to the Derby next year as well before I take off to a four year university...

Where are you going to go to school?

I don't know yet. I just know that I'm getting the h e l l out of NC. It's not that I'm running away from the place, but I'm running to something...

You know, my doctors in Danville misdiagnosed me with rheumatoid arthritis. I went to Duke and all my tests were negative and normal. The doctor at Duke literally diagnosed me with stress from not being able to ride my horses due to college. That's crazy, but he's the expert. Well, maybe that's what I am trying to run to...wherever the horses are is where I will most likely end up.

Hate to break it to you, but NC isn't a bad state compared to most. Florida is rough...

You think it will be better, but when you get to a place where you have very few friends and family, you'll miss what you were running from to begin with.

I don't know... less than a month after I got to NYC for college (knowing absolutely no one) my aunt wrote me a sweet letter that ended with, "You sound like you're finally where you belong." And lo these many years later, she was right. She usually is.

Don't get me wrong, I looooove my family. But I love them even more from a distance. :)

Kentucky, if you're supposed to be someplace else, you'll know it when you get out. And if you're not, you'll figure that out, too. I guess it's just different for each person. Cajun, are you still pretty close to where you grew up?

And so I'm not totally off thread-- I'd be happy to see DC in the Cigar Mile... give me another excuse (reason) to go to Aqueduct in the winter. :)

Nah, NC isn't a bad state, but I like traveling and experiencing new things. I'm a very restless person. My little sister is just like me, and she just took off for the Navy. She is in boot camp right now. We both want to see the world.

I won't miss not having a racetrack in NC, or the fact that I live an hour away from the closest stable. However, I know that I will get lonely sometimes and will miss my family. Luckily, I can always come back.

I've only lived in NC for about three years, and most of my family and friends live over an hour away from me. Besides my mom, I don't get to see them very much because of my hectic schedule. I don't miss where I used to live in VA one bit.

I'm going to follow my dreams, and they aren't going to happen here in NC. Like I said, I'm not running away from NC, but am following my heart. Right now, I feel like I am boxed in because I'm tied down at this community college and I have to graduate in May so that I can go to a four year school. I want to go find my dream job in the racing business, and I'll do what it takes to achieve my goals.

I do not see him accelerating on the grass like he does on the dirt. Interesting enough,l he does miove like a turf horse with his high knee action and sort of "bicycle style" bio mechanics, but his pedigree is strictly for dirt IMO...Now, can he be a graded stakes winner on the turf?..Sure, he's talented to do probably about anything - But, can he beat a specialist like George Washington in his first start over the surface next month at Churchill Downs?...I seriously doubt it.....a little too much to ask...George Washington has some serious turf class...Fallon and Kinane have both said that he is one of the best horses they've ever gotten on - which says alot coming out of that camp...

I agree it would be fun to see him somewhere on BC day, but the Classic would fit him best IMO...If they turned him back to six furlongs after going a mile, I'm not sure I'd like him as much as progressing in distance...Don't get me wrong, he could win the Sprint because of his natural high cruising speed, but i think it would be a much harder race for him because any misfortune is hard to overcome in that race because it is a full field of horses blitzing the entire way...the Mile will be the same way...horses that win those two races are ones who can overcome some sort of obstacles and since Discreet Cat hasn't been tested yet this year I would question how he'd handle having to go too wwde, race too fast early, or get stopped and wait for a hole to open, etc. in a race of that caliber...it usually requires some luck and a battle-tested horse on top of being good to win those two races....positioning in the 1 1/4-mile Classic is so much easier, as is the pace scenario and room for error....

I think if they run him in the BC Classic that he will be no worse than second behind his stablemate...i really think so.....his dam won the 1 1/4-mile Alabama at Saratoga when she was 3 and she is by stamina influence Private Account - so I think the classic disatnce won't be an issue...he has already embarrassed horses like Simpatico Bribon, Invasor, etc.going 1 1/8 miles in the UAE Derby....

My best guess is that they do run him in the Cigar Mile at AQU and go back to Dubai and run him in the WOrld Cup against Bernardini in a World Cup that would actually be worth watching for once in the last few years IMO..There was originally talk of hin shipping to Churchill DOwns to train ad actually pre-entering in the Classic ONLY as a back up if something were to happen to Bernardini to cause him to defect at the last minute....Also, Discreet Cat would run in the 1 1/8-mile Clark (G1) at Churchill Downs later in October since he would be on the grounds as a BC Classic back-up....

But i guess the Cigar Mile looks like the likely spot now...I think by hearing their logic that they belive that he is at his best a Miler, which they may be right about that....

Whatever the hell he is, he is a freak and i'm just glad horse racing enthusiests like ourselves have a chance to see horses of this magnitude run....you know, say what you will about the Shieks, but the bottomline is that they have the money and love for racing to keep horses like Bernardini and DC in training for a while because they could care less about getting that Huge stallion deal....money is no object, that is why in a way this is a good thing that they own the best horses in the world...it gives our sport a better chance to create stars and an identity in the mainstream IMO....

I'll say this, i is VERY clear to me that DC has and willhave some serious health issues at some point probably in the near future....he is NOT a pretty mover at all....so if you enjoy watching him run, be glad the Sheiks have him because they wil get him right and keep running him as long as it is nothing really bad and controllable with time.....Think about if some ownership like Cash is King owned the horse and he had the LEAST little thing go wrong with him....he would be retired and sold to a stud farm in a heart beat....thyat is a fact..

Another interesting theory to chew on is this:

I would bet that DC is worse off health wise right now than Afleet Alex ever was when they retired him.....not knocking those guys..just an example I chose to use....the Sheiks have the non-money-driven interest in our sport that will keep DC in the game well beyond any other owner would...that you can be sure of...

They sure have killed horses at a higher rate than most owners. Oh snap!!

Don't be so picky.

And Joel, please, stop reiterating that Pretty Discreet won the Alabama as though that gives Discreet Cat distance breeding. Do you remember that Alabama?

Nah, I don't think so...per proportion of how involved they are, they usually do VERY well by the horses they have in looking out for their helath and best interest...Electrocutionist had a heart attack and for anybody who understands horse health knows that it is totally genetic and a defection he was born with...that would have been uncontollable the greatest horseman in the world....Dubai Millanium and Tempera both died from non-racing related stuff....I can't think of any of their horses that have died on the track in recent memory...they do a great job doing whats in the horse's best helath interest these days and I really think that is a primary reason that they are enjoying the high level of success they are now....just my opinion..

A prime example is Discreet Cat.....if MOST American trainers had him (I won't mention names), DC would have been thrust into the Derby...Hell, the Shieks would have probably dne that too a few years ago...But now they are more disciplined because they have learned that if you do right by the horse that things will usually play out the best way for you in the long run....

You cannot acuse them of being bad horsemen...thats for sure...they have not always done the smartest things considering the capital they invest (Coolmore out-managed them for YAESR with less oney invested) but they are getting better and smarter now...

Part of the reason they also didn't have the level of success that other big owners had for a long time was because they didn't cheat....I commend their honesty and it is paying dividends now...

Bottomline:

He CRUISED in the 1 1/8-mile UAE Derby over some pretty heavy hitters, and I coud care less how she did it, she is a PRIVATE ACCOUNT....there are very few more stamina-laden influences in our game.....I believe Discreet Cat is the best horse in the world around one turn and that Bernardini is the best horse in the world around two turns - thus I think the further they go the more advantage Bernardini has over DC (1 1/4 miles), but I rerally believe DC is classy enough to still be second in the BC Classic - even if it isn't his best distance....

Not accusing them of anything but I have no idea how you can insist they are necessarily any more innocent than everyobody else ( other than your unnatural affection for them ).

When you figure out how Testimony finished six lengths behind Discreet Cat, and two lengths in front of Invasor, let me know.

Bernadini has been annoited way too early. If you see something special in his ability to warrant this kind of assessment, tell us exactly what it is. He has yet to be pushed. Until a horse is pushed by COMPETETION, I withhold judgement unless I see something physically clear about his running mechanics that makes him superior.

LITF showed me some clear mechanical signs. So did Mineshaft. I can tell you exactly what I saw. Smarty Jones, I saw a great runner by the way he ran the Belmont, mechanically, the aforementioned were better to my eye than Smarty. What are Bernardini's mechanics that warrent the adulation, cause he has yet to be pushed?

I agree with you in that DC is not a pretty mover. As I have said in other posts, he runs like a sore, unsound horse, and he hits the ground really hard with his front end. He has a snappy action instead of a fluid action. That is why I don't think that he would ever be a good turf horse even with his high knee action. Now, I think Bernardini could run on the turf...

I don't know Joel about Afleet Alex. Afleet Alex's injury was pretty bad. I think that they had every intention of running him until he experienced that condylar fracture. I believe that the screw did him in. I think that they knew in the back of their minds that he was finished when he suffered that injury, and tried to bring him back to please the public. It was the best thing for Alex to retire him. I would have retired him too:). It came to my attention in hindsight that the horse was mismanaged a little bit, and probably had some minor issues going on that turned into a big issue.

I don't know about Cash is King's other horses...

Really...." He CRUISED in the 1 1/8-mile UAE Derby over some pretty heavy hitters "...you must be once again referring to that heavy hitter Testimony who other than a couple inexplicable performances in, according to you, drug-free Dubai couldn't be competitive with 35 claimers in the US...or perhaps you haven't noticed his two recent performances....if you can even call them that. Give me a break. If you are going to in any way insist that the real Invasor showed up that day, and for that matter any of the other supposed good horses ( including the one who's trainer claims his horse was doped ), then I suggest you get medical attention.

I'm not saying he doesn't necessarily have some distance in his pedigree, but to say about Pretty Discreet's Alabama victory, which YOU have cited more than once to argue Discreet Cat's distance pedigree, " you could care less how she did it " is ridiculous and, frankly, beneath you. Or, I suppose, you think Conquistador Cielo's wire to wire romp in the mud in the Belmont Stakes solidified him as a true mile and a half horse.

Ya know, even Godolphin has expressed serious concerns about his distance limitations....and I KNOW you care what they think.

The only thing that was good about that Alabama win was that it caused a monster carryover at the Spa. Other than that I'd have to say it may have been the worst edition in history.