Invasor, Excitement?
 

We have heard about the great accomplishments of Lava Man, SA "Cap, HOGC, Pac Classic, Bernardini - Preakness, Jim Dandy, Travers. All great accomplishments and very worthy of all the praise they are receiving.

But Invasor is on the verge of, IMO, of accomplishing something just as if not more special - The Pimilco Special, The Suburban, The Whitney and possible the Jockey Club Gold Cup. That is a super horse type year. And yet there is little to no talk of this.

I definitely agree that he is underappreciated. Bernardini will not have an easy time in the Jockey Club Gold Cup.

he is also the Urguyanian three year old champion,

i think he was undefeated over there,

FMC would know, as he alerted the group to his first run in america months ago. not many remember though, because to recognize that, you have to forget about yourself for a while.

I think people really hold the Sun King thing against him....it's like dating a real tool and your friends never letting you live it down. LOL

Instead of saying that Sun King ran the race of his life they want to say Invasor isn't very good. Glass half full vs. glass half empty....

Bernardidni this and Bernardini that,,

i am sick about hearing of a horse who has yet to defeat a grade1 winner and yet to defeat an older horse.

ya he looked good with his jockeys silks flowing in the extreme breeze and some view that as speed, i view it as windy that day.
some say he defeated BARBARO and BLUGRASS CAT, i say ya, but they both broke down while racing him, so these are moot comparisons.

what we have is a three year old who picked his races to run in, picking ones he knew he could win, and in those races his formidable competition runs lame.

People keep forgetting that the Preakness field (even without Barbaro) still had Brother Derek(a G1 winner by the way) and sweetnorthernsaint.. both very solid horses that were soundly defeated. Although it's true bernie has yet to be tested against older horses.

What is the point of the last part of that sentence?

what we have is a three year old who picked his races to run in, picking ones he knew he could win, and in those races his formidable competition runs lame.

I dont agree at all Sec. He hasnt ducked a single horse and in 12 days he takes on the 1st or 2nd handicap horse in the country. Its not his fault Barbaro broke down and SNS and Brother Derek werent at their best. The Dwyer was simply a prep for the Travers that I agree came up very weak, but its not his fault. Hes doing what any really good 3 year old does from May through Oct, beat up on fellow 3 year olds that are either tired from the Triple Crown or just not all that talented.

I can understand you feeling he is a bit overhyped. But he'll get his big test next weekend and that should answer many of the people doubting him or gloating about him.

invasor is certainly a bit forgotten. all the press in the east is on bernardini, and in the west you have lava man....leaving invasor as the monkey in the middle. horse has one defeat on an otherwise perfect, globe-trotting record. that one loss was to discreet cat in dubai, and that after leaving south america and going to florida, and then shipping to dubai. he was perfect before that trip, and is perfect since.

i'm looking forward very much to this race. yeah, he beat sun king...maybe he wasn't at his best after the spring he had and 'bounced', yet he still gutted out the win--after all, how many horses ship like that, and then run in the pimlico special for instance? let's not forget, discreet cat was already in dubia, only shipped here (not there and back), and just made HIS return. and then there's henny hughes, shipped over and back. how many starts has he had since arriving? well, you see my point.

I know it. I love all three horses. And how many horses in history have pulled off the Pim Special, Suburban, Whitney and JCGC? To me that would be an absolute amazing feat!!!!!

hell of a year...i much prefer a thread like this than one denigrating the horses that are running. seems every year their are people who only criticize these horses, and decry their lack of talent and wish only for the good old days.
these are the good old days!!

i remember in years past that people would say the horses weren't as good....and now we compare today's horses to those (good) horses!! go figure.

lava man, bernardini and invasor are having the time of their life. how many races this year between the three of them??? two losses out of the lot!

I know it. It is too bad either Bernardini or Invasor will have a loss on the the 7th. I wish all three would race this weekend. Boring race year? some say.. this is absolutly fantastic. Just think about it You have the Best from the West and Two Beasts from the East. It doesn't get any better than this.

Invasor was the Uruguayan Triple Crown winner and HOY. He came here, to Kieran's barn in FLA over the winter. From there he went to Dubai where he ran 4th to Discreet Cat in the UAE Derby, his only loss. He returned to the US and won 3 G1's.
Not bad.

and some healthy competition coming from europe. i'm very anxious to see what david junior can do....change of surface and such, but he's a good horse as well, and you can't ignore him.
this race saturday, race of the year (to this point) imo!

My thoughts exactly, he is getting overlooked. To me he has shown that he is a warrior, Bernardini has looked brilliant but I think people make mistakes in judgement when they see the easy fast wins and just assume he will race even faster when pushed hard due to a challenge. I've seen many times when a horses fastest races figurewise are earned in easy unchallenged gallops.

Also I feel people are making too much of the close win over Sun King. Invasor had the worst of that race and still had enough to hold of Sun King who ran his best race and also had it set up well for him.

I am really looking forward to this race, and this match-up in particular.
I'm taking a stand with Invasor because his figures match up well with Bern's and like I said they were earned more in battles which is more difficult and the price will be relatively attractive. We'll see.

Don't get me wrong Bern has done nothing wrong and I'm not knocking him. If he dispatches Invasor with ease, well there won't be anything anyone can say about him.

[quote=Linny]Invasor was the Uruguayan Triple Crown winner and HOY. He came here, to Kieran's barn in FLA over the winter. From there he went to Dubai where he ran 4th to Discreet Cat in the UAE Derby, his only loss. He returned to the US and won 3 G1's.
Not bad.[/QU

And not just three Grade I's Three of our countr'y more prestigious Grade I's with one more to go which may be the most prestigous one of them all. I think that is much more special feat than what both Lava Man and Bernardini have accomplised.

I don't get the "disappointment" people have over the potential BCC field.

The undisputed top East coast and undisputed top West coast older horses as well as the top 3 yo in training plus some super "outsiders" from Europe and here.

I just hope they all hold together and are in top form for the race.

i know its not his fault, but it happened and it diminishes the victory, to say it doesn't is to ignore the obvious.

Invasor may be hampered in peoples' perception by his tendency to win my average margins. He doesn't seem to be the type to "blow them away" but always does as asked.

By example, Tiznow was a grinder, FuPeg- his contemporary- had a flashier style and tends to be more memorable. Let's face it Tiz was a better racehorse.

Hiya Blocky!!! Nice to see you havent changed at all....what does WW2 have to do with Invasor and Bernardini? Wait, I really dont care...

Is that suppose to upset me Blockhead? Everybody knows who, and more importantly what you are....you want to display your ignorance like some perverse badge of honor that's up to you...you came here looking for a fight as always...isn't it enough that everyone makes fun of you at ESPN? I warned you about your tirades...they don't upset me but they do you no good!

Revisionist history at it's pinnacle. I guess you missed history class and had to rely on the cliffnotes.

No no, he just makes it up as he goes along.

All this hype and a 40-1 shot will beat both of them and i am gonna laugh my as s off!:D

It would be hard to make up something as wildly incoherent as some of what he's written in this thread. I loved the pagan rant:

That has a kind of weird beatnik ring to it, or maybe something a Zen-chimp would come up with.

--Dunbar

DaHoss, Blocky doenst joke around. He'll back this barely coherent and asinine post 100% whenever he returns. As for the 2nd part of your comment, I'm not going to come out and call the Blockinator 'stupid', but lets just say, you'd be surprised....

Unfortunately, it gets worse! My hope is that this guy just has a perverted sense of humor cause if he really is serious...man, he needs a lot of help. Sometimes you run into someone on the net that you think..."this guy can't be for real"...with Blockhead...I'm afraid, he really is like this!

STEVE - YOU HAVE GOT TO Stop the Madness!!
 

Dear Steve,

This is more of an editorial:

A a fan of your "former" website, who love's your radio program, enjoy's the cue at the SPA, and especially enjoy listening and reading you're work and handicapping articles and just plain old hanging out shooting the breeze with you, I am having a difficult time with many of the current discusions threads. There appears to be lots of Bravado and insensitive types who enjoy putting people down others as they can hide behind a screen name and do it annonomously. It is great to talk horses and disagree, but then we get into WWII discusions put downs by people who have no idea of what they speak, people putting people down by being obnoxious over and over. We should ignore the childish behavior but I thought I'd take a crack at trying to get the website forum back to its intended roots and thats to discuss horse racing, wagering, ownership, training, jockey's (another brilliant discussion HEY MY GUY GOMEZ WON ANOTHER 3 Races so I'm a Genious- Your Guy JOHNN V sux...)

I know you don't have time to police this, but as you read the site we get more into Bravado speak and less and less intelligent horse speak and handicapping discussions with merit.

Perhaps you can set aside a thread for the mindless discussions and monitor the users some to get this back to a civil discusion of points / counterpoints instead of put downs and insults. Or at least lets have one dedicated thread to intelligent discussion about horse racing and handicapping, which would be more of a reflection of the type of person and human being that I know that you are rather than what is running rampant throughout the site today. It's hard to weed out the good stuff from the crap anymore.

NC Tony

Tony, Steve has done that already. It seems that people bicker quite frequently on almost every thread, and I would imagine that it gets tough for Steve to decipher the good from the bad.

Thanks for the reply
 

Knowing Steve I sure he would try to do that. I'm in and out of this site so it's hard to keep up, and once you get into the mindless stuff and insults, It kind of turns you off from moving on to more. I know that's not what Steve has intended.

With the BC coming up and some of the best handicap races of the year, we should have some excellent discussions about handicapping.

I will do whatever I can to to help Steve!!

I thought perhaps I could cause a mini revolt to take back this site and get this back to where it should be, A first class site to discuss Horeracing.!!

NC Tony

Tony, Steve is trying to limit the BS but it's nearly impossible to keep up with every thread every day, esp. when an argument can explode from one innocuous (or in this case ridiculous) post.
Bethani

Hey Paul!

He was undefeated over there, indeed! He was also triple crown winner there.

His only defeat came at last year's UAE Derby on Dubai.

NC Tony, he can't police it with all the other things he has going on. Its next to impossible.
Many don't appear to want to talk horse racing. Its a social circle for people who wanna tell us about other things.
I'd wish they'd stick to the off topic section.

It was THIS year's UAE Derby, 2006, won by Discreet Cat. He was eligible as a Southern Hemisphere 3yo.

Nc Tony,
Quite frankly I'm stunned! You mean there others besides me who find guys who take the time to compile a list of all a guys losing mounts in a week, then when asked to cite one bad ride that the jockey gave, says oh I didn't see any of those.
The irony of morons like that posing as people who know anything about the game at all is not lost on me either.
What you have a is a bunch of guys who never start threads about anything, because they don't have any original thoughts or enough knowledge of the game to say anything worthwhile. What these guys do is read threads looking for fault with something that someone says. They contribute ZERO to the place yet try to assasinate others who do. They are the very worst type of trolls on the net, the kind who attempt to masquerade as non trolls. At least the trolls who come out and admit they are trolls have the guts to do that.
There is nothing more useless than folks who never have anything relevant or educational to say, who just sit around reading threads attempting to find fault with those who do.
But you can't blame Steve NC Tony, asking him to sit around all day long and monitor every thread is not reasonable.

You´re right! My bad...

I know its unfashionable to bring up weights, but Sun King WAS getting some weight from Invasor at Saratoga. And Sun King's Woodward was quite a good run, considering that NOTHING was closing on that track that day. Remember also that Sun King was a nose behind the best sprinter/miler in NY in the Met Mile as well, so he is not lacking in quality.

PA,
Sun King's style often makes him a bridesmaid. His races against Silver Train and Invasor were both sparkling efforts which would have netted him a win in one or both races in other years.
His last race was much better than it appeared. There was a strong, strong speed bias that day and his 3rd place effort, while seemingly mediocre, was better than that. he was the only horse in the race who made up any ground, period. He also had the right to be a tad bouncy off that huge Whitney.
I realize he only has two shots left, but I think one of those shots may be his shot, and many players have been quitely awaiting the opportunity off that last race to cash a ticket on him, or for him to at least split Invasor and Bernadini in the JCGC in the exacta.