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-   -   Impressive looking South American import set to make US debut in Clement Hirsch (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47756)

Calzone Lord 08-02-2012 09:35 AM

Impressive looking South American import set to make US debut in Clement Hirsch
 
Amani is entered in the Clement Hirsch on Saturday at Del Mar.





She's only faced females once beyond a mile -- and when she did, she took a 10 runner Grade 1 race by offically 28.5 lengths -- though it shows just a 25 length win for that race in the DRF.

Oddly, she's not an early speed horse -- like most horses who fracture races and win by large margins tend to be.

She's a deep closer. Here is the video of her 28.5 length Grade 1 win. She closed from 9th position and was about as many as 12 to 15 lengths off of the early pace.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IKhD...eature=related


Amani goes for Sumaya Us Stables. They also owned Wild Spirit ("The filly from Chile") Wild Spirt was also a champion 3yo filly in Chile. She was 6-for-10 lifetime in Chile before coming to Frankel's barn and racing in America.

Without lasix, she made her US Debut a winning one in the Shuvee with an easy win over You and Smokn' Frolic and ran a 106 Beyer.

In Wild Spirit's 2nd start in this country, she ran first-time-lasix and won the $750,000 Delaware Handicap by 6 lengths over Take Charge Lady, getting a 110 Beyer. Wild Spirit easily took the Grade 1 Ruffian Handicap with a 109 Beyer two races later.

Oddly, Neil Drysdale is not going to run her on lasix Saturday. CJ, what is the stat of imports on Lasix versus imports who run here without lasix?

Clip-Clop 08-02-2012 09:54 AM

Good lord that was impressive to watch.

MaTH716 08-02-2012 09:59 AM

What was that, like a 5 turn race?

cmorioles 08-02-2012 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord (Post 879798)
Oddly, Neil Drysdale is not going to run her on lasix Saturday. CJ, what is the stat of imports on Lasix versus imports who run here without lasix?

Horses with Lasix are a much better bet.

Calzone Lord 08-02-2012 10:28 AM

Here's the horse who finished 2nd by 28.5 legnths in that Grade 1 race. She just finished a good 3rd at Del Mar in a $73,000 ALW race a few days ago:





She's basically a solid 85 Beyer type on turf for a low percentage trainer.

Interestingly, her sire was a plodding son of A. P Indy that Pletcher trained who HATED grass. The broodmare sire Stuka won the Santa Anita Handicap in 1994 via DQ of champion older male The Wicked North. He never raced on turf, but had a pedigree for it.

Calzone Lord 08-02-2012 10:35 AM

The best recent horse to come out of Chile was Lido Palace.

Here he is winning the first of his two Woodwards -- beating Tiznow and Albert The Great:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzZmSndYUJY


Here's Lido Palace's best losing effort. Finishing in a photo with Street Cry for 2nd in Left Bank's super fast Whitney Handicap win.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3k73AXxl3eY


That was Left Bank's last race, he dropped dead after it. He was probably the best performer Todd Pletcher has ever trained in his entire career.

King Glorious 08-02-2012 05:48 PM

What can you tell us about Quick Casablanca, the horse that ran second to her in her last race? I think there are a couple of grade one wins on her record since then too right?

Calzone Lord 08-02-2012 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 879952)
What can you tell us about Quick Casablanca, the horse that ran second to her in her last race? I think there are a couple of grade one wins on her record since then too right?

Yes -- after Amani destroyed Quick Casablanca in the Chile St Ledger in her most recent race -- Quick Casablanca came back and won his next start at 24/1 odds over Argentina's Horse of the Year Expressive Halo (best horse in South American right now)

Here's the video of that race: It's a 400K stake and South America's most important weight-for-age event.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Qa9gBUBESs

King Glorious 08-02-2012 07:09 PM

All of the signs are pointing to this Amani as being a serious race horse. I'm looking forward to seeing her more than the Whitney or Vanderbilt or any other race this weekend. The fact that she hasn't been out in such a long time plus the fake dirt reserves me just a little but I'm still anxious to see her.

Calzone Lord 08-02-2012 07:20 PM

Drysdale is generally a poor layoff trainer.

Also, the horse is running without lasix and giving a slight competitive advantage away for no reason.

She has the most impressive South American form of any filly I've ever seen -- but I'll watch one.

A. P. Indy was 5th at Woodbine in a racce dominated by two hapless Canadian horses when Drysdale brought him back from just a 3+ month layoff after winning the Belmont. He eventually rebounded and won Horse of the Year.

LARHAGE 08-03-2012 03:26 AM

I hope she's more ready than Fly Lexus Fly.

Calzone Lord 08-03-2012 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LARHAGE (Post 880021)
I hope she's more ready than Fly Lexus Fly.

She's A LOT more horse than Fly Lexus Fly.

Fly Lexus Fly was a nice dominant horse in a region where scarcely a decent allowance horse is ever seen. He was a faster version of Tomcito and still has a chance to prove himself a good horse over here.

Amani is unquestionably the best South American filly in a long, long time...and the dirt racing in South America is generally a lot better than the turf racing.

How she handles the new climate and comes back from the long layoff and all that remains to be seen.

Some fillies like Bayakoa, Riboletta, Paseana, Wild Spirit etc. etc. will thrive and get a lot better here, some will struggle to reproduce their South American form. It always helps if these imports have a trainer who has some magic to them.

Calzone Lord 08-03-2012 09:20 AM

Here a few other good ones to come out of these series of races in Chile.

Puerto Madero (like Lido Palace, was Horse of the Year in Chile) he was beaten in the St Ledger -- that's the race Amani dominated against the males in her final start in Chile.



He was an in-and-outer -- but was very good when right. His best moment came when he won the Donn Handicap over Behrens and Silver Charm.



Cocoa Beach had a very similar early form -- she was undefeated in Chile -- but never won anything more than a Grade 3 there.





She was a nice 3-surface horse. In her 2nd US start, she beat our hapless champion Ginger Punch in a Grade 1 on dirt.

In her 3rd US start, she traveled cross-country and finished 2nd to Zenyatta over the same track where Zenyatta won the Classic at the following year.

In her 4th US start, she won a Grade 1 race on turf over 3-time Grade 1 winner Precious Kitten.

my miss storm cat 08-03-2012 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 879995)
All of the signs are pointing to this Amani as being a serious race horse. I'm looking forward to seeing her more than the Whitney or Vanderbilt or any other race this weekend. The fact that she hasn't been out in such a long time plus the fake dirt reserves me just a little but I'm still anxious to see her.

If she's anything like We Can Seek turned out to be I can't wait to see what names you call her. :D

Hope she's all that.

Calzone Lord 08-03-2012 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my miss storm cat (Post 880103)
If she's anything like We Can Seek turned out to be I can't wait to see what names you call her. :D

The expectations for her have to be a ton higher than they were for We Can Seek.





We Can Seek was a fairly useful plodder for Mark Henning. He finished 4th in the Whitney Handicap won by Invasor -- ahead of a few good also-rans like Premium Tap and Flower Alley.

my miss storm cat 08-03-2012 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord (Post 880111)
The expectations for her have to be a ton higher than they were for We Can Seek.

I was expecting the second coming, I'm embarrassed to say.

King Glorious 08-03-2012 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my miss storm cat (Post 880130)
I was expecting the second coming, I'm embarrassed to say.

There's no way you could have seen the foreign form of that horse and expected anything here. No way possible.

cakes44 08-03-2012 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord (Post 880111)
The expectations for her have to be a ton higher than they were for We Can Seek.





We Can Seek was a fairly useful plodder for Mark Henning. He finished 4th in the Whitney Handicap won by Invasor -- ahead of a few good also-rans like Premium Tap and Flower Alley.

Slowest track of the century at Aqueduct to run 2:08+ at 1 1/4 miles and still receive a 97 Beyer?

my miss storm cat 08-03-2012 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 880143)
There's no way you could have seen the foreign form of that horse and expected anything here. No way possible.

Why would you say that Kingie... because of my infinite wisdom? :D

It was 2005. I had been a fan for an entire year. No idea if you remember how over the top my expectations were at times. (They still are but in a less ridiculous way).

(Somewhat).

cmorioles 08-03-2012 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord (Post 879997)
Drysdale is generally a poor layoff trainer.

Also, the horse is running without lasix and giving a slight competitive advantage away for no reason.

She has the most impressive South American form of any filly I've ever seen -- but I'll watch one.

A. P. Indy was 5th at Woodbine in a racce dominated by two hapless Canadian horses when Drysdale brought him back from just a 3+ month layoff after winning the Belmont. He eventually rebounded and won Horse of the Year.

The polytrack is probably a concern as well.

my miss storm cat 08-04-2012 07:54 PM

Thoughts?

Port Conway Lane 08-04-2012 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my miss storm cat (Post 880479)
Thoughts?

The horse will never make me money but overall a good closing effort and fits in the class with these.

cmorioles 08-04-2012 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my miss storm cat (Post 880479)
Thoughts?

Try dirt.

Calzone Lord 08-04-2012 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my miss storm cat (Post 880479)
Thoughts?


I thought the performance was a pretty decent building block for a horse who hadn't yet run this year.

It's tough to win "Grade 1" route races off of 250 day layoffs, especially for a guy like Drysdale who isn't going to crank them up and has been a poor layoff trainer over the years.

Without numbers to look at yet -- the horse broke slow and awkwardly early. Looked pretty dull in the early and middle, and made a nice steady, strong stretch run to be beaten less than 2 lengths and continued on with a very strong gallop out past the wire.

If someone sharp like Dutrow had this horse -- he'd get her a rabbit. In Chile, the more quick and contested the pace appeared, the more markedly better she performed.

Danzig 08-05-2012 08:45 AM

i agree with doug on this. she's got potential for sure, and i will be watching her next out.
and if include me out continues with her antics of quitting once she gets the lead, you better believe the import will be one who can make her pay.

King Glorious 08-05-2012 11:56 AM

She's the Distaff winner if they make it that far.

Arletta 08-05-2012 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 880568)
She's the Distaff winner if they make it that far.


:tro:

NTamm1215 08-05-2012 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 880568)
She's the Distaff winner if they make it that far.

It might be hard to keep her on the shelf until the Distaff at Aqueduct in April.

outofthebox 08-05-2012 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215 (Post 880580)
It might be hard to keep her on the shelf until the Distaff at Aqueduct in April.

Nice one...:tro:

King Glorious 08-05-2012 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215 (Post 880580)
It might be hard to keep her on the shelf until the Distaff at Aqueduct in April.

Pretty good. I refuse to call the BC Distaff by it's new, stupid name.

cmorioles 08-05-2012 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 880568)
She's the Distaff winner if they make it that far.

I'm not sure how you conclude that off of that effort. It is possible, but she'll need a big boost from dirt and/or Lasix.

NTamm1215 08-05-2012 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 880591)
Pretty good. I refuse to call the BC Distaff by it's new, stupid name.

I actually was just referencing a race called the Distaff where she might have a chance.

Barring something unforeseen, there are at least 4-5 better Distaff contenders than her right now, one of which won the Clement Hirsch yesterday.

cmorioles 08-05-2012 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215 (Post 880650)
I actually was just referencing a race called the Distaff where she might have a chance.

Barring something unforeseen, there are at least 4-5 better Distaff contenders than her right now, one of which won the Clement Hirsch yesterday.

If the winner yesterday is one of the top 5, then the import probably does have a chance.

10 pnt move up 08-05-2012 03:10 PM

With Royal Delta going in the Classic the Distaff will be wide open.

NTamm1215 08-05-2012 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmorioles (Post 880668)
If the winner yesterday is one of the top 5, then the import probably does have a chance.

Admittedly, I don't follow SoCal racing, but is Include Me Out that bad? She capitalized on excellent circumstances yesterday, but isn't she a premature move in a collapsing race away from being unbeaten for the year? Her figures might be a bit slow, but so are a lot of the main players on the east coast.

10 pnt move up 08-05-2012 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215 (Post 880674)
Admittedly, I don't follow SoCal racing, but is Include Me Out that bad? She capitalized on excellent circumstances yesterday, but isn't she a premature move in a collapsing race away from being unbeaten for the year? Her figures might be a bit slow, but so are a lot of the main players on the east coast.

Thats pretty much the description of most of our high level racing now, a bunch of horses who run about the same figures and the winner is determined by which one gets the distance, trip, pace scenario they need to win.

cmorioles 08-05-2012 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215 (Post 880674)
Admittedly, I don't follow SoCal racing, but is Include Me Out that bad? She capitalized on excellent circumstances yesterday, but isn't she a premature move in a collapsing race away from being unbeaten for the year? Her figures might be a bit slow, but so are a lot of the main players on the east coast.

She isn't that bad, I'm just saying if she is top 5, the import with more fitness, dirt, and Lasix can certainly bridge that gap.

King Glorious 08-05-2012 04:51 PM

Those four or five must be yet to make their debut because I sure haven't seen them run yet. We'll see.

NTamm1215 08-05-2012 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 880720)
Those four or five must be yet to make their debut because I sure haven't seen them run yet. We'll see.

Really? You haven't heard of...

Royal Delta
It's Tricky
Include Me Out
Grace Hall
Questing

That's assuming Awesome Feather is not a racehorse anymore and that Potesta will make no progress.

I understand that Amani has upside, but you seem to have seen something in yesterday's Clement Hirsch that I'd love for you to explain a bit.

Indian Charlie 08-05-2012 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215 (Post 880736)
Really? You haven't heard of...

Royal Delta
It's Tricky
Include Me Out
Grace Hall
Questing

That's assuming Awesome Feather is not a racehorse anymore and that Potesta will make no progress.

I understand that Amani has upside, but you seem to have seen something in yesterday's Clement Hirsch that I'd love for you to explain a bit.

The champion 2yo from last year might turn out to be a pretty decent horse too. I think she returns to the races in a few days at the Spa.


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