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Riot 06-28-2012 12:30 PM

18 Reasons the Affordable Care Act Is the Greatest Achievement for the Middle Class
 
18 Reasons the Affordable Care Act Is the Greatest Achievement for the Middle Class Since Medicare

By LOLGOP on June 20, 2012
via Eclectablog.com

On either Thursday, June 21 or Monday, June 25, the Supreme Court will issue its decision on the Affordable Care Act, which I’ve grown to enjoy calling ObamaCare.

Health care in the United States was actually socialized in the dumbest possible way through a law signed by Ronald Reagan. ObamaCare fixes that broken system and strengthens Medicare for decades to come.

You need to read Alec MacGillis’ “What New Law?” The thesis: The people who will benefit most from this landmark bill have no idea what’s in it.

Since hollering won’t do me any good, I think I should at least describe why ObamaCare was such a victory for you and your family.

1. A Harvard study found that 45,000 Americans die every year for lack of insurance.

2. After a century of trying, President Obama was the first president to sign a law that would achieve near universal health insurance coverage.

3. For the first time, health insurers are required to spend 80 to 85 percent of customers’ premiums on actual care. More than $1.3 billion in overcharges will be returned to consumers and employers this year.

4. The law allows many Americans under age 26 to stay on their parents’ health plans. Today, as many as three million young people have already taken advantage of this benefit.

5. Tens of millions of people now getting preventive care at no extra cost, including cancer screenings and vaccinations. Last year, 32.5 million Americans on Medicare and up to 54 million Americans with private insurance received one or more free preventive services

6. 3.2 million small businesses — employing 19.3 million workers nationwide — were eligible last year for tax credits worth $15.4 billion or $800 per employee.

7. 3.6 million Medicare beneficiaries saved on average of $600 each as part of the phasing out of the donut hole.

8. Health care fraud prosecutions are up 27 percent. Recoveries are up 58 percent, taking in $4 billion last year.

9. Most health plans cannot deny coverage to children under age 19 because of pre-existing conditions.

10. Insurance companies can no longer cap the dollar amount of care you can receive in a lifetime

11. Insurers cannot drop your coverage due to a mistake on your application when you get sick.


Beginning in 2014:


12. Marketplaces will be established in every state for people and small businesses that buy their own health insurance. Pregnancy, contraception and newborn care, along with vision and dental coverage for children, will be covered in all exchange plans and new plans sold to individuals and small businesses.

13. Plans will no longer be allowed to turn away people with pre-existing conditions.

14. If your income is less than about $88,000 for a family of four and your job doesn’t offer coverage, you may get tax credits to pay for insurance.

15. The national Medicaid minimum eligibility level of 133% of the federal poverty level ($29,700 for a family of four in 2011) for nearly all Americans under age 65.

16. Health care insurers will no longer be allowed to charge women more than men for their coverage.

17. Up to 30 million Americans who are currently not insured will be covered, saving thousands of American lives.

18. How is this all paid for? By slight tax increases on the investments of Americans earning over $250,000 a year, “Cadillac” insurance plans, medical device companies, penalties for businesses and individuals who can afford insurance but choose not to get it and tanning.

Clip-Clop 06-28-2012 04:22 PM

1. A Harvard study found that 45,000 Americans die every year for lack of insurance. Pretty mush everyone dies, nobody has ever died from not having insurance.

2. After a century of trying, President Obama was the first president to sign a law that would achieve near universal health insurance coverage. Not even close actually.

3. For the first time, health insurers are required to spend 80 to 85 percent of customers’ premiums on actual care. More than $1.3 billion in overcharges will be returned to consumers and employers this year. No profits for businesses that take risks, sounds like a fine idea to me.

4. The law allows many Americans under age 26 to stay on their parents’ health plans. Today, as many as three million young people have already taken advantage of this benefit. 26 is no longer young, go out and be a grown up for fks sake.

5. Tens of millions of people now getting preventive care at no extra cost, including cancer screenings and vaccinations. Last year, 32.5 million Americans on Medicare and up to 54 million Americans with private insurance received one or more free preventive services. Oh there is a cost.

6. 3.2 million small businesses — employing 19.3 million workers nationwide — were eligible last year for tax credits worth $15.4 billion or $800 per employee. Unless you actually pay your employees a decent wage.

7. 3.6 million Medicare beneficiaries saved on average of $600 each as part of the phasing out of the donut hole. Would have been better to stop the fraud.

8. Health care fraud prosecutions are up 27 percent. Recoveries are up 58 percent, taking in $4 billion last year. Needs to be better, easy system to take advantage of because it is so poorly run, like all government agencies.

9. Most health plans cannot deny coverage to children under age 19 because of pre-existing conditions. This will make things WAY cheaper...

10. Insurance companies can no longer cap the dollar amount of care you can receive in a lifetime. Same as #9

11. Insurers cannot drop your coverage due to a mistake on your application when you get sick. Or what? That is the question.


Beginning in 2014:

12. Marketplaces will be established in every state for people and small businesses that buy their own health insurance. Pregnancy, contraception and newborn care, along with vision and dental coverage for children, will be covered in all exchange plans and new plans sold to individuals and small businesses. Unless they do not want it.

13. Plans will no longer be allowed to turn away people with pre-existing conditions. #9

14. If your income is less than about $88,000 for a family of four and your job doesn’t offer coverage, you may get tax credits to pay for insurance. That is wealthy in much of the country.

15. The national Medicaid minimum eligibility level of 133% of the federal poverty level ($29,700 for a family of four in 2011) for nearly all Americans under age 65. Good. This should have always been the case.

16. Health care insurers will no longer be allowed to charge women more than men for their coverage. Private businesses should be able to charge whomever, whatever they want. Don't like it go to a competitor.

17. Up to 30 million Americans who are currently not insured will be covered, saving thousands of American lives. #9

18. How is this all paid for? By slight tax increases on the investments of Americans earning over $250,000 a year, “Cadillac” insurance plans, medical device companies, penalties for businesses and individuals who can afford insurance but choose not to get it and tanning. I think as a business owner it is for me to decide what I can and cannot afford to buy/provide.

Riot 06-28-2012 04:54 PM


What is considered a small business?


In general, you are considered a small business if you have up to 50 employees. In some states, this will include you if you are self-employed with no employees. Contact your State Department of Insurance to find out whether this applies in your state.

Can I get tax credits for providing insurance to my employees?

If you have up to 25 employees, pay average annual wages below $50,000, and provide health insurance, you may qualify for a small business tax credit of up to 35% (up to 25% for non-profits) to offset the cost of your insurance. This will bring down the cost of providing insurance.

Starting in 2014, the small business tax credit goes up to 50% (up to 35% for non-profits) for qualifying businesses. This makes the cost of providing insurance even lower.

Do I have to provide health insurance to my employees?

The Affordable Care Act does not require employers to provide health insurance for their employees.


The Employer Responsibility provision of the Affordable Care Act applies businesses with more than 50 full-time workers. To learn more read the Employer Bulletin on Automatic Enrollment, Employer Responsibility, and Waiting Periods.

What should the health insurance I offer to my employees cover?

It depends--states vary on what they require insurers to cover in small employer plans. Contact your State Department of Insurance for more information about small employer coverage requirements in your state.

What should I know when I am looking for health insurance for my employees?


If you are a small employer with 2-50 employees, health insurance companies cannot turn your business down based on the health status of your employees or their family members. This rule applies when you initially apply for small employer coverage and if you decide to change plans.

An insurer must also accept everyone in your group. Employees or family members (if you offer dependent coverage) with health conditions cannot be excluded from coverage.

Health insurance companies must sell you any small employer health plan they sell to other small employers in your state.

Contact your State Department of Insurance to learn more about your rights to getting and keeping small employer coverage.

What health insurance alternatives are available to my employees through the new law?

Starting in 2014, small businesses with generally fewer than 100 employees can shop in an Affordable Insurance Exchange—a new, transparent, competitive marketplace where individuals and small businesses can buy affordable, qualified health benefit plans. This gives small businesses power similar to what large businesses have to get better choices and lower prices for employee coverage.

Exchanges will offer more choices of high-quality coverage and lower prices. Exchanges will offer a choice of plans that meet certain benefits and cost standards.

Small businesses will benefit from insurance with lower administrative costs compared to the choices available in the small business market today because they will be able to pool together.

Limits on insurance rating, such as no more rating based on employees’ health status or gender, will lower premiums for many small businesses.

The small business tax credits and the new competition promoted by Affordable Insurance Exchanges will help keep the cost of insurance down.

Do I have to pay more based on the health status of my group?


Most states, but not all, limit how much premiums can vary due to employees’ health status and other factors. Even within these limits, premiums can be significantly higher if someone in a small employer plan has a serious health condition.

Contact your State Department of Insurance for more information about small employer rating rules in your state.

Under the Affordable Care Act, this will change. Starting in 2014, insurers won’t be allowed to charge more based on the health status of your group or the gender of your employees. There will also be limits on how much premiums can vary based on age.

Can an insurer cancel my small employer plan because one of my employees gets sick?

No, your insurance for the group (or for any member of the group) cannot be canceled because someone in your group becomes sick. This is called “guaranteed renewal.”

Do I have to report the cost of insurance in my employees’ W-2 forms?

Employers do not have to report the cost of insurance on employee W-2s in 2011. This reporting is optional in 2011.

The reporting requirement is intended to be informational and provide employees with greater transparency into health care costs. The amounts reported are not taxable.

Learn more about the W-2 reporting deferral from the IRS.

hoovesupsideyourhead 06-28-2012 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop (Post 871920)
1. A Harvard study found that 45,000 Americans die every year for lack of insurance. Pretty mush everyone dies, nobody has ever died from not having insurance.

2. After a century of trying, President Obama was the first president to sign a law that would achieve near universal health insurance coverage. Not even close actually.

3. For the first time, health insurers are required to spend 80 to 85 percent of customers’ premiums on actual care. More than $1.3 billion in overcharges will be returned to consumers and employers this year. No profits for businesses that take risks, sounds like a fine idea to me.

4. The law allows many Americans under age 26 to stay on their parents’ health plans. Today, as many as three million young people have already taken advantage of this benefit. 26 is no longer young, go out and be a grown up for fks sake.

5. Tens of millions of people now getting preventive care at no extra cost, including cancer screenings and vaccinations. Last year, 32.5 million Americans on Medicare and up to 54 million Americans with private insurance received one or more free preventive services. Oh there is a cost.

6. 3.2 million small businesses — employing 19.3 million workers nationwide — were eligible last year for tax credits worth $15.4 billion or $800 per employee. Unless you actually pay your employees a decent wage.

7. 3.6 million Medicare beneficiaries saved on average of $600 each as part of the phasing out of the donut hole. Would have been better to stop the fraud.

8. Health care fraud prosecutions are up 27 percent. Recoveries are up 58 percent, taking in $4 billion last year. Needs to be better, easy system to take advantage of because it is so poorly run, like all government agencies.

9. Most health plans cannot deny coverage to children under age 19 because of pre-existing conditions. This will make things WAY cheaper...

10. Insurance companies can no longer cap the dollar amount of care you can receive in a lifetime. Same as #9

11. Insurers cannot drop your coverage due to a mistake on your application when you get sick. Or what? That is the question.


Beginning in 2014:

12. Marketplaces will be established in every state for people and small businesses that buy their own health insurance. Pregnancy, contraception and newborn care, along with vision and dental coverage for children, will be covered in all exchange plans and new plans sold to individuals and small businesses. Unless they do not want it.

13. Plans will no longer be allowed to turn away people with pre-existing conditions. #9

14. If your income is less than about $88,000 for a family of four and your job doesn’t offer coverage, you may get tax credits to pay for insurance. That is wealthy in much of the country.

15. The national Medicaid minimum eligibility level of 133% of the federal poverty level ($29,700 for a family of four in 2011) for nearly all Americans under age 65. Good. This should have always been the case.

16. Health care insurers will no longer be allowed to charge women more than men for their coverage. Private businesses should be able to charge whomever, whatever they want. Don't like it go to a competitor.

17. Up to 30 million Americans who are currently not insured will be covered, saving thousands of American lives. #9

18. How is this all paid for? By slight tax increases on the investments of Americans earning over $250,000 a year, “Cadillac” insurance plans, medical device companies, penalties for businesses and individuals who can afford insurance but choose not to get it and tanning. I think as a business owner it is for me to decide what I can and cannot afford to buy/provide.

exactly..great post:tro:

jms62 06-28-2012 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop (Post 871920)
1. A Harvard study found that 45,000 Americans die every year for lack of insurance. Pretty mush everyone dies, nobody has ever died from not having insurance.

2. After a century of trying, President Obama was the first president to sign a law that would achieve near universal health insurance coverage. Not even close actually.

3. For the first time, health insurers are required to spend 80 to 85 percent of customers’ premiums on actual care. More than $1.3 billion in overcharges will be returned to consumers and employers this year. No profits for businesses that take risks, sounds like a fine idea to me.

4. The law allows many Americans under age 26 to stay on their parents’ health plans. Today, as many as three million young people have already taken advantage of this benefit. 26 is no longer young, go out and be a grown up for fks sake.

5. Tens of millions of people now getting preventive care at no extra cost, including cancer screenings and vaccinations. Last year, 32.5 million Americans on Medicare and up to 54 million Americans with private insurance received one or more free preventive services. Oh there is a cost.

6. 3.2 million small businesses — employing 19.3 million workers nationwide — were eligible last year for tax credits worth $15.4 billion or $800 per employee. Unless you actually pay your employees a decent wage.

7. 3.6 million Medicare beneficiaries saved on average of $600 each as part of the phasing out of the donut hole. Would have been better to stop the fraud.

8. Health care fraud prosecutions are up 27 percent. Recoveries are up 58 percent, taking in $4 billion last year. Needs to be better, easy system to take advantage of because it is so poorly run, like all government agencies.

9. Most health plans cannot deny coverage to children under age 19 because of pre-existing conditions. This will make things WAY cheaper...

10. Insurance companies can no longer cap the dollar amount of care you can receive in a lifetime. Same as #9

11. Insurers cannot drop your coverage due to a mistake on your application when you get sick. Or what? That is the question.


Beginning in 2014:

12. Marketplaces will be established in every state for people and small businesses that buy their own health insurance. Pregnancy, contraception and newborn care, along with vision and dental coverage for children, will be covered in all exchange plans and new plans sold to individuals and small businesses. Unless they do not want it.

13. Plans will no longer be allowed to turn away people with pre-existing conditions. #9

14. If your income is less than about $88,000 for a family of four and your job doesn’t offer coverage, you may get tax credits to pay for insurance. That is wealthy in much of the country.

15. The national Medicaid minimum eligibility level of 133% of the federal poverty level ($29,700 for a family of four in 2011) for nearly all Americans under age 65. Good. This should have always been the case.

16. Health care insurers will no longer be allowed to charge women more than men for their coverage. Private businesses should be able to charge whomever, whatever they want. Don't like it go to a competitor.

17. Up to 30 million Americans who are currently not insured will be covered, saving thousands of American lives. #9

18. How is this all paid for? By slight tax increases on the investments of Americans earning over $250,000 a year, “Cadillac” insurance plans, medical device companies, penalties for businesses and individuals who can afford insurance but choose not to get it and tanning. I think as a business owner it is for me to decide what I can and cannot afford to buy/provide.

To point 3. Id much rather have the CEO of United Healthcare pull in 300 million a year and myself have to pay for half my medication because they decide not to cover the full amount anymore. :rolleyes:
PS I am very happy you Are not affected by the fires.

Clip-Clop 06-29-2012 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62 (Post 871947)
To point 3. Id much rather have the CEO of United Healthcare pull in 300 million a year and myself have to pay for half my medication because they decide not to cover the full amount anymore. :rolleyes:
PS I am very happy you Are not affected by the fires.

I do not agree with any company paying salaries like that to anyone. If I am a shareholder I would be pissed. I also disagree with the way insurance companies operate as well, especially when it come to prescriptions, while I am medicine free my wife is not, but the way this has been written it is going to make things worse IMO.
Thank you for the PS, we actually thought we saw something burning in our area this morning on our run but it was a distant reflection of the sunrise. Paranoia is rampant around here.

Riot 06-29-2012 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop (Post 872098)
Thank you for the PS, we actually thought we saw something burning in our area this morning on our run but it was a distant reflection of the sunrise. Paranoia is rampant around here.

Seems like things are temporarily looking up there, glad you guys are still okay. Still hot, dry, dangerous.

Antitrust32 07-02-2012 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62 (Post 871947)
To point 3. Id much rather have the CEO of United Healthcare pull in 300 million a year and myself have to pay for half my medication because they decide not to cover the full amount anymore. :rolleyes:
PS I am very happy you Are not affected by the fires.

you want to know whats funny?

Prior to Obamacare I only had to pay $10 for scrips

Ever since Obamacare passed and United Healthcare dramatically changed their insurance plans... I now must pay the full amount.

Obamacare turned my personal insurance to absolute ****.

jms62 07-02-2012 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antitrust32 (Post 872747)
you want to know whats funny?

Prior to Obamacare I only had to pay $10 for scrips

Ever since Obamacare passed and United Healthcare dramatically changed their insurance plans... I now must pay the full amount.

Obamacare turned my personal insurance to absolute ****.

Or did United Healthcare see it as an opportunity to gouge knowing they could deflect the blame.

Clip-Clop 07-02-2012 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62 (Post 872760)
Or did United Healthcare see it as an opportunity to gouge knowing they could deflect the blame.

Weren't gouging opportunities supposed to be eliminated by this?

jms62 07-02-2012 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop (Post 872762)
Weren't gouging opportunities supposed to be eliminated by this?

That's what they say but I will withold judgement and placing blame until it ACTUALLY goes into affect.

Danzig 07-02-2012 11:52 AM

http://factcheck.org/2012/06/romney-...re-falsehoods/


fact check on obamacare.


and i have to say, i find a republican griping about the feds getting between you and your doctor to be quite disingenuous, and highly ironic.

Antitrust32 07-02-2012 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62 (Post 872760)
Or did United Healthcare see it as an opportunity to gouge knowing they could deflect the blame.

that could very well be the case, but it doesnt change my insurance plan back to a good one.

according to UHC, the cadillac tax which will come into affect in 2014 was the reason they were changing the plans... my former plan was certainly no caddy in my eyes. now my plan is equivalent to a bicycle.

at any rate, I've only been hurt by the new health care law, and things wont be getting better.

Danzig 07-02-2012 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antitrust32 (Post 872775)
that could very well be the case, but it doesnt change my insurance plan back to a good one.

according to UHC, the cadillac tax which will come into affect in 2014 was the reason they were changing the plans... my former plan was certainly no caddy in my eyes. now my plan is equivalent to a bicycle.

at any rate, I've only been hurt by the new health care law, and things wont be getting better.

it's why the title of this thread is a misnomer. tony and i are middle class, the garbage doesn't do a thing for us. of course we'll pay for it-maybe that's what was meant? or perhaps it's in comparison to the current economy? because that's doing wonders for us caught in the middle as well. just grist in the mill.

Danzig 07-02-2012 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62 (Post 872760)
Or did United Healthcare see it as an opportunity to gouge knowing they could deflect the blame.

the health insurers are going to have to do everything they can to continue to make a profit. you ever run a business? there aren't many who can only put 15% of their money into the business and keep it running.

the company i work for announced that there will be rebates forthcoming to their health plan participants. their health insurer spend only 84.7% on claims, so they get to distribute a whopping .3% rebate. a couple of dollars. yeah, that's so worth having coverages changed, curtailed, removed...but at least there are 'free things' being covered now.
lmao. yeah, free. :rolleyes:

jms62 07-02-2012 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig (Post 872790)
the health insurers are going to have to do everything they can to continue to make a profit. you ever run a business? there aren't many who can only put 15% of their money into the business and keep it running.

the company i work for announced that there will be rebates forthcoming to their health plan participants. their health insurer spend only 84.7% on claims, so they get to distribute a whopping .3% rebate. a couple of dollars. yeah, that's so worth having coverages changed, curtailed, removed...but at least there are 'free things' being covered now.
lmao. yeah, free. :rolleyes:

Nothing really needs to be said.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2011/12/...n-11_land.html

Riot 07-02-2012 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antitrust32 (Post 872747)
you want to know whats funny?

Prior to Obamacare I only had to pay $10 for scrips

Ever since Obamacare passed and United Healthcare dramatically changed their insurance plans... I now must pay the full amount.

Obamacare turned my personal insurance to absolute ****.

No. That's your personal insurance company screwing you real good one last time.

There is zero in "Obamacare" that has gone into effect that has anything at all to do with that.

Riot 07-02-2012 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig (Post 872790)
the health insurers are going to have to do everything they can to continue to make a profit. you ever run a business? there aren't many who can only put 15% of their money into the business and keep it running.

the company i work for announced that there will be rebates forthcoming to their health plan participants. their health insurer spend only 84.7% on claims, so they get to distribute a whopping .3% rebate. a couple of dollars. yeah, that's so worth having coverages changed, curtailed, removed...but at least there are 'free things' being covered now.
lmao. yeah, free. :rolleyes:

The Affordable Care Act instituted consumer protections against price-gouging, one being that insurance companies must spend at least 80% of your insurance premium dollar on actual health care (rather than, oh, golden parachutes and management bonuses).

Oh, my - you are getting a rebate! That is reason to

A) Be happy your insurance company can no longer price-gouge you
B) Hate the law that protects you from price-gouging
C) Get help for the cognitive dissonance - at least you're covered for that now, by law

Danzig 07-02-2012 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62 (Post 872794)

yep...people think that by passing laws to control costs that they're helping..but companies ceo's, stockholders, big players etc are still going to get theirs. does anyone really think that someone will willingly take a cut so that prices don't go up??? yeah, right! yeah, the co's are going to lower their bottom line, and pass on savings. ha!!! yeah, i have ocean front property here in arkansas for sale, cheap.

paulo537 07-02-2012 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot (Post 872797)
The Affordable Care Act instituted consumer protections against price-gouging, one being that insurance companies must spend at least 80% of your insurance premium dollar on actual health care (rather than, oh, golden parachutes and management bonuses).

Oh, my - you are getting a rebate! That is reason to

A) Be happy your insurance company can no longer price-gouge you
B) Hate the law that protects you from price-gouging
C) Get help for the cognitive dissonance - at least you're covered for that now, by law

You seem to think that being in the health insurance business is just a racket for price-gouging, unethical evil doers. If it was so easy, why have all but 5 major comanies stopped writing group health insurance nationwide?

With your logic, we should be surprised that there are not 20 or 30 doing so, like there was 25 years ago.

By the way, there is absolutely nothing in the new law that insurance companies cannot manage. No annual maximums?.... ok, raise rates. No rating up for pre-ex conditions? .... no problem, raise rates. "Free" PReventive Care? ... sure, ... raise rates.

Health insurance rates are going to skyrocket. The pool of all insured people
through commercial carriers is going to deteriorate, health-wise. It has to.

The only question is whether the modest number of positives in the bill outweigh the higher cost for every person who is insured. Maybe that happens.

This is what is happening now:

1. Small Employer (<51 emps) plans will drop like flies. The penalties are just too soft.
2. Nothing has been reformed in health care. Just health care insurance has been reformed.

If you think that increased screening during preventive care and covering the kids until they are closer to an AARP card than their first birthday outweighs the unadressed reasons why HC itself costs so damn much then you should be a very happy person.

If you think insurance companies are shaking with fear at the new law, think again.

Clip-Clop 07-02-2012 03:40 PM

Insurance companies are evil. Therefore we insist you buy their product.

Danzig 07-02-2012 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop (Post 872835)
Insurance companies are evil. Therefore we insist you buy their product.

lol kudos.


http://hosted2.ap.org/apdefault/3d28...6940497f5a80b9 saw this article earlier...

Danzig 07-02-2012 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulo537 (Post 872828)
You seem to think that being in the health insurance business is just a racket for price-gouging, unethical evil doers. If it was so easy, why have all but 5 major comanies stopped writing group health insurance nationwide?

With your logic, we should be surprised that there are not 20 or 30 doing so, like there was 25 years ago.

By the way, there is absolutely nothing in the new law that insurance companies cannot manage. No annual maximums?.... ok, raise rates. No rating up for pre-ex conditions? .... no problem, raise rates. "Free" PReventive Care? ... sure, ... raise rates.

Health insurance rates are going to skyrocket. The pool of all insured people
through commercial carriers is going to deteriorate, health-wise. It has to.

The only question is whether the modest number of positives in the bill outweigh the higher cost for every person who is insured. Maybe that happens.

This is what is happening now:

1. Small Employer (<51 emps) plans will drop like flies. The penalties are just too soft. 2. Nothing has been reformed in health care. Just health care insurance has been reformed.

If you think that increased screening during preventive care and covering the kids until they are closer to an AARP card than their first birthday outweighs the unadressed reasons why HC itself costs so damn much then you should be a very happy person.

If you think insurance companies are shaking with fear at the new law, think again.

that's the big question right now, who will drop coverage? the answer is most, if not all, small groups will. if it's cheaper to pay the fine than continue to carry the coverage, and knowing employees can get it thru exchanges, why would any small employer keep their current plan? if you can save money by dropping and paying the fee, why wouldn't you? and that's the first budget breaker, as the cbo planned on only a few million losing small group coverage. in fact, most will. 'they' said it could be as low as 3 million people, but....it could be as high as 30 million. when they did the figuring back when members of congress said it 'must cost less than a trillion' they lowballed the number used to figure people losing coverage.


and yes, they will have to raise rates. how could they not? insurance companies have to pay out 85% in claims-but watch the claims come pouring in.
like i said, at least it'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. wonder when we get downgraded again.

Clip-Clop 07-02-2012 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig (Post 872838)
that's the big question right now, who will drop coverage? the answer is most, if not all, small groups will. if it's cheaper to pay the fine than continue to carry the coverage, and knowing employees can get it thru exchanges, why would any small employer keep their current plan? if you can save money by dropping and paying the fee, why wouldn't you? and that's the first budget breaker, as the cbo planned on only a few million losing small group coverage. in fact, most will. 'they' said it could be as low as 3 million people, but....it could be as high as 30 million. when they did the figuring back when members of congress said it 'must cost less than a trillion' they lowballed the number used to figure people losing coverage.


and yes, they will have to raise rates. how could they not? insurance companies have to pay out 85% in claims-but watch the claims come pouring in.
like i said, at least it'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. wonder when we get downgraded again.

Health care "exchanges" are just orbitz for insurance companies, there to help you shop.

Danzig 07-02-2012 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop (Post 872842)
Health care "exchanges" are just orbitz for insurance companies, there to help you shop.

yep, i know it. and many states are opting not to set them up. the work involved is astronomical. the amount of info that will have to be available is mind-boggling.

Riot 07-02-2012 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig (Post 872854)
yep, i know it. and many states are opting not to set them up. the work involved is astronomical. the amount of info that will have to be available is mind-boggling.

States can use those funds to set up whatever state-specific type of exchange they want. Oregon and Vermont, for example, are going full-on single payer via the ACA in their states.

Riot 07-02-2012 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig (Post 872838)
that's the big question right now, who will drop coverage? the answer is most, if not all, small groups will. if it's cheaper to pay the fine than continue to carry the coverage, and knowing employees can get it thru exchanges, why would any small employer keep their current plan?

The program has been designed specifically to increase coverage among small business people and their employees. There are significant new tax credits for companies with less than 50 employees, that provide health insurance through purchase on the exchanges (which makes it less expensive, too)

And if an employer choses to dump his employees off insurance entirely, they will not be left out to dry, they will be able to find individual insurance on the exchanges at the same price and coverageas their previous group rates.

In fact, aside from the huge small business benefits, the entire ACA is a very large middle class tax credit - not a fantasy "huge tax hike".

Clip-Clop 07-03-2012 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot (Post 872869)
States can use those funds to set up whatever state-specific type of exchange they want. Oregon and Vermont, for example, are going full-on single payer via the ACA in their states.

With who as the provider?

Riot 07-03-2012 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop (Post 872906)
With who as the provider?

:zz: Regular physicians, hospitals, etc. The ususal.

bigrun 07-03-2012 06:26 PM

Happy 4th
 






Clip-Clop 07-03-2012 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot (Post 873016)
:zz: Regular physicians, hospitals, etc. The ususal.

Coverage provider for the single payer. Is it the state? Is it the Federal Gov't? Is it medicare? Is it a private company signed up to take in the huddle masses and already sick of Oregon and Vermont?
Or is it more of the same like physicians and hospitals?
Smilie all you like, being vague about something so revolutionary as single payer should really be accompanied by a detail or two about the system that will one day save America and put us on the level of all the other world class countries like Spain, Italy and France...

Riot 07-03-2012 06:43 PM

People who will be denied #ACA benefits by their governors
 
Attention, residents of:

Georgia
Wisconsin
Iowa
South Dakota
Kansas
Louisiana
Florida
South Carolina
Indiana
New Jersey

Your House of Representatives, your Senate, your President, and your Supreme Court has given you an expansion of healthcare in your state under the Affordable Care Act.

While every other Republican-lead state will, of course, follow the law to help their citizens, your governor has personally decided he's not gonna let you get the healthcare you are now legally entitled to, that everyone else in the country will be getting.

Sorry. Sucks for you :(

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012...ans-uninsured/

Riot 07-03-2012 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clip-Clop (Post 873029)
Coverage provider for the single payer. Is it the state? Is it the Federal Gov't? Is it medicare? Is it a private company signed up to take in the huddle masses and already sick of Oregon and Vermont?
Or is it more of the same like physicians and hospitals?
Smilie all you like, being vague about something so revolutionary as single payer should really be accompanied by a detail or two about the system that will one day save America and put us on the level of all the other world class countries like Spain, Italy and France...

Have you paid zero attention at all to the discussion of the Affordable Care Act on this board?

What you just said, above, makes no sense at all :zz:

To help you: "providers" are the ones that provide the health care. You asked who would be the providers: that would be private doctors and hospitals, as are providers now.

Perhaps what you want to know who is going to administer a single payer program in those states? The state would.

Where does the money come from for the new state insurance exchanges? The federal government, via the ACA.

Again, to repeat a basic benefit of the Affordable Care Act, because clearly you've been paying zero attention for the past three years, or the past week: Each state gets to set up state insurance exchanges, where citizens of the state can purchase insurance. Those two states will set up single payer exchanges, where the state will be the payer.

paulo537 07-03-2012 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot (Post 873032)
Have you paid zero attention at all to the discussion of the Affordable Care Act on this board?

What you just said, above, makes no sense at all :zz:

To help you: "providers" are the ones that provide the health care. You asked who would be the providers: that would be private doctors and hospitals, as are providers now.

Perhaps what you want to know who is going to administer a single payer program in those states? The state would.

Where does the money come from for the new state insurance exchanges? The federal government, via the ACA.

Again, to repeat a basic benefit of the Affordable Care Act, because clearly you've been paying zero attention for the past three years, or the past week: Each state gets to set up state insurance exchanges. Those two states will set up single payer exchanges, where the state will be the payer.

Miss Marple,

It's Payor.

paulo537 07-03-2012 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot (Post 873030)
Attention, residents of:

Georgia
Wisconsin
Iowa
South Dakota
Kansas
Louisiana
Florida
South Carolina
Indiana
New Jersey

Your House of Representatives, your Senate, your President, and your Supreme Court has given you an expansion of healthcare in your state under the Affordable Care Act.

While every other Republican-lead state will, of course, follow the law to help their citizens, your governor has personally decided he's not gonna let you get the healthcare you are now legally entitled to, that everyone else in the country will be getting.

Sorry. Sucks for you :(

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012...ans-uninsured/

The law does nothing to "get you healthcare."

The law reforms insurance and healthcare financing. That should have come to you through you dozens of posts.


When you need a break from teacing here, study a little about the tendency for Health Insurer profitability to run in interesting cycles in terms of profit and loss.

Should the people in those single-payor state feel good about what will happen when the state take a loss , say 2-3 years in a row? It happens.

Riot 07-03-2012 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulo537 (Post 873033)
Miss Marple,

It's Payor.

So sorry. Please, everybody read the last word in the above paragraph to be "payor" :D

Riot 07-03-2012 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulo537 (Post 873034)
The law does nothing to "get you healthcare."

Actually, yes, the law indeed expands the eligibility for Medicaid. Which is exactly what these governors are refusing to extend to the class of eligible citizens.

Which means that although these citizens were indeed given access to healthcare by the ACA Medicaid expansion, these governors have decided they don't get it.

Quote:

The law reforms insurance and healthcare financing. That should have come to you through you dozens of posts.
You might want to read up on the law a little more, so you can learn what else it does.

Quote:

Should the people in those single-payor state feel good about what will happen when the state take a loss , say 2-3 years in a row? It happens.
See, I just have to laugh when some get on their high horse, but are facing the horses azz. You might want to realize that the term is "single-payer", not single payor. A payor is the person who writes the check. The system is "single-payer". Yes, the person who writes the check would be the "payor".

Quote:

Should the people in those single-payor state feel good about what will happen when the state take a loss , say 2-3 years in a row? It happens.
The states are not paying completely for the first five years of coverage, are they? If states cannot administer the program to run without loss over the initial five years of test program, financed by the federal government, they can adjust it. Don't you think? Why would that be any valid reason to not implement the program? A program proven already to work in Mass?

Rileyoriley 07-03-2012 07:32 PM

Yes, it's working so well for the "working poor" in Massachusetts.:rolleyes:






Open enrollment for Health Insurance
July 1st through August 15th

Updated: Monday, 02 Jul 2012, 8:52 PM EDT
Published : Monday, 02 Jul 2012, 5:44 PM EDT

* Ryan Walsh

FLORENCE, Mass. (WWLP) - The Supreme Court's ruling on health care continues to dominate the headlines.

Massachusetts began its health care reform law six years ago. Open enrollment for health insurance begins on Monday and there are still close to four-hundred thousand uninsured people in Massachusetts.

"It seems to me as what kind of health insurance plan someone selects is a really critical, critical decision", says Leslie Laurie, the President and CEO of Tapestry Health.

For first timers it can be tricky and if you aren't insured, you could owe the IRS money.

"There is a penalty it is a dollar penalty and it is based upon how much you earn", says Tax Attorney Paul Mancinone.

If you make less than $16,000 you do not get penalized. Make more than that, you could owe anywhere from $19 a month, up to $101 dollars a month if you make $33,000 or more.

"Potentially husband and wife... so we have seen penalties as high as $2400 dollars", says Mancinone.

Having a plan could help you avoid tax penalties, but picking the wrong plan could end up costing you more money in the long-run."

"The individual mandate requires people to have insurance, but in order to meet that mandate some can only afford health insurance where a deductible is thousands and thousands of dollars", says Laurie.

Massachusetts does have the lowest percentage of uninsured people in the United States and it had the 7th lowest percentage before the law was implemented. Researchers at the Harvard Medical School revealed in a study that most of the uninsured in Massachusetts are the working poor.

"While we celebrate the fact that all of us in Massachusetts have access to health insurance that doesn't necessarily translate into the important care that individuals need", says Laurie.

The state's health insurance website is mahealthconnector.org.

The open enrollment period is from July 1st through August 15th.

If you don't have health insurance and want to try to avoid paying tax penalties. Mancinone recommends appeal it. "You can appeal, in order to appeal, you have to make sure your tax return does not show the penalty, if your tax return does show the penalty it becomes a collection matter with the Department of Revenue, because you admitted to owing the penalty. It gives you an opportunity to have your case heard, if it's as high as $2400 in the balance and there are extenuating circumstances, why volunteer the penalty. Try to have your issue addressed and hope for the best with the Commonwealth."



All content © Copyright 2000 - 2012 – LIN Television Corporation. All Rights Reserved.

Riot 07-03-2012 07:34 PM

Mass is working very well. Thousands have been insured and now get health care that could not before it was implemented. You might listen to Mass ex-gov. Mitt Romney, who has spoken for years on how well it's worked in detail, and how it's a model for the entire country to follow.

If there are problems that develop, you change your laws to adjust to them as it goes. Here's a good discussion of the pros and cons of the Mass law http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle...161248535.html

Clip-Clop 07-04-2012 09:59 AM

Stop reading opinion pieces on the law and start reading the actual law, something I am beginning to think I am the only person that has actually done so anywhere in the world.
Making someone buy something is not "providing" them with same. Forcing others (not wealthy either, almost all are middle class) to pick up the tab for those that cannot afford this product is inappropriate and irresponsible.


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