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-   -   Great Preakness -- hopefully the start of a great seasonal rivalry (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46801)

Calzone Lord 05-19-2012 05:51 PM

Great Preakness -- hopefully the start of a great seasonal rivalry
 
I'll Have Another and his jockey didn't take the bait and ruin their chances by trying to apply early pressure to Bodemeister.

Bodemeister didn't have to deal with heavy pressure early.

The fractions may appear way slower than the Derby -- but this was a ridiculously slow track today with a deep rail. Horses stalking and making that 3-to-4 wide far turn move won everything.

It was a Grade 1 pace. Smith was smart enough to keep Bodemeister at least a little bit off of the rail.

The track was tiring, but it was as clean as this race could have been run...and the top two finishers put a city block on the field, but the gamer horse won.

Here's the Kentucky Derby after 9.5 furlongs (picture at the 1/16th pole)




It was a veritable replay again with Mario G. riding another smart race aboard the winner.

The track was ridiculously fast in Kentucky and slower than par today -- but Bodemeister had no pressure excuse this time.

Anyone who doesn't think I'll Have Another and Bodemeister are the two best dirt males at 9 furlongs in the entire country outside of maybe the Charles Lopresti barn...

Go back and watch the Arkansas Derby and Oaklawn Park Handicap (run 30 minutes apart) again --- Alternation went more than 7 lengths slower than Bodemeister early and couldn't outfinish him by even 0.01 seconds late. He's a subsquent Pimlico Special winner now is Alternation ... and he couldn't warm these two up.

Great race, even though I got splattered by I'll Have Another's stretch heroics.

clambeau 05-19-2012 06:01 PM

I totally agree...Poor Bodemeister, a great colt in his own right and they run this race 100 times and he loses 90 of em...maybe all of em, (from this distance and longer of course)

There's these two...and like you said, a city block from the rest of em, regardless of age

fpsoxfan 05-19-2012 06:21 PM

Yeah....wasn't a believer...Figured Bode would crush the field. Good for I"ll have another and his connections. A Triple Crown would be pretty cool!

OldDog 05-19-2012 06:32 PM

Trefreakinmendous!

Belmont is going to be packed. TV ratings should be great. I'll Have Another is for real. Great ride, great timing. Can't articulate how excited I am!

HaloWishingwell 05-19-2012 07:18 PM

Please give I'll Have Another a low Beyer again...please! Don't spoil a good thing

Calzone Lord 05-19-2012 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HaloWishingwell (Post 862407)
Please give I'll Have Another a low Beyer again...please! Don't spoil a good thing

He had the outright highest last out Beyer in the entire field coming into today.

clambeau 05-19-2012 08:27 PM

The Matz camp or the Roman's camp can't be too thrilled with what they saw today

Indian Charlie 05-19-2012 09:44 PM

I like(d) bodes chances much more in the Belmont than today.

If they both go, that is the time to play him.

slotdirt 05-19-2012 10:15 PM

I've opposed I'll Have Another for a variety of reasons having nothing to do with the horse himself and certainly won't support the horse in the Belmont. That being said, that was a really fun race to watch.

GPK 05-19-2012 10:22 PM

He's has beat me twice now. Only way to insure he loses and Drug O'Neil is denied a triple crown (I shudder at the thought) is for me to bet I'll Have Another in the Belmont. Not a prayer in the world he wins then.

slotdirt 05-19-2012 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GPK (Post 862464)
He's has beat me twice now. Only way to insure he loses and Drug O'Neil is denied a triple crown (I shudder at the thought) is for me to bet I'll Have Another in the Belmont. Not a prayer in the world he wins then.

I applaud your selflessness.

knickslions2 05-19-2012 10:54 PM

Doubt bode runs Belmont. I'll have another should win tc but thought that about funny cide

Danzig 05-19-2012 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie (Post 862458)
I like(d) bodes chances much more in the Belmont than today.

If they both go, that is the time to play him.

Why? Seemed to have it his way today and couldnt hold off iha. How could he going even longer than in the last two?

clambeau 05-20-2012 12:47 AM

Bode's not going...Baffert's quoted "The bus stops here" for him...?#@?

....that was the quote

More important...Bode's NOT going

goodcopy 05-20-2012 01:10 AM

Stop and Smell The Roses!
 
I certainly hope I'll Have Another wins the Belmont Stakes!
At this point it is redicules to say he will be the bet or the horse to beat other than the sure fact that he'll be the favorite!
But all you nimrods and mind farts that can't see this is good for the sport,and most of all you shoot from the hip mindless people who start Questioning the trainer or his love for horses.
What is your problem?
None of Douge O'Neals infrations have been for perfomance enhancing drugs and the worst thing you can say is he has drop a sore horse to a low claiming level to get rid of him through the claim box
Every trainer alive has done this in some sort of fashion or level!
Look lets hope I'll Have Another comes out of the race sound and ready to run in 3 weeks and hopfully he beats all comers(especialy the one that skiped the Preakness for all the same reasons you guys bash horses for not running)
Wins the triple crown and becomes part of racing legend.
California rules!:D

Coach Pants 05-20-2012 01:25 AM

LeBrodemeister.

pointman 05-20-2012 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodcopy (Post 862480)
I certainly hope I'll Have Another wins the Belmont Stakes!
At this point it is redicules to say he will be the bet or the horse to beat other than the sure fact that he'll be the favorite!
But all you nimrods and mind farts that can't see this is good for the sport,and most of all you shoot from the hip mindless people who start Questioning the trainer or his love for horses.
What is your problem?
None of Douge O'Neals infrations have been for perfomance enhancing drugs and the worst thing you can say is he has drop a sore horse to a low claiming level to get rid of him through the claim box
Every trainer alive has done this in some sort of fashion or level!
Look lets hope I'll Have Another comes out of the race sound and ready to run in 3 weeks and hopfully he beats all comers(especialy the one that skiped the Preakness for all the same reasons you guys bash horses for not running)
Wins the triple crown and becomes part of racing legend.
California rules!:D

Now that Andy revealed who I think you are, I have immense respect for you. However, how can you say that milk shaking is not performance enhancing?

What does the region a horse comes from have to do with their ability and talent? I would like to see him win regardless of his connections, but based on pure talent. The last time I checked the horse didn't pick his connections. I never understand why people would wager their money based on those factors.

trackrat59 05-20-2012 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GPK (Post 862464)
He's has beat me twice now. Only way to insure he loses and Drug O'Neil is denied a triple crown (I shudder at the thought) is for me to bet I'll Have Another in the Belmont. Not a prayer in the world he wins then.

Kev I'm with you. I'm so messed up in the head over this. I would LOVE for IHA to win the TC, but the trainer being O'Neil? Oh please. Lord help us all. PHWUCK. :eek: NOOO.:zz: Why him?:rolleyes:

Also, I'm thrilled for NY, Belmont and NYRA.:$:

slotdirt 05-20-2012 06:28 AM

Hopefully, the Belmont runs more smoothly this year than in 2008. I'm sweating just thinking about that day.

This is the first year I've missed all three Triple Crown races since 2003. Figures there'd be a winner this year.

Danzig 05-20-2012 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trackrat59 (Post 862487)
Kev I'm with you. I'm so messed up in the head over this. I would LOVE for IHA to win the TC, but the trainer being O'Neil? Oh please. Lord help us all. PHWUCK. :eek: NOOO.:zz: Why him?:rolleyes:

Also, I'm thrilled for NY, Belmont and NYRA.:$:

i also have issues with the connections...but what can you do?

Indian Charlie 05-20-2012 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig (Post 862470)
Why? Seemed to have it his way today and couldnt hold off iha. How could he going even longer than in the last two?

Doesn't matter now :(

Apparently Bode is being replaced by Paynter in the Belmont.

Optimizer the only other Preakness starter to go to the Belmont.

slotdirt 05-20-2012 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig (Post 862513)
i also have issues with the connections...but what can you do?

Hope he loses? That's all I got.

GPK 05-20-2012 10:02 AM

It would be a great story for Mario and I have nothing against the horse (although his last lunge to get Bode at the wire yesterday just crushed my soul), I just personally find it hard to root for a guy like O'Neil.

3kings 05-20-2012 10:27 AM

I hope he wins the triple crown because it would be great for racing. The horse only sold for $35,000 which makes potential owners see that you don' t have to spend millions to have a quality horse. The connections aren't great but at least it isn't one of the mega-trainers. O'Neill is personable,very good with the press, and is making himself available to just about anyone who asks. He has a few skeletons in his closet but so do many in this industry.

Coach Pants 05-20-2012 10:31 AM

The owner is the concern. That's potentially a media disaster.

3kings 05-20-2012 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Pants (Post 862540)
The owner is the concern. That's potentially a media disaster.

Coach, why because he is a legal loan shark or some other reason?

somerfrost 05-20-2012 10:54 AM

To paraphrase the Clinton campaign....It's the horse stupid! I have nothing against O'Neill, seems like a good guy to me but even if I did, I would still root for this ultra-game horse to win the TC. I've been waiting for a TC winner for a long time, been fortunate enough to see three of them and the elation is like nothing else. Racing needs a TC winner and we've been disappointed so many times.

Coach Pants 05-20-2012 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3kings (Post 862544)
Coach, why because he is a legal loan shark or some other reason?

That's the reason. It might be overlooked though. Human lives being destroyed are far less important than lasix.

clambeau 05-20-2012 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach Pants (Post 862557)
That's the reason. It might be overlooked though. Human lives being destroyed are far less important than lasix.

It may be worse than that...Reddam might take Lasix himself !!!

fpsoxfan 05-20-2012 06:11 PM

You can't always have it both ways. Last year everyone hated Repole, before that it was all of the connections of Big Brown. It's horse racing. Good luck finding the "cookie cutter" Owner/Trainer combination. It's actually pretty hypocritical.

slotdirt 05-20-2012 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fpsoxfan (Post 862693)
You can't always have it both ways. Last year everyone hated Repole, before that it was all of the connections of Big Brown. It's horse racing. Good luck finding the "cookie cutter" Owner/Trainer combination. It's actually pretty hypocritical.

Not everyone hated Repole. And there have been a few times in recent years where the owner/trainer/jockey combo of a potential Crown winner were pretty likeable. I don't think anybody hated any combo of the Funny Cide team. Same with Afleet Alex (at least at the time) or Smarty Jones. It's perfectly conceivable in horse racing to find connections that are at least mostly vanilla.

King Glorious 05-20-2012 09:25 PM

I was too young and not even into racing when the last three TC winners ran so I can only go by what I've read. All three were highly regarded horses prior to the Derby, hardly surprises. Not the same with I'll Have Another. Maybe it doesn't make sense but if a horse is going to become immortalized by winning the TC, I want it to be a star and this horse doesn't fit that for me. Not saying he's not a good horse because he is and there hasn't been anything lucky about his wins. He's deserved them and if he wins the Belmont, he'll deserve that too. It just bothers me that in the future, he'll be looked at as one of the sport’s greats because of the accomplishment and people won't take the time to understand that circumstances and timing often play a bigger role in making history than actual ability. People will remember I'll Have Another before Alysheba ,Sunday Silence, Risen Star, Point Given, Smarty Jones, Afleet Alex, and others. For that silly reason, I want him to lose.

Grey Lag 05-20-2012 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 862732)
I was too young and not even into racing when the last three TC winners ran so I can only go by what I've read. All three were highly regarded horses prior to the Derby, hardly surprises. Not the same with I'll Have Another. Maybe it doesn't make sense but if a horse is going to become immortalized by winning the TC, I want it to be a star and this horse doesn't fit that for me. Not saying he's not a good horse because he is and there hasn't been anything lucky about his wins. He's deserved them and if he wins the Belmont, he'll deserve that too. It just bothers me that in the future, he'll be looked at as one of the sport’s greats because of the accomplishment and people won't take the time to understand that circumstances and timing often play a bigger role in making history than actual ability. People will remember I'll Have Another before Alysheba ,Sunday Silence, Risen Star, Point Given, Smarty Jones, Afleet Alex, and others. For that silly reason, I want him to lose.

By that logic there will never be another deserving TC winner since horses don't have anything like the schedules that Secretariat, Seattle Slew, and Affirmed had as two and three year olds. Horses today don't race enough prior to the triple crown races to compile a resume like those horses. Secretariat had 12 races prior to the Kentucky Derby.

If I'll Have Another wins the Belmont Stakes he will have won 4 Grade I and 1 Grade II races this year while only a couple of other 3-year-olds have even won a single GI.

DaTruth 05-20-2012 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious (Post 862732)
I was too young and not even into racing when the last three TC winners ran so I can only go by what I've read. All three were highly regarded horses prior to the Derby, hardly surprises. Not the same with I'll Have Another. Maybe it doesn't make sense but if a horse is going to become immortalized by winning the TC, I want it to be a star and this horse doesn't fit that for me. Not saying he's not a good horse because he is and there hasn't been anything lucky about his wins. He's deserved them and if he wins the Belmont, he'll deserve that too. It just bothers me that in the future, he'll be looked at as one of the sport’s greats because of the accomplishment and people won't take the time to understand that circumstances and timing often play a bigger role in making history than actual ability. People will remember I'll Have Another before Alysheba ,Sunday Silence, Risen Star, Point Given, Smarty Jones, Afleet Alex, and others. For that silly reason, I want him to lose.

I once shared that mindset, for various ridiculous reasons. I even rooted against Alysheba, the first horse I ever saw with a chance to win the TC, in the Belmont because I didn't think he was worthy. In fact, Sunday Silence and Silver Charm were about the only two possible Triple Crown winners that I believed were worthy.

Our sport is battered and bruised. It has gone the way of boxing, and most Americans care little about it. It desperately needs something that makes it relevant to most Americans, even if for a short time. A Triple Crown winner will provide that relevancy.

slotdirt 05-21-2012 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaTruth (Post 862741)
I once shared that mindset, for various ridiculous reasons. I even rooted against Alysheba, the first horse I ever saw with a chance to win the TC, in the Belmont because I didn't think he was worthy. In fact, Sunday Silence and Silver Charm were about the only two possible Triple Crown winners that I believed were worthy.

Our sport is battered and bruised. It has gone the way of boxing, and most Americans care little about it. It desperately needs something that makes it relevant to most Americans, even if for a short time. A Triple Crown winner will provide that relevancy.

Wonder how many folks will be saying that if the horse somehow wins the Belmont and is retired by year's end.

OldDog 05-21-2012 08:16 AM

I'll Have Another is reminding me a bit of Charismatic, in that no one gave him much respect until he won the Preakness. I'll Have Another will likely be a huge favorite in the Belmont. With whom will you bet against him?

NTamm1215 05-21-2012 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slotdirt (Post 862765)
Wonder how many folks will be saying that if the horse somehow wins the Belmont and is retired by year's end.

He said "if even for a short time."

The fighting about whether we can cheer for the horse is a microcosm of why racing has been relagated to the same popularity level as cycling.

slotdirt 05-21-2012 08:39 AM

Folks can cheer for whatever horse or connections they want. I'll be rooting against it, but if the horse wins on the 9th, my life won't be effected one way or the other.


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