Absolutely Horrendous DQ at belmont
 

Now I've seen everything. You just have to see the replay of the belmont 6th and look at why Ny's stewards are the worst in the country.
ticky tack mutual contact where neither rider ever stopped riding his mount and they take the horse down after a startlingly short inquiry.
These guys are the absolute worst.

Obviously the winner deserved to come down, herded the horse out many paths while making contact, but so was the third race winner, who herded the second horse out even more, yet because there was no contact they didn't even blink the number. By holding his ground, the second finisher was able to draw the contact, and thus justly get put up.

The problem is not the decision....it's the lack of consistency.

Thats pretty funny because I just got two phone calls from screaming people(one of whom you know well) who were angrier than I was. Lansdon couldnt believe it.
And I respectfully say bull****. The outside horse was actually coming in on the winner the last 100 yards and making contact. The initial(albeit minor) contact was indeed made by the winner but if you concentrate on the paths of the two horses late you can see that the outside horse indeed was coming in on the winner.
Its bull**** and complete bull**** at that. I can only go and find about 100 replays where far worse occurred and they didn't even give it a look.
The 2nd to last Friday at Saratoga there was an absolute mugfest in the last race(the race that meeses two pieces won) and they didn't even call an inquiry. Guy next to me was absolutely insane with rage wondering how that could be and upon watching the replay to see what he lost his mind over I could see why he lost his mind very clearly.
They stink and inconsistent doesnt even begin to describe it.

Was it as bad as the takedown in this year's Black Eyed Susan? That was a joke.

Different type of bad. But very bad.
I actually wonder sometimes if they even watch the races, I'm serious. I know there is no way that they watched the Meeses two Pieces race.

I'll have to catch the replay of today's race.

Seriously, I was mad six hours after Smart N Pretty came down that day. That was home cooking for Ramon, no two ways about it. In fact, four months later, I'm still bitter about it actually.

I only had the exacta because they took Smart N Pretty down so from my eyes it looked like a great decision.

I had the opposite. Smart N Pretty on top paid pretty well as an exacta, maybe $100? Anyway, she was so clearly the best that day and it was so clearly obvious that both horses were leaning on eachother, there was no way she should have come down.

I feel oracle's pain.

No pain now at all. Howie tesher just lit up the board with one of the most impossible horses you ever saw in your life at 21-1.
WIll this be enough to cause a carryover finally?

Oracle,

Can you shed some light on how the NYRA and the stewards work? How many are they? Do the same stewards travel to all three tracks? Basically, can you just share some knowledge with me.

Mikey..

The DQ killed me, but I liked the $45 winner a fair amount...

7th: CLM/N3L, 6f-OTT

1. #7 San Telmo 2-1
2. #10 Sultry City 5-2
A. #4 Sir Speedator 10-1
B. #9 Honest Expectation 20-1

You should have heard Dale Romans when I got him to come on ATRAB to talk about it on the Monday afterwards.. Utter fury and disgust..

What they did to Smart n Pretty that day was a crime.

Steve,
Do you remember the race where Meeses Two Pieces won the nightcap up here on a Friday and that guy was behind your bbq stand having a fit about the lack of an inquiry with that bumping by the 2nd or 3rd place finisher?
I watched the replay and that guy had every right to be howling. The third place horse or 2nd place horse(I forgot which one) absolutely murdered the 4th place finisher that day and they didn't even toss it up for a look.
I find it shocking that ticky tack bumping, which the put up horse caused at the end of the race merited a dq on a very short look.
I have no idea what these guys use as criteria on a daily basis and I don't think anyone else does either.
Ny is the only place on the planet where you can watch a head on replay and still have no idea how the stewards are going to react.
Whats a non issue one day is a dq the next.
Its unfathomable.

I remember they had the TV camera in his face after the DQ was announced.. .he did very well keeping a straight face... I'm sure he was cussing up and down on the inside.

A/J,

They were doing it to Norberto Arroyo as much as Smart N Pretty too... I said on the show live after the race that had riders been reversed.. Arroyo on Regal and Ramon on SNP.. they'd NEVER have taken Dominguez down...

It was disgusting... IMO..

Once again, I agree with the call, just not their lack of consistancy. The only reason the outside horse made contact was because he held his ground and was bumped as the inside horse was coming out.

I don't give a **** who is complaining....I think anyone that thinks this DQ was incorrect is wrong ( and most likely biased ). But, if they left the third winner up, a number they didn't even blink, I think this one should have stayed as well. However, I believe the third winner should have come down.

I'm not particularly defending the stewards, as I am often in disagreement with them, but I believe in this particular instance the correct call was made. Remember, the horse held on by a nose and initiated contact.

I'm glad someone agrees with me on this. I think I was the only person in the entire grandstand at Pimlico that day who was bitter about that takedown. I thought for sure they'd take down Wanderin Boy in the Special because he basically did the same thing, but they didn't.

Totally agree that if the riders were reversed, results would have been the same. Embarassing that happened in the premier race for fillies in the state of Maryland.

I was just about to rant about the third winner and use it as a basis but you beat me to it. I didn't watch the third race but yet another irate friend called and told me about it so I watched the replay.
I feel that one should have been a non call as well but Speedjama was clearly carried out much worse than the horse who was put up in the 6th race. The fact that the horses in the 6th race were in closer quarters should not matter. The fact is that Jimmy The K carried Speedjama out much more than the horse in the 6th ever did.
Now can anyone explain to me how one horse stays up and the other comes down because quite frankly I'm at a total loss.

I agree with your last statement. There is no consistancy. The stewards, I think incorrectly, actually believe that when one horse bears out and the one outside drifts as well that they are both drifting. They foolishly don't understand that horses are herd animals and clearly the outside horse is drifting in response to the inside horse. I give credit to the rider of the 15 in the 6th, because he understood this, and smartly steered his horse to hold it's ground, and therefore recieived the contact that these stewards so desperately seem to need. Had he just allowed the other horse to carry his out without contact there would have been no DQ ( much like the 3rd race ).

However, since I strongly believe the horse in the third should have come down, I also believe the 6th winner was justly Dq'd. And, I did not bet either race.

Ok We just differ on both races. I think both should have stayed and after hearing my friends rant about the third race and watching it I told him I felt it was a non call because the other horse was getting away from the place horse anyway.
But yeah I hear you on the stewards. Its incredulous to me when I hear some nitwit watching a head on and saying "look, they both drifted out" as if the outside horse just coinincidentally started to drift after the other one did.
The lack of consistency is alarming and they seem to have different rules for different races and riders. They also let way too much go out of the gate, which is just plain wrong. Incidental gate contact is going to happen in just about every race but its become obvious that certain smart riders have come to realize that the stewards are gonna let gate contact go and come out and saw off the guys next to them, eliminating them from early pace contention. Since the same guys seem to do this in races, I highly doubt its just "one of those things".

If you wanna see some real head scratchers just watch head on replays at NYRA tracks each day at start of the race. You have guys hanging hard left turns or even right ones(if the horses to the outside could be pace duelers) and taking horses right out of contention at the break.
Its obvious that the riders know that noone is going to do anything about it and are exploiting it. A few have perfected the tactic of "hunt and seek" targeting of other speed horses if they are on a speed horse as well. They come right over and take a horse out, noone ever says a thing, never.

Of course nothing will ever match the 1986 DQ of Allemeuse in the 2nd race on the Whitney Day where Lady's Secret beat the boys. I will never forget that one as long as I live, and may have angered the DQ Gods by cashing in on the huge exacta that the DQ triggered.
Does anyone here remember that dq?
It was one of the strangest days in racing history.
Day started out sunny and warm.
2nd race was the Allemeuse DQ.
About the 3rd or 4th race a horse named Royal Pennant won a sprint race when the rain had started to fall and it had gotten dark.
Later on in the slop a two year old named Cryptoclearance drew off by many lengths to break his maiden.
Lady's Secret beat the boys in the Whitney.

This all happened in one day up here in 1986. Does anyone else remember that day?

Psh
 

Oracle:

Don't remember that day, but interesting that Cryptoclearance excels as a sire on off tracks.....

I do recall being there years ago on Travers Day when it was dark, cold and i believe General Assembly? won the Travers in a very fast time by the length of the stretch... I could have used a winter coat that day...

Mike, any horses left at Saratoga training or are they all long gone? Is it true that the track stays open until about November???

Take care,

Paul

The DQ of Nicoles Dream down at Mountaineer a few weeks ago was pretty bad, if not downright horrible. I think the DQ at Belmont today was tough, not as bad as Nicoles Dream, but bad enough

Paul good to hear from you. Many, many horses are still here and it will be open until November.
Trainers love having their horses in the calm surroundings up here and working on the super Oklahoma track.
The help loves it as well and actually complain about having to go wherever they go afterwards(and many go to Florida to Palm Meadows).
Its a small place as you know. The help(asst trainers, foreman, exercise riders) are able to rent rooms for 6 months up here for 6 months at reasonable prices and live in decent conditions.
The grooms are able to get around on bicycles and not have to pay for taxis or the subway or buses.
It will get you an extra half hours sleep each morning as well because everyone lives so close to the track and doesnt have a far commute.
They hang primarily at the Parting Glass which has a horsey set the entire 6 months that they are here.
One asst trainer of a major barn I often run into at Aqueduct in the winter. He will greet me with hello, and then say 10 weeks, or 9 weeks. By this he means until he gets to go back to Saratoga.

Peaceful
 

It must be really peaceful up there when the meet is not running and the horses are still training at the Oklahoma track. Mornings are so special at Saratoga.

I would be there almost every day if i could...

Enjoy...

Also spoke to CFM this week to tell him we are on schedule sending the City Zip 2YO filly to him mid October. She was put back in training on Labor Day and is progressing nicely. Thanks again for all of your help...

Take care,

Paul

Does the name ALLEMUSE ring a bell.

You are quite welcome and I am sure that with a little "gentle prodding" that he will manage her quite properly and have you making bank deposits this winter.
It is peaceful but they have banned all spectators at the Oklahoma track in the morning for works. You can get in with a trainer or owner but without a badge of your own you are screwed. So basically your options are to not go or to call a friend who trains and meet him at the gate at 5:00 Am when its still dark and cold. Needless to say I really miss going there for works, lol.

Definitely
 

feel free to prod. manage just like Lansdon horses not Flying Zee....

Oh no doubt, reverse riders and no change would have been made. It would be a cold day in hell before Dominguez comes down on a non-incident like that at Pimlico.

Arroyo is one of the most aggressive, dangerous, and careless riders in the game. At any point in his races, unless hes on the front end, you can make a case for him to come down.

The fact is that Jimmy The K carried Speedjama out much more than the horse in the 6th ever did.


:mad:

smart n pretty dq
 

The Smart and Pretty Dq caused me to have Angina for a month. Norberto Arroyo's reputation didn't help us. The bad Karma from that Dq stayed with me for a month. This is the toughest thing you can do in life. And believe me I'm talking from experience

i never bet arroyo..even if i like the horse...i skip the race..some cappers don't believe in this strategy....but their are some jocky's like smith that just don't have the ice in their veins to be out there. jmho

Mike smith cannot come out of his home if the sun is out. He is scared of his own shadow