One down, 49 to go.
 

"Boise, Idaho -- Idaho's governor has issued a state order that nullifies President Obama's Affordable Health Care and Patient Protection Act -- otherwise known as "Obamacare."

On Wednesday morning, Gov. C.L. "Butch" Otter signed an executive order that prohibits Idaho's government entities from taking federal dollars meant to pay for national healthcare reform in the state.

The order goes into effect immediately."

http://www.fox12idaho.com/story/1448...fies-obamacare

Let's trim the branches and then rip that f**king law out by the roots...

Sad to see....states rights, reminds me of another time.

Idaho is just following the pro-Obama unions' lead and exempting themselves.

This isn't the big deal you think it is, Joey.

First, as an aside, under our system of democracy, states cannot ignore or simply choose not to follow federal law. No matter how much they want to (see immigration, the Civil War, etc)

Secondly, there is a provision in the Affordable Care Act that any state can choose to not be bound by the provisions of the Act. No big deal. That leaves the state, under Federal Law, to provide the same or better quality of care within the state, at state expense. If they do not do that, the Feds can legally come in, and put their own provisions into place.

For example, Vermont is going to go it alone, too, in favor of a more inclusive single payer system.

So, really smart, Gov. Otter - your state still has to provide the same services, but now you get to pay for it all by yourself :tro:

Joey, you've never really articulated why you hate "Obamacare" so much. Do tell - what, exactly, about it do you dislike so much? Is it that children with cancer can no longer reach a lifetime cap and be kicked off insurance for life as children? That people with pre-existing conditions will be able to purchase healthcare? That 30 million people will be self-insured, and no longer have their healthcare paid by us because they only seek ER care in emergencies? Is it that it saves billions off the cost of Medicare over 10 years?

Put succinctly: socialized medicine sucks.

The PPACA is NOT "socialized medicine". Not even close.

It is the same "buy your insurance from an insurance company, and choose your doctor" we have right now.

If you have insurance, nothing will change for you (except over time your premiums should go down, and your insurance company cannot screw you as it used to: kick you off, lifetime cap, refuse to insure for some conditions, etc)

If you are one of the 40 million without insurance, about 30 million will be able to purchase insurance from insurance companies.

Nothing about "socialized medicine" in there at all. Zip, zero, nada. Why do you think the "left" was so disappointed in what little the final law contains?

And the final proof of who this law benefits the most? Insurance company stock went up the day this law was passed.

Supreme Court doesn't get immediately involved
 

Supreme Court decision today:

and so did policies. If you held insurance stock good for you. If you did not and are healthy, bend over and assume the position.

it's the part where the healthy and haves are subsidizing the unhealthy and have nots by force and fines.

:zz: What in the world do you think you are doing right now? Your & my insurance premiums today pay for those that are uninsured and head into the ER when they are sick. Our tax dollars already go towards Medicaid for the qualifiers. Right now we are paying for the 40 million uninsured.

Far better they buy their own insurance rather than being uninsured, and they start to pay part rather than nothing for Medicaid! I'd rather be paying for only 10 million uninsured, myself!

And again, I don't know why you keep repeating the "force and fines" falsehood - it's been pointed out to you before that the PPACA specifically has a prohibition against collecting any fines for not having healthcare. So you are aware of that, and have been in the past. So why do you keep repeating a falsehood?

It's like Trump and his moronic, deliberate lies about Obama's birth certificate.

Far better for them to buy a house and car as well and I'm not interested in paying for that either.

If they were actually buying their own insurance great. But the thought of a patient who was subsized by a patient waiting behind him is wrong. This is nothing but a scheme for socialized medicine for all using the private sector as the caregiver.

Riot, this is useless....some folks are so afraid that they might actually help someone in need that they are blinded to facts.

If you aren't selfish, then, you're not gunna understand the opposition to it.

If you are selfish, then, no explanation is necessary.

Hence, the fact-filled stunning disclosure:

"Socialized Medicine Sucks"

Justin Bieber is a citizen of one of those countries with socialized medicine. Is he unhappy with it:

Asked (in Rolling Stone Magazine) if he wanted to become an American citizen, Bieber made clear his love for Canada -- and its health care system.

"You guys are evil," he told the magazine, out on February 18th. "Canada's the best country in the world. We go to the doctor and we don't need to worry about paying him, but here, your whole life, you're broke because of medical bills. My bodyguard's baby was premature, and now he has to pay for it. In Canada, if your baby's premature, he stays in the hospital as long as he needs to, and then you go home."

He got it right. Those who want to treat healthcare as a luxury item are evil. He, and his whole family are Holy Rollers. They understand that it's hypocrisy to call yourself a Christian while treating healthcare like it's a luxury item. If there is a God, you people are gunna be very sorry for the way you wanted to treat the least among you. For your sake, I hope there is no God. Your God will not accept your bullshyt rationalizations. Pain n' suffering, due to untreated (or poorly treated) health problems, should never be rationalized as being just. It won't fly. It's an embarrassment for this country. You are an embarrassment for this country. You are more sick than I will ever be. We are the only industrialized country in the world without socialized healthcare. The answer to that embarrassment is not to go live in those other countries. It's to stay here, and beat your selfish ass. It is time for this fight. It is time to beat you embarrassing selfish bastards.

thing is, you have been subsidizing patients for years. why do you think medical costs are so high? because the insured have been supplementing the uninsured for years and years. they can't pay, so we pay extra-because the medical providers must get money from somewhere. so, non-payers get written off because those of us who can pay do-plenty.

the overall cost of insurance goes down to those who have when more people buy in. if everyone bought, the overall cost per policy would go down.


on the flip side of this-forcing insurers to carry high risk patients will swell the costs for the rest of us. they cost a lot because they get a lot more care, so once again the cost is spread to everyone. so is the cost of keeping kids on their parents tab til 26. it would have been better if a high risk plan was put in place-much like there is car insurance for high risk drivers-they pay thru the nose, rather than everyone paying thru the nose.


it's not a perfect plan-i've always wondered how you can force folks to buy insurance, i guess we're going to see if that can happen.

FTFY

:tro::tro:

The thought of a bunch of Nelson Mandela types trying to kick a$s is too funny. Especially when it's over Obamacare. You gonna fight green? Is Obama going to try and throw something w/o looking like a sissy this time?

the entire Old Testament is about pain and suffering so they might be fine.

You can debate me, you can call me names but don't bastardize my words, you don't know me and you can pander to the opinions of others all you want but in the end assuming you can see into someone soul is the definition of arrogance. Perhaps you should take a long look in the mirror yourself.

A worthy effort Danzig, but del and the boys have had this very important point explained to them countless times over the course of this debate. It has no effect. They can't refute it of course, but they do a splendid job of ignoring it and going on to making their same point over and over....no matter how nonsensical.

Dell ... you might re-read what Scuds wrote before you agree with it. He was addressing YOU, and those like YOU who are against healthcare for all being affordable in this country.

And you agreed with it? :zz:

And I agree with Scuds. Not the wording, exactly, but ... :tro:

Ror !! You should check your condescending attitude at the log -in.

Your wordsmithing is so lame...get over yourself please!

Don't make up outright lies about my views, Geeker.

Because I disagree with your world view, instead of debating the substance, you personally attack me...and you call me "condescending"...your posts are the essence of that! Get over your own self! If you knew anything about me, you'd know how ridiculous your accusations are...I could personally care less but your posts are nothing more than pandering...phony and without insight or merit.

Yeah that is what you are doing "debating the substance". Take your lame act elsewhere - it's transparent to all.

Oh I guess except to you.

You're weird. You don't even participate in the debate, you only jump in to change the words of other posters to make it falsely appear they are attacking you. Then when they rightly deny they have attacked you (because they have not), then you get angry and use your own created attack on yourself as an excuse to let loose at them?

And you call them names?

Ya got yourself some major issues, there, don't ya?

:rolleyes: I'll consider the source:zz:

Please put me on your IGGY !

Not to worry, I only responded because you falsified my post...been there, answered that...done with ya!

Naw. Sorry. I won't be your "mean oppressor" in spite of your begging for victimhood.

But you are free to continue beating yourself up (even if you have to pretend other posters are doing it when they are not).

I'll just continue to sit back and watch your weird self-implosion.

Yup you got it all figured out :zz:


!!

I am not against healthcare being affordable for all. I realize healthcare is very expensive especially specialty care and unless you take from some to give others it can never be affordable to all. Medicare/Cade is a run away train as is Social Security. We don't need and can't afford another one at this time. Why not a mansion tax to provide shelter to the homeless?

And if you re-read his post he is sick of that view and ready to kick some ass hence my post being he is a Mandela on your quiz.

Well, considering this administration finally, after 60 years, got the first nationwide healthcare reform passed, albeit basic, in spite of stiff opposition from those that spent years proposing the very same thing, and outright lies about content, I think "ass has already been kicked" on this one ;)

As far as Medicare being a runaway train, I'd think you'd then be quite happy about the billions of waste that is eliminated within Medicare over 10 years due to the PPACA.

and I think you'll be amazed at how much waste (in the form of needless visits, tests, therapy) will be created with the PPACA should it be somehow found constitutional.

Why in the world would you think needless visits would be generated? :zz: How? Why?

It's pretty well proven axiom that eliminating people from going to the ER for such things as colds, intermittant diabetic/heart care, etc - and instead going regularly to their family physician or regular doctor, because they now have health insurance - absolutely decreases "needless" visits, and vastly improves health care, while decreasing the cost for everyone.

You realize not all Dr's/Clinics are 100% honest. 'Patients' armed with an insurance card can go in with a back problem, the clinic dr. can do a barrage of tests including MRI's daily therapy etc and the patient leaves with prescription, the clinic/dr make a fortune and we all get f'd. Similar to seniors on medicare selling their prescriptions for everything from viagra to vicodine. All it takes is one bad dr. for every 100 good ones.

I've been to the ER many times and not once have I seen someone come in for a cold or bad back for that matter. There already are county hospitals and clinics in place and in this country at least you get what you pay for.

:zz: That's exactly how it is now. So why in the world would you think it would increase? How will the PPACA increase the amount of fraud? People still have to pay a copay if they want to see a doctor.

Are you accusing currently uninsured people of being frauds in waiting?

You are saying that increasing the number of people with health insurance will increase the incidence of fraud? That's absurd.

Seriously? You are actually going to use that as an argument? :D Okay - How many times have you been to an ER, and how many times have you been informed personally by the charge nurse of the ailments of the current patient census?

I really don't care, because I spent 10 years as a paramedic in the NW suburban hosp. system, and in the NW portion of Chicago, and I have personally brought more non-emergent patients to the ER than you've ever had even imaginary ER trips - I'll guarantee that up front.

So sorry Dell - yes, people without insurance come in constantly to ER's for non-emergent problems when that is one's only option, because you don't have health insurance. Not exactly a big secret within the medical world. Don't take my word for it. In fact, it's commonly known, and clearly identified as one of the largest contributors to everyone's health care costs - yours, too - and decreased quality of health care for the constantly sick.

Uh, yeah, that's exactly the problem - this is the United States of America, and our citizens are ill and dying because they can't afford health care. We do not have the best health care in the world. We have an outrageous infant mortality rate. These folks are getting exactly what they pay for. That's why the majority in this country wants that fixed.

1) Latins are gunna breed at a higher rate than selfish white Republicans.

2) Selfish Pat Buchanan types are gunna die off.

3) Through the internet etc., young people will be better informed about the fact that we are the only industrialized country in the world without socialized medicine. Many people don't know this, because Republicans make it seem like it's a radical thing to do. It is not. The way you want to do it is the radical way to go. Republicans flourish when ignorance reigns. They do poorly when people are fully informed (which is actually pretty rare.) Justin Beiber just informed how many future American voters? They are being deprived of something that people in Canada have ( the security of knowing they won't be bankrupted by catastrophic medical bills.) Del, the internet is not the Republicans' friend.

We are already paying much more for our healthcare than other countries do (and we're getting less care than they get.) Really, what your doing (by linking medical care to financial status) is showing disrespect for some human life, and you can't be surprised that many of our citizens turn out to violently show a lack of concern for human life.

No fraud will continue at the same rate it is currently. As I stated in another post, 10% in the Medicare world. It's the 40 million new patients that will increase fraud, many who are 'subsidized' thus have shall we say 'less' interest in cost. Life isn't always fair as demonstrated by the fact 42% of households pay no income tax. Deal with it.

IMO The government needs to stay in the governing business and stay out of healthcare all together. We have the most expensive system because we are the most advanced. This is evidenced by a myriad of world leaders including the King of Saudi Arabia who could have chosen any caregiver on the planet yet chose the USA and its miserable health care system. Don’t try and fix what’s not broken.