Spectacular Bid
 

Looking at the 70's the best I could - I have to think for sure he's the top rated horse since 1970.

He had that sprinter/miler pedigree and was basically a machine between the distances of 7 furlongs to 10 furlongs.




A perfect 24-for-24 record at 15 different tracks - 23 of the 24 wins coming by 1.5 lengths or more. 14 Grade 1 wins - a slew of track records set - a great champion at ages 2, 3, and 4 who ran in all regions.

Certainly faced a lot of quality competition in all regions. A consistantly great speed figure horse as well. He was faster than Affirmed and Seattle Slew on Ragozin at both 3yo seasons VS 3yo seasons and 4yo seasons VS 4yo seasons. Secretariat was faster than the Bid in his three triple crown wins vs Bid's 3 triple crown races .. but overall .. he was as fast and a lot more consistant than "Big Red" at age 3 .. and unlike Secretariat - he actually came back for a 4-year-old season - improved and dominated.

As we all know - that type of progression from age 3 to age 4 doesn't always happen.

Thanks for posting that freaks PPs

Two things:

1. He lost.
2. Ergo, he stinks.

Plus, come on, did he run in the last 40 years? Then he really couldn't have done much for horse racing, 24-24 between 7-10f or not.

Some of those fractions and final times are amazing. I can't imagine how much time a Pletcher horse would have to take off after any one of those efforts in California.

I guess they never heard of the "bounce" back then.

Can you please post Zenyatta's PPS to show just how much better she is than Spectacular Bid?

thanks for posting; pretty f'n amazing!

how far was the Jockey Club Gold Cup he lost to Affirmed in 1979?

The spacing of the races is amazing. I mean he just ran, took zero out of him and hed come back and jerk them again. Monster

1 1/2 miles

Zenyatta has a great cut in terms of her PP's ... she falls a long way short in a lot of different other areas though.

Here are cuts of a few good in-form So. Cal horses The Bid dismantled when he went out West.

* Beau's Eagle (19-9-3-4 lifetime) didn't fare so well in his two meetings:



* Flying Paster (13-for-27 lifetime and voted California horse of the year in '78) he was basically owned by The Bid. Aaron Hesz swears Flying Paster was a sensationally good horse.



* Relaunch (not exactly the best of horses - but a damn good sire. He sired a Breeders Cup Classic winner in Skywalker - and was the dam sire of BC Classic winner Ghostzapper) He got destroyed by the Bid in two meetings.



* Valdez (8-for-16 lifetime classy Grade 1 winner)




Obviously, The Bid faced a lot better competition in the East ... but he just shipped out to So. Cal and absolutely curb stomped all of the best horses out there. He went 1:20 flat in the Malibu off a layoff.

You weren't here when I posted the same breakdown 4 years ago. Its in the archives somewhere. The Bid is unmatched.

What a monster!

the Bid is number one for me. In my book there have been none better.

look at his SA campaign in 1980. 7F to 10F, he ran everyone off their feet. smoked 'em

He deserves the Diane Lane movie.

Paster was a complete monster. He just was unlucky, historically speaking.

I was a big fan of Valdez. He sired an early favorite of mine, Basic Rate.

For sure?

These horses were before my time, so I can't say definitively, but when you factor in Secretariat's superiority at distances beyond 10f - and the ability he showed on turf - I have hard time saying anyone is "for sure" better than him historically.

I think you're right that if you look only at running 7f-10f on the dirt, the Bid is probably the best ever. But as I know you know well, that isn't all there is to the sport. Could Sec have dominated a 7f race like the Malibu the way the Bid did? I'm guessing probably not. But could the Bid do what Sec did in the Belmont and the Man O' War? Probably not.

His schedule leading-up to the Kentucky Derby is insane by today's standards... Hutch/Foy/Fla/Flamingo/Blue Grass... many Derby starters don't even have that many starts period.

Secretariat's win in the first Marlboro Cup was one of his best races as well. The final time was a record and they timed one more furlong to get him at 10fs in 1:57 and 4/5.

As mentioned earlier - it was 12 furlongs.

It was also a 3-year-old Spectacular Bid VS a 4-year-old Affirmed.

Len Ragozin wrote a book many years ago called 'The Odds Must Be Crazy' - it was a very good read - but he comes across as a braggart of epic proportions. I'm talking multiple 100/1 shots winners - scoring huge on an imposter horse at 57/1 in a famous betting coup - and even making a $51,000 boxing bet against his idol Muhammed Ali in the fight Holmes destroyed him.

Anyway, he writes about proposing a deal with Affirmed's owner for a $50,000 bet between the two - double booking - with Ragozin taking The Bid. He mentioned that Spectacular Bid was actually consistently faster as a 3yo than Affirmed was as a 4yo...and Affirmed was obviously one of the great 4yo's of all-time.

Spectacular Bid's dam was a Northern Cal sprinter - and he was shockingly beat at 12fs in the Belmont by horses he owned. If you watch the race with Affirmed - it was a total tactical defeat and Bid really ran the better of the two. Affirmed was allowed unpressed on the lead through a 25 flat first quarter. Basically, the trainer and jockey of the Bid were more worried about him getting the distance than they were about Affirmed.

Pincay rode a brilliant race and floated the Bid out on both turns .. he actually seemed to cross into his path turning for home..and the Bid had to dive inside of Affirmed for the stretch run despite being floated wider both turns .. he made up some ground through the stretch but came up less than a length short.

Secretariat and Affirmed both suffered defeats to older horses at age 3 on two occasions each. Seattle Slew put in a non-effort in his only start after the triple crown when drubbed out West in the Swaps. A great 4-year-old should be able to beat a great 3-year-old the majority of the time.

His wins were almost all by open lengths . He is laid to rest in his entirety at Milfer Farm, atop a scenic, windswept hill in upstate NY.

Feb 17, 1973 - June 9, 2003

I said top rated - not necessarily better. There was no 4-year-old season from Secretariat.

To me - Secretariat is hands down the greatest 3-year-old of all-time in terms of how he performed in the triple crown series. It's not even close. But the triple crown series isn't the be all - end all. Mine That Bird ran strongly in it - while horses like Skip Away didn't - and others like Tiznow missed it.

However - Secretariat actually ran 3 pretty darn slow races in his preps leading into the Derby. They found a tooth abscess after his sound Wood Memorial defeat to Angle Light. Obviously he was a brand new horse again after that.

He was defeated in two of his three dirt races against older males. Prove Out absolutely smoked him at 12 furlongs. Big Red's two turf races were both GREAT - but you're talking about American turf racing.

In terms of attempting to rate them - Big Red and Bid are close through their 2yo and 3yo season .. the deciding factor for me is one ran at 4 and the other didn't.

Thanks for posting, The Bid was the greatest ever

and have to add that progression from age 2 to age 3 doesn't always happen either.............just look at all of the 2 yr old champions since The Bid, and not one has repeated as 3 yr old champion. He was AMAZING

That void is over in 2 months.

I was just thinking that.

Well, let's use Zenyattard type logic with this, and draw this out to it's logical conclusion.

If Spectacular Bid is the last 2yo champion to also be named 3yo champion, that makes Lookin at Lucky the best male horse since the Bid!!!

Since this was way before I started following the sport, what was the reason for not going for the triple crown?

I agree. Paster was a monster and it's a shame that he lost when it counted most.

He did. He lost the Belmont - which is a 1 1/2 mile race.

Coastal beat him:



Coastal was a close 3rd to Affirmed and Bid in the 12f race following the last one shown on the pp cut above.

God forbid, Lucky could not come close to The Bid, and maybe the voters will vote for thr Best 3yr old this year, Eskenderyea and not Lucky

I'd have to say that LAL is at least the equal of the Bid. LAL was able to win on TWO different surfaces! Until you can show me when the Bid did that, I'm going to rank LAL higher.

could I please have what you are drinking, must be some strong ****

Speaking of LAL, I heard that they just sold him for $16 million. I heard it on Saturday. I'm surprised I haven't seen it written anywhere yet. People have been talking about it for the last 4 days.

It's a special drink that you can only buy in Southern California. It's Zenyatta Kool Aid.

Wow, that's pretty psychotic.

I don't really need to ask who the buyers are, do I?

Dan Snyder? It was either that or give McNabb a 6th year.

lol, it must a real strong drink

Well, yeah, besides the usual sugars, artificial flavors and colors, and such, it also has jimson weed extract. Jimson weed is a plentiful plant, especially in Southern California, where I'd see it all the time when I'd go out and forage wild plants for myself.

From Wiki:

Datura intoxication typically produces a complete inability to differentiate reality from fantasy (delirium, as contrasted to hallucination); hyperthermia; tachycardia; bizarre, and possibly violent behavior; and severe mydriasis with resultant painful photophobia that can last several days. Pronounced amnesia is another commonly reported effect.

Also from Wiki:

In the United States the plant is called jimson weed, or more rarely Jamestown weed; it got this name from the town of Jamestown, Virginia, where British soldiers were drugged with it while attempting to suppress Bacon's Rebellion. They spent eleven days generally appearing to have gone insane:

And finally, from Wiki:

The James-Town Weed (which resembles the Thorny Apple of Peru, and I take to be the plant so call'd) is supposed to be one of the greatest coolers in the world. This being an early plant, was gather'd very young for a boil'd salad, by some of the soldiers sent thither to quell the rebellion of Bacon (1676); and some of them ate plentifully of it, the effect of which was a very pleasant comedy, for they turned natural fools upon it for several days: one would blow up a feather in the air; another would dart straws at it with much fury; and another, stark naked, was sitting up in a corner like a monkey, grinning and making mows [grimaces] at them; a fourth would fondly kiss and paw his companions, and sneer in their faces with a countenance more antic than any in a Dutch droll.

In this frantic condition they were confined, lest they should, in their folly, destroy themselves — though it was observed that all their actions were full of innocence and good nature. Indeed, they were not very cleanly; for they would have wallowed in their own excrements, if they had not been prevented. A thousand such simple tricks they played, and after eleven days returned themselves again, not remembering anything that had passed. – The History and Present State of Virginia, 1705

I actually heard it was Coolmore.