Derby Trail Forums - Monmouth Park Week 2 Handle up 122%

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CharlieR

05-31-2010 09:14 PM

Monmouth Park Week 2 Handle up 122%

http://monmouthpark.com/news.aspx?id=3019

From Monmouthpark.com

OCEANPORT, N.J. – Following Monday’s Memorial Day card, handle for the holiday weekend at Monmouth Park totaled $24,912,191 a 122% increase over last year, when $11,222,330 was wagered. :$::tro:

Total attendance for the 3-day weekend was 38,543, a 15.5% increase over 2009, as on-track handle came in at $2,925,073, a 44% increase.

We were in the picnic area at Monmouth on Sunday and it was packed. Great weather, nice day out with the family and broke even on the day!:)

ateamstupid

05-31-2010 09:47 PM

But what was Belmont's ontrack handle? :rolleyes:

randallscott35

06-01-2010 07:04 AM

Looks like handle will be up more than 30%.

CSC	06-01-2010 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ateamstupid (Post 652910)

But what was Belmont's ontrack handle? :rolleyes:

Why do we always have to compare it to Belmont's handle, the fact is whatever Monmouth is doing is working. If both are healthy who cares which handle is higher.

philcski

06-01-2010 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randallscott35 (Post 652936)

Looks like handle will be up more than 30%.

Nope. Can't happen. 15% would be nearly unattainable.

CSC	06-01-2010 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 652966)

What is your definition of working?

If the only goal here is to increase handle from last year it is definitely working. No ifs ands or buts

But idea here is to have a sustainable business model. To stay in business.

Is current handle sufficient to cover the higher purse payouts? That is the question and answer is clearly no not now. Handle needs to be significantly higher

As far as comparing to Belmont it is next door, dealing with same demographics. If Belmont is generating higher handle and paying out less in purses that tells us something.

Its about sustainable business models. Not short term thinking thats how we are where we are

Understand its a last desperate effort. And am pulling hard for it to work. Going to enjoy betting it all summer.

But trying to be realistic here.

Maybe I should have wrote a preamble, for me it has been working. Larger fields, large purses, higher profile connections, big name Jocks, I am speaking on behalf of myself that never paid much attention to Monmouth in the past, now it has atleast gotten my attention and from what I have seen early on, I will concentrate more plays there. It's no different than going to a buffet, all bettor's want are more choices.

ateamstupid

06-01-2010 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSC (Post 652959)

Why do we always have to compare it to Belmont's handle, the fact is whatever Monmouth is doing is working. If both are healthy who cares which handle is higher.

My feelings exactly.

randallscott35

06-01-2010 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ateamstupid (Post 653047)

My feelings exactly.

Are they both healthy though?

randallscott35

06-01-2010 01:36 PM

This is an overall industry health issue. This has little to do with NY or NJ or anyplace else...Just to be clear.

dalakhani

06-01-2010 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 652966)

What is your definition of working?

If the only goal here is to increase handle from last year it is definitely working. No ifs ands or buts

But idea here is to have a sustainable business model. To stay in business.

Is current handle sufficient to cover the higher purse payouts? That is the question and answer is clearly no not now. Handle needs to be significantly higher

As far as comparing to Belmont it is next door, dealing with same demographics. If Belmont is generating higher handle and paying out less in purses that tells us something.

Its about sustainable business models. Not short term thinking thats how we are where we are

Understand its a last desperate effort. And am pulling hard for it to work. Going to enjoy betting it all summer.

But trying to be realistic here.

If handle isnt sufficient to cover purses where do we go then next year? Will people assume, based on this years handle that they would get same results with $350-$400k in purses? What is the backup plan?

Homer-

Do you really think thats true? I remember monmouth being over an hour away from new york city but i could be wrong. That being the case, wouldnt that change things a little?

Also, in terms of "sustainable business models" as you put it, which track/circuits work beside the ones that are supplemented by slots?

I think what Monmouth is doing is part of the future of the sport. The bigger, deeper fields with higher purses makes a lot more sense on many levels than the way Belmont or Hollywood park does it.

The traditional model for horse racing as a self sustaining business is broken. The world has changed. Entertainment options both sporting or otherwise have grown exponentially since the heyday of the game. Randall hit it right on the head. These problems that you are speaking of are industry issues.

dalakhani

06-01-2010 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 653072)

Yes think its same general demographic

It is an hour away.

Both are drawing from wealthy customers with disposable income

NJ and NYC very similar in alot of ways

Comparing Mon to Bel not like comparing Belmont to Praire Meadows

Diverse ethnic places with above average income

Understand south Jersey more tied to Philly

Belmont is located within train or cab distance from the richest and most powerful people in the world.

Monmouth is in New Jersey.

Now, do you really want to go into the differences? In terms of accessiblity alone, we are talking about different planets.

hockey2315

06-01-2010 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalakhani (Post 653081)

This is worthless on several levels.

randallscott35

06-01-2010 04:42 PM

Let the good times roll.

Monmouth Park | Posted 6/1/2010, 5:13 pm
Monmouth business booming
By Matt Hegarty
Betting and attendance figures for the first five days of the Monmouth Park meet have far exceeded the expectations of the track's operator and the racing officials who supported the adoption of an experimental 50-day meet guaranteeing $1 million in average purse distribution per day, the racing officials said.

Over the first five days, average handle has been $8,263,283 per card, up 162 percent compared to the total average for a 93-day meet last year and up 122 percent compared to the handle on corresponding dates last year, according to figures supplied by Monmouth and on race charts. Average attendance is up 86 percent, while field size has increased by nearly two horses per race, from 7.5 last year to 9.4 this year.

Revidere

06-01-2010 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalakhani (Post 653081)

Checking out after this display of brilliance.:zz:

10 pnt move up

06-01-2010 05:33 PM

Crist goes to great efforts to compare Monmouth to Belmont again in his blog, in a negative light IMO, it escapes me why he chooses to do so other than personal bias. There is no logical comparison or reason to make such. The article is clearly to show how superior a choice Belmont is despite Monmouths best effort, which is irrelevant to anything as a horse player. The only comparison should be previous Monmouth meets. The new product that New Jersey has provided the better has led them to wager more money into the pools.

dalakhani

06-01-2010 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revidere (Post 653131)

Checking out after this display of brilliance.:zz:

:) considering source

philcski

06-01-2010 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cardus (Post 653132)

HomerS has an unusual style, but his posts' substance is terrific.

Yes... reading his posts, sometimes I forget punctuation exists in the English language.

Revidere

06-01-2010 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalakhani (Post 653134)

:) considering source

Excellent consideration since I live in Monmouth County and was at Belmont yesterday !!

I am neither rich, nor powerful. Might have been a little richer if they took Maylan down yesterday in the 6th.

dalakhani

06-01-2010 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revidere (Post 653136)

It was a playful jab at the garden st. I apologize. My point stands that the demographics are different.

Of course new yorkers go to Monmouth but it's not the same as going to elmont. I'm not going to rip nj but let's not pretend that it is a simple choice as if it were like going to the meadowlands.

To use another sport as comparison, the orioles and nationals are closer together than Monmouth and Belmont. Anyone in our area will tell you that the demographics for the o' and nats are completely different. Same way in football.

Do pimlico and Charlestown have the same demographic? Yeah some of the same people go to both but they are different markets.

Let's not act like Monmouth is the 6th borough.

MaTH716

06-01-2010 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 653158)

No, not considering Monmouth to be NYC suburb. But also not Cherry Hill or Cape May.

Plenty of people in that area commute into NYC every day. As we unfortunately saw on 9-11.

Monmouth doesnt have the brand recognition of NYRA tracks which is part of reason for handle discrepancy. I think they have a good brand, been underappreciated over the years. This year should only improve it.
People have discretionary income. Clearly alot of choices if you live in tri state area.

Look at Belmonts attendance. That is a shame. Put aside problem with current cards, even when they were putting out great quality racing people just do not show up in person there. They are missing out its a beautiful track. But they do get a lot of betting.

Monmouth has alot of two dollar bettors. Not that there is anything wrong with that. They just need to get more business from the heavier hitters.

Cardus- thank you

I don't think Monmouth was underappreciated, it had to do with racing product that Monmouth gave us just not being very good. But the $2 dollar bettors (as you call them) just doesn't know the difference. They are there just to enjoy a day out at the track.

As far as attendence goes, it really doesn't matter as long as people are betting on the races from somewhere. Sure it would be nice if Belmont (or all tracks for that matter) drew big crowds on a daily basis. But there is alot of different entertainment options that Belmont is up against being in the biggest market in the world. I do also think logistics hurts Belmont with their attendence numbers, it's just easier to bet from your house or the local OTB. From many parts of the city/boroughs, Belmont is a gigantic pain in the ass to get to and from. I have to admit, that I used to live about the same distance between Monmouth and Belmont (being in Staten Island). And every time I chose to go to Monmouth. I had every intention of playing Belmont, but it was going to be from Monmouth Park.

"People have discretionary income" I don't think people have as much of this as you think.

parsixfarms

06-02-2010 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 653158)

Cardus- thank you

A DT first?

dalakhani

06-02-2010 02:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 653158)

No, not considering Monmouth to be NYC suburb. But also not Cherry Hill or Cape May.

Plenty of people in that area commute into NYC every day. As we unfortunately saw on 9-11.

Monmouth doesnt have the brand recognition of NYRA tracks which is part of reason for handle discrepancy. I think they have a good brand, been underappreciated over the years. This year should only improve it.

People have discretionary income. Clearly alot of choices if you live in tri state area.

Look at Belmonts attendance. That is a shame. Put aside problem with current cards, even when they were putting out great quality racing people just do not show up in person there. They are missing out its a beautiful track. But they do get a lot of betting.

Monmouth has alot of two dollar bettors. Not that there is anything wrong with that. They just need to get more business from the heavier hitters.
Cardus- thank you

And you think this is purely coincidental? The people that bet big money at the track are people that are very aware of the changes that are going on at monmouth so the "brand recognition" idea doesn't really fly from where I sit in that regard. So the question is, why do you think bigger bettors will go to belmont and not monmouth? Lets be honest with ourselves. Monmouth is always going to have more "two dollar bettors" as you so aptly described them. Its because its a DIFFERENT DEMOGRAPHIC. Its on the shore. You have many more vacationers that are going to frequent the track and those people have LESS disposable income than the typical Belmont patron.

The idea is not how to get the bigger bettors to come down to the shore. The idea is to grow within your usual demographic first and maximize your profit there. How do you do that?

Again, we are getting into an industry issue much more so than an individual track issue. There are ways that monmouth park could draw more attendees and more ontrack handle. There are ways monmouth park could draw more revenue from the people that are already attending.

dalakhani

06-02-2010 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomerS (Post 653223)

Ill try to clear this demographic thing up. I am not saying that the people who go to Belmont and Monmouth are the same exact demographic. If anything thought I was saying they werent- based on their betting amounts. What I am saying is both Monmouth and Belmont are basically drawing from the same general demographic as far as potential customers.

Not like Prairie Downs versus Belmont.

The Monmouth crowd is alot younger then the Belmont crowd to say nothing of the Aqueduct crowd. I'm in my 40's and when I go to Aqueduct think I am the youngest there. Which is part of the reason for the handle discrepancy.

But they are appealing to the bigger players with their current cards. Which is good. But concern is what if they go to 350k-400k in purses next year. What then?

All of this would be moot if the casinos didnt own the NJ politicians. Pretty much everyone agrees if you had slots at the Meadowlands that alone would provide enough supplemental revenue to keep Monmouth going. Could maintain higher purses and bigger fields.

Lastly as far as getting more revenue out of your current customers think that any strategy that is not player friendly focused is a loser. Gouging people on parking, admission, programs, concessions is a bad practice, and again part of the reason racing is where its at now. Went to Monmouth Sunday and they upped price of everything from last year. Used to be free parking, first time had to pay in several years. Admission was higher too. Bad business practice. Now if talking about reducing takeout thats a whole different story

How about instead of gouging your clients or reducing takeout, you offer more value? How about finding out what would attract more of the young people to the track? How about installing light stanchens (sp?) a la churchill downs and doing night racing on friday nights? Why not educate the people that you are drawing and fatten them up with contests and giveaways? Why not offer different entertainment acts? Why not have acts or contests or giveaways during the intervals between the races? There are a million things you could do. This is not earth shattering. This is basic marketing.

Why do so many people think that the Sport of horse racing is beyond simple marketing? Is it because the NTRA has been in charge of that for so long? I guess i just answered my own question.

dalakhani

06-02-2010 08:15 AM

Think about something as ridiculous as the "epic buffet" at charlestown. Its a huge draw. That place is packed every friday and saturday and also sunday for brunch.

They put a carving station and shellfish out and those rednecks think they are eating at Per Se.

Sure, its a restaurant packed with two dollar bettors but there is no doubt that there are some players that have been attracted or created by that place.

GBBob

06-02-2010 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalakhani (Post 653234)

Slightly off topic, but Joe Kristufek and Brian Spencer started doing "seminars" on busy days at AP last year. It started out with them just having a microphone and saying to please ask any questions...A few people would come up to them. This year, they brought out tables and a white board and explained ROI and if you want to bet $10.oo on a race, instead of doing $5 WP, try an exacta key or Tri keys, etc. Drew up the bet and exactly how to do it. Last weekend they had 30 or 40 casual bettors huddled around the board every hour all day learning something they never would on their own. It's great to see that.

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