That didnt take long....
 

http://www.businessweek.com/news/201...-update1-.html


AT&T previously received a tax-free benefit from the government to subsidize health-care costs for retirees, who would otherwise be on a Medicare Part D plan. Under the new bill, AT&T will no longer be able to deduct that subsidy.

“As a result of this legislation, including the additional tax burden, AT&T will be evaluating prospective changes to the active and retiree health-care benefits offered by the company,” the carrier said in the filing.

AT&T’s announcement was followed about an hour later by 3M, the St. Paul, Minnesota-based maker of products ranging from Post-It Notes to respiratory masks. 3M said it expects a one-time expense of $85 million to $90 million after tax, or about 12 cents a share, in the first quarter because of the new law, according to a statement. 3M had about 75,000 employees as of Feb. 5.

Michael Coe, a spokesman for the carrier, declined to comment. Peter Thonis, a spokesman for Verizon Communications Inc., which also employs more than 200,000 people, declined to comment.

New York-based Verizon, the second-largest U.S. phone company, told employees in a note after the law was signed that the tax will make the subsidy less valuable to employers like Verizon and so “may have significant implications for both retirees and employers.”


In other words employees and retirees at the countries biggest companies are going to pay the price for the current administrations zeal to punish businesses. What was that i heard about this bill not effecting the middle class?

"Affecting," not "effecting."

Okay, so you're against gov't paying for health care, and now, that the gov't is removing a tax break (which means that gov't was in effect paying for AT&T's employees' health care) you're also against that? So you're against the gov't paying and you're against the company paying. Who do you think should pay? The retirees?

Thanks for the spelling correction.

But try to follow along with the topic here. This was sold as a bill that was a win/win for everyone (except those pesky rich people making 200k or these CEO indulging corporations). It has taken less than a week for it to be a loss/loss for the employees and retirees of American business.

The idea that American corporations would simply "take" the higher taxes or removal of a tax incentive was ridiclous. The Dems knew this was coming down or they were simply burying their heads in the sand. This being American workers and retirees from our biggest and best companies getting lesser coverage, paying higher rates or being dumped into the govt pool.

Basically they lied to everyone. This IS going to cost the middle class more, you very well MAY have to change Doctors, and the govt programs ARE going to be overwhelmed and become further bloated leading to that supposedly new, streamlined, money saving system to be more of the same old, complicated, money buring entitlement program.

It isnt about what i think or believe or desire. This is simply about important issues surrounding this bill being exposed less than a week after its passage. You can close your eyes and pretend that it isnt funded by taking from the middle class and leaving them in many cases with worse coverage but that wont change the fact it is. Perhaps you are perfectly willing to take that hit. But most people wont and the fact that the Dems and Obama were so willing to cobble together any possible revenue sources to make their numbers palatable to pass this bill makes me think that there are going to be a whole lot more of the "surprises" coming in the future.

Does you expect anything less from the conniving, misleading, lieing O'Dumbass and the rest of his Democratic cronies?

Four more years baby

Americans favor the new Health Care plan, the economy will continue to improve, stock market climbing..

You will need more shovels to dig your ignorant...albeit patriotic ass...a deeper bunker.

Where is the money going to come for this so called health care? Oh thats right taxes will be raised. How is raising taxes going to improve the economy. Alot of Americans don't favor this health care bill. Obviously you don't read the newspaper or watch the news. Im sure your brain washed by O'Dumbass.

Dude I hope you are right , my step dad retired from AT&T and is in treatment for multiple myloma , the insurance he has with their plan covers just about all of his costs . Do you think the company will have enough money to keep on with the really good insurance ? Do you really think that if they cant keep providing him with the insurance for his treatments that the government will provide him the exact same benefits that this private company has ?

My company announced that it may have to drop all retirees first and are looking at reducing the current employee health benefit.


Obama campaigned on a healthcare plan that will reduce the average healthcare costs by $2,500. Oh and healthcare is now a right. So...

I demand my right to $2,500 :rolleyes:

of course a reduction in Obama speak means it was going to cost me $5,000 more but now with his new plan it is only going to cost me an extra $2,500. (not counting the increase in taxes when the Bush tax cust expire)

I wonder how many companies will simply leave the united states.

My sister has lost her job and my cousin was just told that her job is gone.
(I'm certain they both voted for Obama) I'm just saying ...I could be next.

Not a chance. Obama is a one and done that will take years to clean up his mess.

Yes I do see big companies sending as much of their work force overseas as possible.

We'll see..I admit my post was an attempt to troll out certain righties here ( not you), but I seriously think that if the ecomony turns in the next 2 years he has a very good chance. Especially if Palin and the Tea Baggers continue to splinter the Republicans

I don't typically post on political items, but I would think a lot more companies are going to "reconsider" what they're doing on the health insurance front and by 2014, pay the employer penalty and let their employees try their luck with these state-based exchanges.

Brock Lesner was in Canada when he got sick(er) and said, "I realised quickly that I had to get out of Canadian healthcare" I'm almost certain that it wasn't you promoting Canadian Healthcare but I don't remember anyone on the left speaking up and saying what a joke it is. I encourage you to argue with him :p

The economy will improve but only after the republicans take control of congress.;)

Just like
 

it improved during the last couple years of the Bush years?

Come on.....

The economy is cyclical in nature and frankly it does not matter all that much who is in power. Frankly, both parties do a poor job in running the country and also dealing with the issues. That said, it would be nice after 8 years of the far right and a couple of the far left to see something that resembles the middle.

One of the most accomplished first-years of any President, ever :tro:

Stem-cell research changes alone were life-altering, outstanding ...

FTFY ;)

LOL

All he did was change the funding for stem cell research, not actually conduct it.

Funny that despite such a great first year, so many people who approved of him going into that year no longer did after the year.

Yeah. That's kinda important, though ;)

Its not like there wasnt stem cell research before.

Alas, doesn't appear so ...

Of course there was. But cutting edge scientific research does so much better with government support, funding and acknowledgment as to it's validity, and when it's not funded equally to creationism :D

When a liberal, pro-labor president is only favorable to 58% of Union households, I wouldnt be real proud of that number.

The guy is governing centrist, with plenty of "to the right" consistency with Bush.

There was government funding and support for stem cell research , is the point you are trying to make about embreyo research and that the feds didnt fund it before . Im sure being as well read as you are scientists are finding that using cord blood and other tissues are proving to be more usefull than embreyo's. Just saying.

Yeah sure he is...

His voting record in the Senate was left of Bernie Sanders, he has expanded the govt in a frightening manner, he has slobbered all over labor unions, he just created a trillion dollar entitlement program, his Supreme Court nominee was admittedly far left of the center....

His voting record in the Senate isn't what we are talking about, his Presidency is.

"Frightening expansion" is your opinion, certainly not fact, and not really supported by any evidence if you are referring to healthcare reform (not even a public option) Not really sure what "frightening expansion" you are talking about.

The labor union comment is nothing more than a dig.

The "trillion dollar entitlement program" will cut the deficit by quite a bit, won't it? Trillion or so? But it isn't filled with many 'entitlements' at all, is it?

Yes, his SC appointee is left of center.

What do you think about all the "Bush" he's continued unabated?

The govt hasnt expanded on his watch? We have basically nationalized the auto industry. The govt now controls 18% of the economy via healthcare. Get real

Only someone with their eyes closed wouldnt admit his far left stance on labor.

Banking on the fiction that the deficit being cut doesnt make the program any less liberal. The public option wasnt included because it couldnt pass with it. pretending that it was dropped for any other reason is myopic.

Obama is not a centerist know matter how hard you want to believe it.

The government doesn't "control" healthcare. That's ridiculously bogus. The auto industry isn't "nationalized", either. The President has a problem with labor, his current unpopularity, as he hasn't given them anything special in the last year + joblessness.

Today he's signing in student loan reforms. This will save our country money, and encourage more students to attend college. I'm sure some will characterize this as a government takeover of education :D

hello??? The govt makes the rules. If that isnt control I dont know what is?

The President hasnt given organized labor anything? LOL.


It will "save our country money"? I love generalized, unsubstantiated quotes like this. Sounds nice but in the end is bs.

Since Govt is already in charge of the vast majority of education it has already taken it over. But they have taken over the student loan business. It isnt a "reform", it is a takeover.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...FTSecondBucket

Another explanation on why the bill will not pay for itself or reduce national debt

Please dont let this rub you the wrong my question for you is the following:

Correct me if im wrong, but doesnt this new helathcare bill mandates that everyone has to have health insurance? Isnt that a way of the government trying to control healthcare.

Wow what a suprise this healthcare bill wont pay for itself or reduce national debt. Interesting.

You definitely live in an information world different from many.

Trying to control healthcare costs. The government will still have nothing to do with determining anything at all about one's healthcare.

We are still the only first-world country without government-run healthcare.

If Obama was governing from the left, we'd have a public option.

Or one could quote other economists and the CBO who say it will, significantly.

So?

It's substantiated by the CBO and a little simple math. You simply have a propensity for dismissing anything you don't like hearing as 'bs'.

According to you Obama had the all time greatest first year as president and is operating as a centerist and isnt a staunch union man.

Yeah I'm talking crazy....

Bush restricted federal funding to 40 existing cell lines, telling scientists they couldn't use anything else. A political decision based strictly upon one man's certain religious view. And that view was based upon false information (involving abortion, tissue obtainment, etc)

The importance of Obama immediately lifting those restrictions results in the ability of science to use more than those basic cell lines.

Politicians have no business whatsoever inserting their personal religious views into our national and international scientific work.

Seriously - misquoting me by a few words here and there, resulting in changing my meaning, doesn't help build your case.

LOL. The CBO can only use the info given. You understand that if that info is faulty then the entire premise is faulty? And we have already seen from the actions of Fortune 500 companies that the math they used is going to be way off. As a matter of fact they are so pissed that they have been exposed that Waxman is calling those companies on the carpet for following the law! Naturally this story gets less than its fair share of coverage because it is a bit more complicated than the average moron can digest. But that doesnt make the fact that a whole lot of people are going to feel the pain of this bill real soon and those said people are the same people that were told wouldnt see any changes. Not to mention the huge amount of retirees and others about to be dumped in to medicare which werent accounted for and which in itself will throw their numbers askew.

But you keep on believing verbatim everything that politicians tell you. They would never lead you astray...