No Munnings for the Cigar
 

http://www.drf.com/news/article/109117.html

Wont make a decision on Quality Road until tomorrow but from what I heard, it doesnt look good for him either. I dont think they loved his breeze yesterday.

Looks like we are getting:

Driven by Success
Kodiak Kowboy
Pyro
Bribon
Vineyard Haven
Vacation

A short, compact field with a ton of talent.

Looking forward to this race and the entire day on Saturday.

Love those short fields.

Like Vacation to a run a big one..............6th looks likely

Where is the news about no Quality Road?

Oh you mean another wonderfully bred Phipps horse that's a plug?

I sometimes wonder how long Frankel would have been employed by Juddmonte if he did as poorly with their stock as Shug does with Phipps stock.

NT

No official decision has been made yet. They wont have this out until after noon. Just speculating based on how I heard the breeze went. They are bringing the horse out again today and then decide.

:tro:

It has been a tough year dont make me feel worse. The star of the barn is Book of Hymns enough said..

Still pending on Quality Road and now the weather is being brought into it. Supposed to have a lot of rain on Friday and they dont want to run him again on a muddy track...

http://www.drf.com/news/article/109125.html

Looking again like a very compact field, a la the Vosburgh.

Still looking better than the BC Mile was:D

Quality Road is out - going to Florida.

By van or by plane?

Walking

Maybe Todd's still pi** at Harlem Rocker's DQ last yr.

Kodiak Kowboy going for his Eclipse Award. He wins and he is a lock for sprinter of year.
Driven by Success trying to win his first Grade 1.
Vineyard Haven, Pyro and Bribon all trying to close out wonderful years in their own right with another Grade one win. Not a good betting race by any stretch of teh imagination but a great race to watch and root!

from drf:


The defection of Quality Road and Munnings, who will miss the race because of a foot injury, leaves the Cigar Mile with a likely five-horse field with only four betting interests. Vineyard Haven and Pyro, both owned by Sheikh Mohammed's Godolphin Stable, will be a coupled entry. Grade 1 winners Bribon and Kodiak Kowboy will also run as will the speedy New York-bred Driven by Success.

Funny race.

Bribon, Kodiak Kowboy and Pyro all kind of look like the same horse on paper. All sprinting/mile closers. Exactly the same running style. Bribon seems the best of these at this distance but Kodiak Kowboy is very gritty and finds ways to win races, even with pace scenarios not in his favor.

Driven by Success looks like the most likely pacesetter and may step out and try to bottom out this field. I think that would be his only chance. He fared well in the Met Mile and lasted much more of the mile than most thought. Then his form went south, but last out got a very nice confidence booster against overmatched state breds.

Vineyard Haven is the most versatile horse in here and its seems only logical that he'll set up camp right behind Driven by Success and have the best trip of any in here. Probably the most likely winner.

I wonder how they will bet this race. My guess:

Pyro/Vineyard Haven entry 7/5
Bribon 2/1
Kodiak Kowboy 3/1
Driven by Success 5/1
Vacation 18/1

He does? I know you scored on him last time with the Assjuice, but this is not a description I'd ever ascribe to him.

agree... I think he stinks, I love Bribon.

Uh-oh... I suspect the NYRA police will begin to browbeat you for complaining about the product.

I think Kodiak Kowboy is a pretty nice horse who has won a lot of races...
Better? He hasnt garnered the fan base of Fabulous Strike but hes hardly disgraced himself against that rival and people talk about Fabulous Strike like he's Housebuster. And he may not quite be up to the talent level or hypothetcial level of Warriors Reward, but hes a horse I get excited to watch.

How can Kodiak Kowboy win an Eclipse when he didn't run on the "Championship" day in the "Not Quite Turf Sprint"?:rolleyes:

Yes, you're right. His connections are weak. They didn't want to run on a foreign third surface. They also ducked the superior competition in the division by running in the Don Levine at Philly when they clearly should have run in the Tom Fool because that was a much tougher spot.:rolleyes:

How dare they turn down the "Super Bowl of racing."

NT

While you may be correct in him getting the eclipse it is absolutely wrong to let this race be counted as a sprint. It's not the Cigar Sprint.

It's sure drawn many top sprinters in its history, and happened to draw 2 multiple Grade 1 winning sprinters in the field this year.

I'm not sure this locks things up for Kodiak Kowboy over Zensational even though I think KK is a superior horse who has faced much better competition this year. They each have three grade 1 wins and all of Zensational's are at actual sprint distances.

The difference is that Kodiak Kowboy actually beat other Grade 1 horses when he won his Grade 1s.

Zensational beat Global Hunter (who won a Grade 1 going 9f on turf) and, I kid you not, two horses that ran for $25k in the previous year (Nikkisgoldensteed, Rush With Thunder).

Not sure if Talkin To Mom Roo is an ex-claimer, but the name sort of suggests it.

Can you read?

I said exactly what you said in fewer words.

I think Zensational is a totally overrated bum, but to think Kodiak Kowboy is a lock to win the Eclipse now is wishful thinking.

And the point of mine was to elaborate on the "better competition".

In fact, the difference in competition was staggering (not merely "better") and by that allow should make Kodiak Kowboy the clear frontrunner.

But hey, maybe they'll change the name of the Ancient Title to the Zensational to sway the vote.

Zensational may get 1 or 2 trivial votes but I dont think you can build any kind of reasonable case for any more than that. He won the most watered down Grade 1 sprints in the history of this division, with Talkin to Mom Roo probably the best horse he beat. He never left the state of CA and the poly surface. I think you can build a better case for the horse who beat him in the BC Sprint- Dancing in Silks. At least he beat Gayego and Fatal Bullet on their preferred surface and distance, and racked up a couple of other wins. Next would be Informed Decision who I would guess will get a few votes just for overall consistency and sheer number of wins. But she never faced the males and flopped badly in her race at Saratoga.

The obvious winner should and will be Kodiak Kowboy who has 3 Grade Ones against superior competition, at 3 different distances. When was the last time we've seen a horse win a Grade 1 at 6F, 7F and 1 mile? Not to mention a good 2nd in another Grade 1 (Forego), and 1 other win. Lets see he beat:

Fabulous Strike (twice)
Bribon
Munnings
Vineyard Haven
Pyro
Tale of Ekati

All of these horses have won at least one Grade 1 except Munnings. All much better than any of the horses any of the other contenders have beaten.

So what, it isnt a sprint. It is hardly important in the grand scheme but it drives me crazy when it is referred to when determining a sprint champion. It would be like using Gio Ponti's seond place finish in the BC Classic as a factor in him being turf champion. It may play like turf, but it isnt. The Cigar may have some sprinters in it but it isn't a sprint.

Well, I'm just looking at it historically. Look at the 1-2-3 horses in its entire history and more often than not, you will find top sprinters, as opposed to top route horses. Beyond Cigar, Congaree, and Forty Niner, most other winners were at their best around one turn.

If you want to call it a pointless race as far as Eclipse Awards are concerned (or better yet, point out the need for a top Miler award), that's fine. Nonetheless, certainly victories by horses outside their respective divisions are taken into consideration. Doesn't Zenyatta's win in the BC Classic against males help her cause for the older mare Eclipse?

And just for those keeping score, Kodiak Kowboy made the lead at the 1/16th pole, so technically, they were still sprinting at that point...

And its not like this is Kodiak's best distance. Hes a true sprinter. Look at his record this year as well as historically. 1 mile may not be considered a sprint, but given this field and the fact its still a 1 turn race, I dont see how anybody can say this race shouldnt count. How about those garbage Grade 1 races Zensational controlled from gate to wire? Because they are "sprints" they should somehow get this horse an eclipse? I think the emphasis should be placed on quality fields over minor technicalities like the added furlong.
Regardless, is there a better candidate for this award this year? I want to laugh very hard when I keep hearing Fabulous Strike in the argument.

Why is this even a debatable question? Sprint < mile ; Route > mile.

Changing definitions to hand out awards is just assinine