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-   -   Obama: Too much debt could fuel double-dip recession (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32831)

joeydb 11-18-2009 06:30 AM

Obama: Too much debt could fuel double-dip recession
 
So I guess he'll be retracting his support for a $1,000,000,000,000 healthcare plan now, right?

http://www.reuters.com/articlePrint?...88108620091118

Obama: Too much debt could fuel double-dip recession

BEIJING, Nov 18 (Reuters) - President Barack Obama gave his sternest warning yet about the need to contain rising U.S. deficits, saying on Wednesday that if government debt were to pile up too much, it could lead to a double-dip recession.

With the U.S. unemployment rate at 10.2 percent, Obama told Fox News his administration faces a delicate balance of trying to boost the economy and spur job creation while putting the economy on a path toward long-term deficit reduction.

His administration was considering ways to accelerate economic growth, with tax measures among the options to give companies incentives to hire, Obama said in the interview with Fox conducted in Beijing during his nine-day trip to Asia.

"It is important though to recognize if we keep on adding to the debt, even in the midst of this recovery, that at some point, people could lose confidence in the U.S. economy in a way that could actually lead to a double-dip recession," he said.

Danzig 11-18-2009 06:37 AM

now, after the stimulus that he called for hasn't worked, he's worried about debt? how much debt did that add? what about his proposed health care that will add to the deficit?



oh...i know...this is the lead-up to tax hikes. wonder what he'll add on once the bush tax cuts expire?

Riot 11-18-2009 09:40 PM

Geesh - majority of stimulus funds haven't even been disbursed yet (planned for over two years), that was planned from when Bush gave out the first part.

SOREHOOF 11-19-2009 04:34 AM

Bush is responsible for the TARP bailout not the stimulus. He bequethed half of it to Obama as part of the great inheritance that the Prez keeps bringing up. Stimulus is all Obama and the Dems.

Danzig 11-19-2009 05:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot
Geesh - majority of stimulus funds haven't even been disbursed yet (planned for over two years), that was planned from when Bush gave out the first part.



the stimulus this spring was billed as absolutely necessary to keep unemployment from reaching 10%. it's reached and passed that. as far as jobs saved/created, even obama said that figuring those figures is an inexact science.

gales0678 11-19-2009 07:11 AM

all great empire's fall from within , look at Rome, if anyone here has any young kid's i would suggest sending them for chinese lessson , the jobs are gone and they are not coming back in the manufacturing sector and financial sector

GBBob 11-19-2009 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gales0678
all great empire's fall from within , look at Rome, if anyone here has any young kid's i would suggest sending them for chinese lessson , the jobs are gone and they are not coming back in the manufacturing sector and financial sector

I agree with you on the manufacturing sector, but that's been gone for a long time and the country still prospered. I disagree with you on the financial though...most things financial are cyclical. I'm sure those who lived through 18% Interest rates in the late 70s never would have believed the real estate market would have bounced back either.

Riot 11-19-2009 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig
the stimulus this spring was billed as absolutely necessary to keep unemployment from reaching 10%. it's reached and passed that. as far as jobs saved/created, even obama said that figuring those figures is an inexact science.

That's right. Would you have preferred doing nothing and we right now being in a deep depression? Unemployment 18-20%? It's obviously not black and white. There's not an economist I've seen that has said the stimulus hasn't helped, nor that it won't continue to help.

GBBob 11-19-2009 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot
That's right. Would you have preferred doing nothing and we right now being in a deep depression? Unemployment 18-20%? It's obviously not black and white. There's not an economist I've seen that has said the stimulus hasn't helped, nor that it won't continue to help.

Yeah but the DT economists say it's not working so who cares what Buffet thinks

Riot 11-19-2009 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GBBob
Yeah but the DT economists say it's not working so who cares what Buffet thinks

Warren Buffet has always done, and continues to do, a good job with my retirement planning. Long live Berkshire Hathaway :tro:

Danzig 11-19-2009 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot
That's right. Would you have preferred doing nothing and we right now being in a deep depression? Unemployment 18-20%? It's obviously not black and white. There's not an economist I've seen that has said the stimulus hasn't helped, nor that it won't continue to help.


i would prefer they did something helpful, such as the jobs bill they're working on now. i'd also prefer something that was not incredibly expensive, without real success.

dellinger63 11-19-2009 09:18 AM

Obama's stim package unlike Bush's produced/saved jobs in and sent money to places that don't even exist. That's success that can't be matched and done the Chicago way! :eek:

jms62 11-19-2009 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig
i would prefer they did something helpful, such as the jobs bill they're working on now. i'd also prefer something that was not incredibly expensive, without real success.

There currently are millions of foreign workers on H1 visa's in this country doing all kinds of white collar jobs (accounting, medical, IT, etc,etc). The program was started to fill a void during the .Com bubble but now is being misused for wage arbitrage. The program should be shut down and none of the visas extended. Only a fraction of the billions of dollars in wages paid find there way back into our economy. Bottom line if our people aren't working and getting a decent wage they can not buy at a level to sustain a growing economy. This will cause revenue shortfalls which will drive companies to further reduce headcount and look to further squeeze wages. A big sprial down the drain towards being a third world country.

Riot 11-19-2009 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62
There currently are millions of foreign workers on H1 visa's in this country doing all kinds of white collar jobs (accounting, medical, IT, etc,etc). The program was started to fill a void during the .Com bubble but now is being misused for wage arbitrage. The program should be shut down and none of the visas extended..

According to Wikipedia (yeah, I know) there are only just over 100,000 approved per year for the past few years, with a 3-5 year limit of duration, no extension. So hardly "millions" that I can see.

jms62 11-19-2009 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot
According to Wikipedia (yeah, I know) there are only just over 100,000 approved per year for the past few years, with a 3-5 year limit of duration, no extension. So hardly "millions" that I can see.

You should have stopped right after you questioned your source. There are extenions and loopholes and then you can apply for a green card which kind of sets the clock again... As I have said millions.

Cannon Shell 11-19-2009 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GBBob
I agree with you on the manufacturing sector, but that's been gone for a long time and the country still prospered. I disagree with you on the financial though...most things financial are cyclical. I'm sure those who lived through 18% Interest rates in the late 70s never would have believed the real estate market would have bounced back either.

Thanks to Mr. Reagan!

Cannon Shell 11-19-2009 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot
That's right. Would you have preferred doing nothing and we right now being in a deep depression? Unemployment 18-20%? It's obviously not black and white. There's not an economist I've seen that has said the stimulus hasn't helped, nor that it won't continue to help.

You arent looking very hard

Cannon Shell 11-19-2009 11:43 AM

It is pretty simple why the stimlus package hasnt helped. The vast majority of it wasnt stimlus. This was pointed out by some of us DT economists this Spring and lo and behold we were onto something.

dalakhani 11-19-2009 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
It is pretty simple why the stimlus package hasnt helped. The vast majority of it wasnt stimlus. This was pointed out by some of us DT economists this Spring and lo and behold we were onto something.

It certainly hasnt helped Delonte West this season. I was at the game last night. The cavs were shorthanded and that bum still only got on the floor for 20 minutes. I guess its hard to get PT when you are stuck behind luminaries like Anthony Parker and Jamario Moon.

wiphan 11-19-2009 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot
That's right. Would you have preferred doing nothing and we right now being in a deep depression? Unemployment 18-20%? It's obviously not black and white. There's not an economist I've seen that has said the stimulus hasn't helped, nor that it won't continue to help.


The actual real unemployment rate right now is closer to 17-18% right now, since unemployment numbers do not count people that are unemployed that are not eligible for any more benefits. There is a way to create jobs and GOVT Spending has never been a good solution for this.

Cannon Shell 11-19-2009 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalakhani
It certainly hasnt helped Delonte West this season. I was at the game last night. The cavs were shorthanded and that bum still only got on the floor for 20 minutes. I guess its hard to get PT when you are stuck behind luminaries like Anthony Parker and Jamario Moon.

Perhaps you heard he was having some issues and they were slowly working him back? Or maybe you are just insensitive to those with mental health issues. So non-liberal of you.

Antitrust32 11-19-2009 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62
You should have stopped right after you questioned your source. There are extenions and loopholes and then you can apply for a green card which kind of sets the clock again... As I have said millions.


As you can tell, Riot just needs to have a comeback for any post anyone makes on any topic in this Politics sections. And it has to be the opposite view of any type of "conservative" view.

So I guess her "facts" can be taken as a grain of salt or however that saying goes. I mean, Jimmy Carter. Enough said.

Danzig 11-19-2009 01:34 PM

and then there's this....


http://www.factcheck.org/2009/11/rea...ake-districts/

dellinger63 11-19-2009 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antitrust32
As you can tell, Riot just needs to have a comeback for any post anyone makes on any topic in this Politics sections. And it has to be the opposite view of any type of "conservative" view.

So I guess her "facts" can be taken as a grain of salt or however that saying goes. I mean, Jimmy Carter. Enough said.

but she's a republican

jms62 11-19-2009 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antitrust32
As you can tell, Riot just needs to have a comeback for any post anyone makes on any topic in this Politics sections. And it has to be the opposite view of any type of "conservative" view.

So I guess her "facts" can be taken as a grain of salt or however that saying goes. I mean, Jimmy Carter. Enough said.

Then she needs to do a tad bit more research than what she finds on Wikipedia.

SOREHOOF 11-19-2009 02:29 PM

Facts, Shmacts. Liberals don't deal in facts. Only hope and promises.

GBBob 11-19-2009 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOREHOOF
Facts, Shmacts. Liberals don't deal in facts. Only hope and promises.

That's a good one

SOREHOOF 11-19-2009 02:36 PM

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=34139
For your reading pleasure!

GBBob 11-19-2009 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOREHOOF

And you think I'm going to believe an op-ed piece written by a guy under an Ann Coulter banner? Talking about being brainwashed

SOREHOOF 11-19-2009 02:42 PM

I knew you would get a kick out of it!:)

GBBob 11-19-2009 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOREHOOF
I knew you would get a kick out of it!:)

I'll read that if you read and believe what I'll post by Al Gore on Global Warming

SOREHOOF 11-19-2009 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GBBob
I'll read that if you read and believe what I'll post by Al Gore on Global Warming

:eek:

dalakhani 11-19-2009 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
Perhaps you heard he was having some issues and they were slowly working him back? Or maybe you are just insensitive to those with mental health issues. So non-liberal of you.

I was the one yelling "delonte, i know a good lawyer".

That is the first time I had ever seen Lebron that close (we were really close to the floor). That is a big man. I was completely in awe of him physically.

GBBob 11-19-2009 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOREHOOF
Facts, Shmacts. Liberals don't deal in facts. Only hope and promises.

Can't get the link to work, but I guess FOX lies like everyone else. The last paragraph says it all

Mea Culpa: Fox News keeps making conservative-friendly mistakes
Jeff Bercovici
Nov 19th 2009 at 4:45PMText SizeAAAFiled under: People, Media, News Corp.
More

Every news organization makes mistakes. But when Fox News makes mistakes, they seem to tilt in a suspiciously consistent direction, favoring Republicans and conservatives over Democrats and liberals.

It happened again Wednesday, when host Gregg Jarrett, introducing a segment on Happening Now, described the "huge crowds" that were turning out to greet Sarah Palin on the promotional tour for her book, Going Rogue. "These are some of the pictures just coming into us," Jarrett said as images of Palin surrounded by throngs of supporters flashed across the screen.



While Palin may indeed be drawing big crowds, it didn't take long for liberal watchdog blogs like Think Progress and Media Matters to point out that the masses Jarrett touted on Happening Now had nothing to do with Palin's book; the footage was from a 2008 campaign rally. Called on the switcheroo, Fox blamed it on a "production error" and issued an on-air apology.

The whole thing might have gone unnoticed had it not been for an eerily similar incident last week in a much more prominent venue, Sean Hannity's primetime show. In this case, the crowd Hannity was hyping was the one that gathered to attend a rally against the healthcare bill on November 5. The footage he showed, however, was from the much larger Sept. 12 "tea parties." In that case, it was The Daily Show that blew the whistle, forcing Hannity to apologize on the following day's show.

And then, of course, there are all the Republican miscreants Fox has mistakenly identified as Democrats, like Mark Sanford and Mark Foley, and the insufficiently doctrinaire Republicans it has ID'd as Democrats, like John McCain and Arlen Specter (who did, in fact, become a Democrat later).

One would like to think that all of these were genuine accidents, not intentional efforts to mislead viewers. Hannity's show is advocacy, not news, but even he could surely find more effective and less backfire-prone ways to influence the debate than outright deception.

Even so, this pattern of ideologically-slanted errors illustrates the danger of packaging a news operation around a core of opinion programming. As long as Fox News is a network by and for conservatives, the people who produce its shows -- even its "objective" shows -- are going to see in the news what they expect to see rather than what it really is.

Honu 11-19-2009 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GBBob
Can't get the link to work, but I guess FOX lies like everyone else. The last paragraph says it all

Mea Culpa: Fox News keeps making conservative-friendly mistakes
Jeff Bercovici
Nov 19th 2009 at 4:45PMText SizeAAAFiled under: People, Media, News Corp.
More

Every news organization makes mistakes. But when Fox News makes mistakes, they seem to tilt in a suspiciously consistent direction, favoring Republicans and conservatives over Democrats and liberals.

It happened again Wednesday, when host Gregg Jarrett, introducing a segment on Happening Now, described the "huge crowds" that were turning out to greet Sarah Palin on the promotional tour for her book, Going Rogue. "These are some of the pictures just coming into us," Jarrett said as images of Palin surrounded by throngs of supporters flashed across the screen.



While Palin may indeed be drawing big crowds, it didn't take long for liberal watchdog blogs like Think Progress and Media Matters to point out that the masses Jarrett touted on Happening Now had nothing to do with Palin's book; the footage was from a 2008 campaign rally. Called on the switcheroo, Fox blamed it on a "production error" and issued an on-air apology.

The whole thing might have gone unnoticed had it not been for an eerily similar incident last week in a much more prominent venue, Sean Hannity's primetime show. In this case, the crowd Hannity was hyping was the one that gathered to attend a rally against the healthcare bill on November 5. The footage he showed, however, was from the much larger Sept. 12 "tea parties." In that case, it was The Daily Show that blew the whistle, forcing Hannity to apologize on the following day's show.

And then, of course, there are all the Republican miscreants Fox has mistakenly identified as Democrats, like Mark Sanford and Mark Foley, and the insufficiently doctrinaire Republicans it has ID'd as Democrats, like John McCain and Arlen Specter (who did, in fact, become a Democrat later).

One would like to think that all of these were genuine accidents, not intentional efforts to mislead viewers. Hannity's show is advocacy, not news, but even he could surely find more effective and less backfire-prone ways to influence the debate than outright deception.

Even so, this pattern of ideologically-slanted errors illustrates the danger of packaging a news operation around a core of opinion programming. As long as Fox News is a network by and for conservatives, the people who produce its shows -- even its "objective" shows -- are going to see in the news what they expect to see rather than what it really is.




ABC ,CBS , NBC , CNN ........whats the big deal , they all slant crap the way they want it to go , none of them just report the news.

Riot 11-19-2009 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
You arent looking very hard

Like who?

Are any of you guys still in the "we shouldn't have done anything" camp? As I recall, there were not alot of alternative suggestions offered up in the past.

Riot 11-19-2009 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62
You should have stopped right after you questioned your source. There are extenions and loopholes and then you can apply for a green card which kind of sets the clock again... As I have said millions.

Yeah, millions and millions and millions! Because .... where did you get that info from?

Riot 11-19-2009 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell
It is pretty simple why the stimlus package hasnt helped. The vast majority of it wasnt stimlus. This was pointed out by some of us DT economists this Spring and lo and behold we were onto something.

But the stimulus package has helped.

Riot 11-19-2009 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiphan
The actual real unemployment rate right now is closer to 17-18% right now, since unemployment numbers do not count people that are unemployed that are not eligible for any more benefits.

Yes, and the actual "real" unemployment rate previously has been 8% when it is reported as 4%, etc. Everyone knows that. The unemployment numbers used always do not count them. But using the same numbers, calculated the same way, as we have always measured unemployment rates, makes sense when comparing, hum?

Riot 11-19-2009 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jms62
Then she needs to do a tad bit more research than what she finds on Wikipedia.

So share yours - I'd love to see where you got your "millions" number from?


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