In defense of the Donald
 

Trump gets his share of negative press (much earned) but he made the right decision today, refusing to bow to political pressure and use the hypocritical excuse of some PG rated pictures, he verified that Miss America will keep her crown. I disagree with her position but respect 100% her right to voice it, the question was posed for political reasons...well, if you don't want an honest answer, don't ask the question! I support gay rights 100% including the right to marry and will ALWAYS voice my opinion...she has the same right! ATTA BOY DONALD!

I couldn't possibly care less about this girl getting to play the victim card for the rest of her 15 minutes of fame...

But just one thing that really bothers me in your premise that she 'has the same right to voice her opinion.'

Of course she does. The "gays are stifling free speech" thing is one of the wingnuts favorite straw men. Nobody has claimed that she doesn't have the right to say what she said, just as during the Prop 8 campaign, nobody claimed that those supporting Prop 8 had no right to speak what they believed.

What they're confusing it with however, is that they don't have some new unfettered right to speak without consequences that none of the rest of us have. Those who were boycotted after they donated money to Prop 8 want to pretend they’re the victims. Nobody claimed they didn’t have a ‘right’ to do what they did – but we certainly also have the right to hold people accountable for their opinions. If you put your money where your mouth is, don’t get all mad when people put their money where their mouth is by refusing to give you any of it anymore. Boo-hoo. Man up and accept the consequences of your actions.

So, long story short – great for Carrie that she keeps her title even though she’s violated several terms of the pageant contract – that’s largely irrelevant to me….just wanted to point out that every argument about “freedom of speech” in this situation, Prop 8, and in general anything to do with gay rights, is a total straw man, since I've yet to see a single instance in America of free speech actually being denied. Freedom to say what you want to say is not the same thing as freedom to be able to do it without consequences. Simple stuff, really.

Sorry her opinion is an increasingly unpopular one and she got her feet held to the fire for it.

I agree with Brian that people should have voiced their disappointment with her answer... but the way the people like Perez Hilton and others went about it was embarrassing in my opinion. No reason to attack her so personally and call her all sorts of names. I think it does more for the cause to at least look civilized when discussing your argument.

She has the right to her opinion, and the right to say it without being attacked personally. Granted I wish people didnt have the opinion she has anymore..

I think we are all saying the same thing about this specific case...I agree with Brian that the radical right creates the myth that they are somehow "Victims" when they promulgate some of their more vicious, narrow-minded, racist and/or intolerant views...of course they should be held responsible for their words as are we all but this was a case of "must be a slow news day" reporting, after all, this was a beauty contest nothing more!

15 minutes? Are you kidding? Moronic bigots who compete in beauty contests are considered by many to be perfect candidates for vice-president.

LOL....at least they get to be Governor of Alaska...but in fairness, Sarah isn't a moron and less of a bigot than a lot of right-wingers. She's one of those folks that fall under the catagory of "I respect all folks rights but...."

I 100% agree with Brian and you about this point.

I just wish the gay community would have showed a little more class and not attached her so personally and in nasty ways.

Also I thought it was very un-cool how now she decides to make all sorts of commercials in "defense of marriage".

also agree with mirage that she now makes the perfect VP candidate... all you have to do is be pretty, go to church 5 times a week, and speak out against gays. she seems to be on Par with mrs Palin in all sorts of ways (including her ability to answer a question in an interview).


and beauty pagents are so stupid anyway. There's 50 smoking hot girls on stage and I still cant even watch it. Her answer to that question is the best thing that has ever happened to these stupid shows.

I agree...frankly I'd have been happier if she gave us full frontal nudity or even a home movie like Paris...a little touch of the real world would do wonders for these shams we call contests. Give me Melissa-Ashley or Marilyn Chambers (RIP) any day over these artificially enhanced "plastic" examples of Christian mythology (there I go, sorry...but the hypocrisy overwhelms at times.)

The ironic thing about this issue (and the part of it that most pisses me off) is that it is always cast as an issue between gay activists and the far right, or advocates for social justice and the Republican Party. In truth, these issues could be resolved with very little help from the Republicans if many Democrats showed a little more political courage.
The thing that most pisses me off is all of the cowardly Democrats that refuse to take a stand on the issue. Of course the far right and people who think like Miss Cali are going to oppose it. They're morons. But who really cares about some beauty contest person, or Rush Limbaugh, when there are hundreds of elected officials around the country from a supposedly liberal party that do absolutely nothing?
In my opinion, activists should spend more time lobbying Democrats to give a sh!t than they should wasting their time on doing battle with people like this.

its okay... I want to do a few things to Miss California that will change her stance on gay marriage forever..

She looks like a cross between Brittany Spears and Jessica Simpson to me..

Alrighty, now this thread is startin to heat up. Please doooooo tell! :D

:tro:

But they go hand in hand, because every time any politician shows some courage on the issue, these nutjobs come out of the woodwork...so that battle really never ends.

If Jesus was really the son of God or not... I dont know.. But if he is real I really wish he'd come back real quick and tell the religious wacko's that they embarrass him and to shut up.

Religion is all good until you use it to attack others who dont believe the same things or to use it to pretend you are morally superior to others.


and Math... I dont know if I can type those things on here... but I can promise that she'd be in :{>: LOL

TEASE :D

We must learn from the teachings of Dr King, instead of lowering ourselves to the level of those who preach intolerance, we must shine the light on reality and let folks see the choices free of the demagoguery....a lofty goal that I've struggled with and never quite mastered...I'm guilty of responding all to often with an equal venom...but I know it to be the true path to eventual equality.

:D

i thought the controversy about what she had to say was ridiculous. disagreement on an issue doesn't mean someone deserves that type of grief. i thought the question portion in those ridiculous pageants was to see if miss congeniality could form a coherent response, not to see if you were both on the same side politically.

i think jesus had a lot of good things to say, and that a lot of folks would do well to actually put in practice what he preached-rather than go to church in sunday and then do everything he said not to-judge not lest ye be judged and all that.
as for him literally being THE son of god....i would vote no-but the nicean council voted yes, so what can you do?

Why exactly does she need to change her stance?

I have, and have had, many gay friends but I don't believe in gay marriage either -- unless it's clearly indicated as distinct from marriage. And this has nothing to do with religion, as I'm agnostic.

So, what can't she and others like her believe what they want?

My boyfriend grew up in a strong Christian upbringing and I've been to Church with him several times and strongly believe in the message of Jesus and looked into the adult classes for becoming Christian, but I really struggle with the "we're right, you're wrong" mentality or not having forgivance and understanding...

So you would be in favor of something that was separate....but equal.
Hmmm.....for some reason that phrase sounds familiar.

As for antitrust, I suspect that she doesn't really care much about Miss Cali's views on gay marriage, but she might be a little interested in exploring her views on gay.....ummm.....we'll just say.......activities. ;)

I'll spell it out for you fatty...

She would change her stance because I would fucl< her so good that she would want to get married.

Thats about all I was saying there. I dont believe that she needs to change her stance, I just wish more people in general would be more accepting of others who are no different from them in any way shape or form execpt who they love.

Since when do people care about what a beauty pageant contestant has to say? And what in the f.uck was Perez Hilton doing as a judge for the pageant? That's just so retarded it makes Baby Jesus break out in hives and have diarrhea s.hits.

Attachment 1255

I agree with you about the courage part. Where is the outrage at Obama? A guy who flip-flops on this issue most likely simply to increase his chances of getting elected. People are coming unglued about this girl and yet give the pres a pass. no consistency or courage there for sure.

I do wonder though, do you also put Obama in the category of morons who oppose it? like you did with miss Cali and Limbaugh? if not, what makes the other two (limbaugh and miss cali) morons? what are their common traits, other than opposition to gay marriage that, make them morons?

:tro:

live and let live. how much better would everyone be, everywhere, if we all did that? or more simply put-mind your bidness. has no effect on my life if anti-trust takes miss cali home and gives her a good time.

Then why did you ask me to be
your Southern Cracker Boy lover...

At least you could have kept it secret.

I agree with you 100%. Why isn't Perez Hilton calling Obama all kinds of names since Obama is against gay marriage? To all of you who think that it is only intolerant bigots that are against gay marriage, do you think Obama is an intolerant bigot since he is against gay marriage?

people aren't calling obama names because they think he might be one to change things-but really, it's the same thing that caused NOW and other feminist groups not to bash bill clinton-they're all supposed to be on the same side...

Yes, exactly. Can you imagine how some of those feminist groups would have bashed Clinton if he was a Republican. There is so much hypocricy on both sides of the aisle these days.

It's not like the gays are thrilled with Obama at the moment. Trust me, there's plenty of outrage out there from DADT to DOMA to the fact that he's starting to look like he put a big lie over on everyone who took him at his word on gay rights.

The difference is that Obama believes in Civil Unions and has at least at one point promised to work to overturn DOMA, which would in turn make it possible to validate gay marriages performed at state level changing the HUGE penalties paid by gay couples on things like health insurance, etc.

Ms. CA on the other hand, aligned herself with NOM recently...and they are against any recognition at all for gay couples.

While neither is perfect, you've got to be able to see the difference. I can't speak for where Limbaugh stands on the issue, and Obama will be no friend of mine on this issue if he continues to just pay lip service where applicable. Time will tell on that one.

Either way, Ms. CA is really nothing more than a less entertaining version of the infamous youtube queen Ms. South Carolina.

And after thinking about it further...it's not really her answer that's given her her 15 minutes of fame. It's the fact that some queen was mean to her and called her a "bitch."

So where is the 15 minutes for the other 25 million American women who've had the same experience?

:tro: :tro:

Limbaugh is a moron for a whole host of reasons that have nothing to do with gay marriage. I probably listen to the guy about twice a week (it is a long drive out to DeKalb) because I actually enjoy listening to someone I disagree with more than I enjoy listening to liberal talk radio. The fact that he is an absolute sexist and embraces jingoistic foreign policy stances are just two of the things that make him a moron in my book.

The thing that infuriates me about Obama on this issue (along with many other "liberal" Democrats) is that I think they are probably just being dishonest. Where Limbaugh and Miss Cali actually do favor laws that embrace blatant discrimination, Obama probably doesn't. He (again, along with many others) goes along with it because he feels it would be too risky politically not to do that. That sucks. I volunteered for the guy's campaign. I donated money to his campaign. But on this issue I absolutely think he takes the cowardly way out.

The same holds true for DADT. The administration is trying to find a way for the military to tell them it doesn't work, so that they can get political cover for changing the policy. Here's an idea, why don't they say: "We think this is wrong. We are changing it." Have some guts.

well we disagree on Limbaugh, he is no moron.
but at least you stand up and call the other stuff for what it is, GUTLESS.
its the same way I feel about most republicans on a host of issues, they're gutless. pay a little lip service and then go right along with whichever way the crowd is moving in Washington. I've said this before, but it's why I can respect a guy like Kucinich, who is a borderline lunatic, but at least he stakes out a position and then defends it strenuously without weasel words. I can deal with that, its the shifty chameleons that I can't take.

Still hilarious watching two dudes walking hand-in-hand down Castro St.

That chick has a serious 6 pack and some skinny fuc|<ing arms, kind of freaks me out. nice face tho

Turns out the queen is right!! Miss cali is a BITCH!!! LOL... stupid news but nice that she's fired for being a bitch..

Check out the transcript of her blackberry emails with the Director dude...

ya have to start from the bottom and read your way up.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,525726,00.html


Sounds like a lil sweet Christian girl who is proud of her morals, huh!?!


In the words of the Don "You're Fired!"

Wow. That shows her to be not very bright, doesn't it?

If Miss America was an intelligence competition wouldn't Hillary have won the crown at least once?