flower alley nothing special
 

i have been reading all of the nonsene posted on this board about this horse by the so called experts adn how great he is. that horse is nothing special. a fraud if you ask me. Invasor and Bernardini are much better than anything else. poor Sun King. I hope he gets up one day because he deserves it.

Wouldn't call him a fraud, but he definitely didn't run his race today. I think he's still running.

This horse is a tough one to figure sometimes, but I certainly would NOT call him a fraud. If he comes out of this race healthy I wouldn't write him off yet. After winning the Jim Dandy and the Travers last year he ran a clunker like this in the JCGC before rebounding in the BCC. He might not be done just yet.

he is no ghostzapper and if you want to take off half of the year and be a horse of the year candidate you better show me more than that.

You know, it's a lot easier to say a horse is "nothing special" after a poor performance than before it.

--Dunbar

I've been saying it and have been made fun of because of it. Either way, the horse is not a fraud. He just ran a clunker today. Unfortunately, he can't afford to run clunkers like that and be taken seriously for HOY.

You're never as good as you look when you win ...

... or as bad as you look when you lose.

Nonetheless ... Flower Alley was ... and is ... vastly overrated.

It's the Pletcher goo-goo factor at work.

i never thought he was anything special. a lot of "experts" have been saying he only needs to race 4 times because he is this great horse. invasor is a tested horse that runs.

you got it. pletcher goo-goo factor at work. i just thought the lack of respect for a horse coming off two grade 1 wins easily was ridiculous. flower alley is a very good horse but i tire of these experts telling us you can win horse of the year off 4 starts. i loved GZ but even with him 4 starts was ridiculous. he did have a soundness issue as an excuse.

flower alley literally sat around and got fat doing nothing and we were all told to worship him.

The horse deserved 3 months off. As long as he's not hurt, he'll come better his next one out. With that said, I've never been that impressed with him and I like Invasor a lot better.

Isn't it amazing to see ...

... how some trainers actually believe that their horses will improve by standing in a stall for nine months?

Pletcher has never trained a colt to be a consistent winner at classic distances on dirt ... despite hundreds and hundreds of opportunities ... and it's looking more and more like he never will.

Oh please... the colt was off for 3 months NOT 9 months.

bb is right. no race for 9 months.

The colt was off of training for 3 months which means that he was NOT sitting in a stall for 9 months. Thank you...

More words of "wisdom" from Bold Fraud.
Never puts out a winner.
Always picks the loser.
Criticizes the leading trainer at Saratoga.
And gets his "facts" wrong again.

What would you expect from a bum that lives in a cardboard box under the Cros Bronx Expressway and makes his "living" shining windshields on the exit ramp.
I really hope the library kicks him out so he won't be able to post his nonsense here anymore.

Total constipated BS.
When he lets go, the NYC sewers will be blocked up for months.

Cajun, I believe the horse was out of training from the BCC of 2005 to May of 2006. So that is about 5-6 months. But I am sure he was jogged and all that good stuff. But remember the main goal is the BCC. This is what is wrong with the Breeders Cup.

Clearly not good today, but calling this horse a fraud is shortsighted. He's already run faster than almost every horse in the country, so toss this race and let's see what he does next time. The goal is to run his best race at Churchill this fall, and I'm not one to question the methods of the top trainer in America.

i suppose the tip was when Mayne, on ESPN, said Pletcher said FA was not 100% coming into this race.

he did not race for 8 months.

FA is a really good horse but what I meant by nothing special is that he is not a st liam/ghostzapper type. invasor probably is.

Hes no horse of the year canindate. Thats for sure. Lava Man and Bernardini are the only two possibilities. Flower Alley has no shot. That was a dismal performance and at 3/2 to boot.

i said elsewhere that i was never high on the horse, but i think fraud is too strong a word. he's got a lot of redeeming to do right now if he wants to get back into the hoy picture....

obviously flower alley wasn't ready for today. whether he was short, out of shape, or lack of seasoning....or a bit of all. pletcher said he wasn't fit, that he expected him to peak in two more races. but wow, no way tap thought flower alley would finish out of the money.

you don't think invasor has a shot at hoy? i'd say he has more of a shot at it right now than bernardini.

Trainers have said before there horse werent 100% coming into a race and they have looked extraordinary and won races, so I kind of get a little suspect of an excuse before the race even starts. Todd was right and I guess we as bettors should applaud him saying that. I didnt use him at all but still lost.

But how freaking long did he have to get ready for this race? Pletcher had this whole campaign mapped out before the year even started and cant get a horse in shape for a 750K race? If I were the owners I wouldnt be too happy with that.

Sorry I left out Invasor. Sure, if he went on to win the BC Classic, why not.
Basicall whoever wins the BC Classic out of Lava Man, Bernardini and Invasor.

maybe the horse isn't the horse everyone thought he was....maybe he was done maturing last fall. and now everyone else has passed him. or maybe he just had an off day. wait and see what everyone has to say about him...wait and see what he does next. we've all seen horses fail to live up to their expectations. some of them come back and wow everyone again, others cause ulcers in the future!
he certainly had a lot of hype all year. at this point he looks undeserving of all the accolades. it's kind of funny he's gotten so much praise, he's only won one race (the salvator mile) since the travers a year ago. one win in a year. i think a lot of people got way ahead of themselves with this guy.

Agreed. Completely.

bernardini has to get thru the travers first.


things are really starting to get exciting.

Dearest Madam,

I was speaking metaphorically when I said he was standing ... not sitting ... in a stall for nine months. That was a figure of speech ... for the fact that the horse hadn't raced in nine months.

You know what a "figure of speech" is don't you? That's correct.

One, two, three, four ... when spoken ... are all figures of speech.

Sheeeeeeeeeeeeesh !!!

I dont see how a horse that came in a very tough second as a 3 YEAR OLD at the BCC can be considered a fraud. How many races can Invasor run like that? That had to take the starch out. Heroic effort to hold off Sun King in a meltdown.

If surf Cat can return and the conections will send him east he should be in line for some consideration for HOY. Nothing but brialance on the track.

i just hope he didnt get hurt, i have a bad feeling though because he is no fraud.......

He's no fraud and he had a "problem" in the JCGC, I wouldn't be surprised if that problem reared up again. It's funny how short of memories some of you have, but then again most of you are stupid...

I know he hasnt raced in 8 months. I was talking about training not racing.

This might be Todd Pletchers worse training performance of his career. If Flower Alley goes on to lose the JCGC and BCC then it is all on Pletcher. He had the route mapped out since last Dec.

He's probably as good as Saint Liam or atleast close. Neither of them (SL or Invasor) are like Ghostzapper. He was far superior when on his game...

See I dont get where St Liam was all that good.

St. Liam wasnt that great at all but the best of his season. I think Invasor is currently the best of his season but neither have knocked my socks off so to speak with talent so I rank them very similarly. Invasor could and maybe will prove to be better, but St. Liam did show up for the most part when asked so he has a BC win in his favor. For speculations sake (and nothing more), if Invasor goes on to win the BCC I think he and St. Liam will go down in history viewed about the same. Nice horses, not overly spectacular, more gritty than flashy. I just think Ghostzapper was in a league of his own.

I couldnt agree more. St Liam won by default last year in the BCC.

Ghostzapper didn't look like he was "in a league of his own" when St Liam had him fully extended to win the only race the ran against each other. St Liam ran with him around the turn and the entire stretch, only to lose by a fraction of a length. GZ WAS a special horse, I agree. But elevating GZ at St Liam's expense doesn't cut it.

It's still too early to rate Invasor. But I don't see how anyone can fault what Invasor has done so far. VERY nice horse.

--Dunbar

How in the world canyou bash a horse who has won a grade one when the stable you belong to has been taking investor's money for years and never even won ONE grade one. Flower Alley has won more Grade One stakes than your stable has in its existence. Isn't that hysterical? LOL!!!