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-   -   TP: Kentucky Cup Classic (http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16964)

ShadowRoll 09-26-2007 02:32 PM

TP: Kentucky Cup Classic
 
Hard Spun wins, Street Sense runs 2nd or 3rd.

Field for the Kentucky Cup Classic (gr. II, approximate post 5:42 p.m.), 1 1/8-miles over Polytrack for 3-year-olds and upward

1. Hard Spun, Mario Pino, 118
2. Cat Shaker, Charles Woods Jr., 118
3. Street Sense, Calvin Borel, 120
4. Stream Cat, Julien Leparoux, 118
5. Muqbil, Willie Martinez, 118

GPK 09-26-2007 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowRoll
Hard Spun wins, Street Sense runs 2nd or 3rd.

Field for the Kentucky Cup Classic (gr. II, approximate post 5:42 p.m.), 1 1/8-miles over Polytrack for 3-year-olds and upward

1. Hard Spun, Mario Pino, 118
2. Cat Shaker, Charles Woods Jr., 118
3. Street Sense, Calvin Borel, 120
4. Stream Cat, Julien Leparoux, 118
5. Muqbil, Willie Martinez, 118

Muqbil?? Really?

Linny 09-26-2007 02:52 PM

I thought that the KY Cup is for KY breds only. Hard Spun was bred in PA.

Coach Pants 09-26-2007 02:54 PM

I'm not a fan of bacon.


Edit: Oh you meant the Kentucky Cup!!

Street Sense

ShadowRoll 09-26-2007 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants
I'm not a fan of bacon.


Edit: Oh you meant the Kentucky Cup!!

Street Sense

Yes -- didn't eat lunch and my mind's wandering.

cloud_break 09-26-2007 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linny
I thought that the KY Cup is for KY breds only. Hard Spun was bred in PA.

No race in Kentucky is restricted to Kentucky-breds. (Really, what would be the point.) But, they do have the KTDF that supplements purses for Ky breds only. Some portion of the purse of the Classic may be restricted to ky-breds.

letswastemoney 09-26-2007 05:45 PM

They must be shaking in their boots with Muqbil in there

Linny 09-26-2007 06:38 PM

I think that at some point the KY Cup was just for KY bred, which I will admit seems a bit odd.

cloud_break 09-26-2007 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linny
I think that at some point the KY Cup was just for KY bred, which I will admit seems a bit odd.

My recollection is that Best Pal ran third in the inaugural Classic in 1994. My recollection is that he was a Cal-bred. Of course, my recollection could be wrong on either or both counts.

tiznowthegreat 09-26-2007 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cloud_break
No race in Kentucky is restricted to Kentucky-breds. (Really, what would be the point.) But, they do have the KTDF that supplements purses for Ky breds only. Some portion of the purse of the Classic may be restricted to ky-breds.

This is correct. Street Sense is running for a 500,000 purse while Hard Spun is running for a 350,000 purse.

cloud_break 09-26-2007 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tiznowthegreat
This is correct. Street Sense is running for a 500,000 purse while Hard Spun is running for a 350,000 purse.

Yeah, I just saw the drf article about this. I guess the math comes out that Hard Spun would get $270,000 if he wins, and Street Sense would get $367,500 if he wins.

philcski 09-26-2007 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cloud_break
Yeah, I just saw the drf article about this. I guess the math comes out that Hard Spun would get $270,000 if he wins, and Street Sense would get $367,500 if he wins.

it's usually 60% to the winner, so $300k for Street Sense or $210k for Hard Spun.

tiznowthegreat 09-26-2007 09:59 PM

Regardless of purse issue, what are people thinking. Looking at the PP's, Street Sense's 2 races on Poly stand out as not close to his efforts on dirt. Hard Spun ran a big one here in March. I don't think Hard Spun is close to as talented as SS but on this day under these conditions I think he has a realistic chance.

The Indomitable DrugS 09-26-2007 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linny
I thought that the KY Cup is for KY breds only. Hard Spun was bred in PA.

It couldn't have graded stakes status if the race was restricted to KY Breds.

geeker2 09-26-2007 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698
Of course he has a realistic chance. He's the most likely winner. Especially when you have to think Street Sense will be not fully cranked as the goal is the BC Classic. Who doesn't think Hard Spun has a huge shot here?


What do you make of SS beating Grasshopper by a less than steller margin..and having the Hopper come back and lose..chink in the armour?

miraja2 09-27-2007 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tiznowthegreat
Regardless of purse issue, what are people thinking. Looking at the PP's, Street Sense's 2 races on Poly stand out as not close to his efforts on dirt. Hard Spun ran a big one here in March. I don't think Hard Spun is close to as talented as SS but on this day under these conditions I think he has a realistic chance.

Hard Spun has more than just a shot.
A 10f dirt race and a 9f poly race are two very different things.
Right now Street Sense remains my pick to win the BCC, but that doesn't mean that he is going to win on Saturday.

miraja2 09-27-2007 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by geeker2
What do you make of SS beating Grasshopper by a less than steller margin..and having the Hopper come back and lose..chink in the armour?

I don't think anything of it at all.
Street Sense tends to hang a bit. We knew that going into the Travers, and we still know it coming out of the race.

letswastemoney 09-28-2007 02:26 AM

I think Stream Cat has a chance. His speed figures on poly are close to Hard Spun and Street Sense. Using Bris, his 2 figures on poly were 100 and 104. Street Sense had a 98 and 97.

SuffolkGirl 09-28-2007 09:59 AM

I'd love to see Street Sense win this race but I think Hard Spun is going to win. This is not Nafzger's target so SS doesn't need to be all out to win. I think the order will be:

Hard Spun by a rapidly closing length
Street Sense
Stream Cat
Muqbil
Cat Shaker

Looking forward to this weekend's races!

SniperSB23 09-28-2007 10:02 AM

Stream Cat/Hard Spun/Street Sense

The complete opposite of what I would expect were it on dirt.

ArlJim78 09-28-2007 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuffolkGirl
I'd love to see Street Sense win this race but I think Hard Spun is going to win. This is not Nafzger's target so SS doesn't need to be all out to win. I think the order will be:

Hard Spun by a rapidly closing length
Street Sense
Stream Cat
Muqbil
Cat Shaker

Looking forward to this weekend's races!

i think you may have the order nailed. welcome to an $8 trifecta.

SuffolkGirl 09-28-2007 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArlJim78
i think you may have the order nailed. welcome to an $8 trifecta.

yeah, but I'll also put a ticket together with Muqbil in 3rd position and hope he gets there, that should pay more.

Slewbopper 09-28-2007 02:48 PM

Here is the deal on added money:
The base purse for the KC Classic is $350,000, with $150,000 of that for horses eligible to the Kentucky Thoroughbred Development Fund. Of the five starters, only Hard Spun, a Pennsylvania-bred, is ineligible to the KTDF. However, another $150,000 is being offered to the winner if he is a Grade 1 winner in 2006-07. Only Street Sense and Hard Spun are eligible for the bonus.

ALostTexan 09-29-2007 01:21 PM

Damn, heard this morning that they are not offering a show bet on the race. Thought the bridge jumpers could have a hayday on this one...

ALostTexan 09-29-2007 01:39 PM

Actually, according to the Turfway website, they are going to offer a Super on the Classic? On a 5-horse field???

Link

geeker2 09-29-2007 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALostTexan
Actually, according to the Turfway website, they are going to offer a Super on the Classic? On a 5-horse field???

Link


Muqbil was scratched...now down to 4

ArlJim78 09-29-2007 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by geeker2
Muqbil was scratched...now down to 4

on the bright side, they're still offering trifecta wagering.:D

Left Bank 09-29-2007 04:52 PM

BORING!!!!! Congrats to Hard Spun!

XIIPointStables 09-29-2007 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kimmeastar
BORING!!!!! Congrats to Hard Spun!

Any race recap for those of us stuck at work?

ArlJim78 09-29-2007 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XIIPointStables
Any race recap for those of us stuck at work?

Hard Spun and Street Sense ran one two all the way around on a slow pace.

Travis Stone 09-29-2007 04:54 PM

Hard Spun takes the lead early, holds off a far-turn move from Street Sense, digs in again in the stretch and wins by a length.

Scav 09-29-2007 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Travis Stone
Hard Spun takes the lead early, holds off a far-turn move from Street Sense, digs in again in the stretch and wins by a length.

They shouldn't even allow races like this....

The Indomitable DrugS 09-29-2007 04:57 PM

Well there goes any value on Hard Spun in the Classic and any chance he'll be allowed a real easy unpressured lead in the Classic.

Back to the drawing board for that race.

Coach Pants 09-29-2007 04:58 PM

Horse Racing. It's Fan-F>>>>>g-tastic.

NoChanceToDance 09-29-2007 05:06 PM

Being a European, i didn't mind watching that tactical battle..... most people saw that it was going to happen like that, but why didn't Borel really take Hard Spun on early? Force him a bit, ya know?

As soon as it was turned into a 'sprint' there was only going to be one winner.

Over here, Borel would have been blamed for giving Hard Spun such an easy lead.

Coach Pants 09-29-2007 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoChanceToDance
Being a European, i didn't mind watching that tactical battle..... most people saw that it was going to happen like that, but why didn't Borel really take Hard Spun on early? Force him a bit, ya know?

As soon as it was turned into a 'sprint' there was only going to be one winner.

Over here, Borel would have been blamed for giving Hard Spun such an easy lead.

His ride on Blackberry Road in the Juvenile was nothing short of embarrassing.

Travis Stone 09-29-2007 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoChanceToDance
but why didn't Borel really take Hard Spun on early? Force him a bit, ya know?

As soon as it was turned into a 'sprint' there was only going to be one winner.

Over here, Borel would have been blamed for giving Hard Spun such an easy lead.

I think what Street Sense did was the intent of Nafzger and Co. They wanted SS to put in a sustained run, challenge and finish strong. He's said such a result would "get him towards where he needs to be for Monmouth" (or something like that).

Now, I suppose SS did get out of this race what they wanted. However, I would have preferred to see him battle harder down to the wire versus spit it a bit in the final 100 yards. SS has shown us he hangs a bit (Preakness, Travers) and now he didn't give that extra punch late in this spot.

I'm not sold on him for the BC.


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