Maimonides out 30 days
 

The much maligned Saratoga track knocked this horse out.

http://racing.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=40638

dude he's a 2yo, do you know anything about horses? sore shins is a FREQUENT occurence and is not a big deal and has NOTHING to do with the track!

That is your opinion. Many others differ with your opinion.

my first thought when i saw the title was lemme guess, shins....



as for the 'much maligned' saratoga track, i must have missed that memo.

seriously, what does the surface have to do with shins?




oh, wait.....there is the fact of who started the thread. case closed.

sumitas=many others

What is your problem that you have to get personal ? I try to respect the right of people on this board to their opinion and I'd like that same respect.

because everything you say is a veiled (or not so veiled) shot at traditional dirt surfaces. well guess what, i don't EVER want to see some polycrap at Saratoga, which is a very safe surface. 2yo's get sore shins galloping on turf, grass, anything, but you feel the need to link it to your personal agenda of promoting polytrack.

it already ruined Del Mar, don't ruin Saratoga too.

del mar - saratoga.... out of the fryin' pan into the fire!

Mayonaise is a nice precocious horse, but he will need to show some stamina - at least 6 furlongs in a race, to earn respect as a racehorse.

:D that's what Sniper calls him too!

i have confidence he will actually stretch out. Baffert just needs to remember how he acheived that with other precocious types...

Bob with another botch job

I think just 1, Phone Home.

You, my friend, are very defensive about a change from a dirt surface. This horse has been knocked out after the Hopeful, Indian Flare's last race was over this track, as was that of Cotton Blossom.

This issue has been raised before, for example, here, before the Hopeful.
http://www.bloodhorse.com/articleind...e.asp?id=40544

why even try with this clown guys?

Praise the Lord for the ignore list :D

yeah me too.

If horse can't have sneaks, then let there be all weather :) ...on that profound note I will get out of this thread while the getting is good :D

i've been calling him mymommiesknees

I am honoring my beloved Rabbi Mamonides......by using his picture as my avatar.


Anyone who thinks they are clever and makes their avatar a jar of mayo or a picture of their mom's knees will feel my wrath.

Shut up.

how'd tasha's miracle do in the debutante?

Yes, shins with 2YOs are common, but anyone who says that there were not issues with the Saratoga tracks this past summer is kidding themselves, or trying to advance another agenda. If there was one thing that most of the trainers agreed upon, it was their displeasure with the hardness and fastness (how many track records were set) of the tracks caused by the track super's nightly decision to seal and roll the tracks, even when there was no rain in the forecast. The issue became such a problem that special meetings were called between the horsemen and NYRA management to address the trainers' concerns.

Speaking from personal experience, we had two horses on the grounds and both developed filling in their ankles, and this was only from training. Last Sunday, our vet was at the barn to x-ray one horse to make sure that there were no significant issues. The x-rays revealed nothing that required surgery, and we think he probably suffered a foot bruise (another common aliment up here this summer). The most telling statement from the vet was he had x-rayed more ankles this past summer, only to have them come back negative. He attributed this to the hardness of the tracks.

The predator circles his pray...

I agree. I attended the meeting where the horsemen discussed the track, condition, etc., with NYRA management. It was a very good meeting although I think there were some issues. One issue, which could have been addressed before the fact, was that I am not sure how many people (trainers) felt there were "major" issues with the track. Of course "major" is a relative term.

Also, because there were a very few very vocal that appeared to be the driving force, I am not sure this was the most efficient and effective approach. Regardless, NYRA was very receptive and immediately followed up and took action. I think the major issue was the track being sealed, more as an isolated issue, but of course everyone is going to have their own issues. The track super felt completely blindsided and was caught completely off-guard, and while that might not be important, I think it might be more indicitive of the tone or environment.

I think the approach is key here -- solving problems, by working together; or working against, force, or at least the appearence or tone of working against.

Eric

So it clearly wasn't an issue of dirt vs poly. Nobody was jumping up and down saying "We want poly!"

Maimonides was in Saratoga because it wasn't poly.

Interesting study done about 5 years ago regarding bucked shins.

http://www2.vet.upenn.edu/labs/corl/...uckedshins.pdf

I would gather racing 2 year olds on dirt surfaces isnt beneficial, in relation to bucked shins. Part might be from the development point of a 2 year old, part may be the surface, and part may be the speed of the horse in training.

Bafferts style, with his QH background might lead to the approach he has shown with T-Breds and 2 year olds, and thus the expected results.

There is a ton of techincal stuff in the article and some general stuff you can conclude from the findings.

Perhaps it would give all on this topic a clearer idea of bucked shins.

The article is about 14 pages and in pdf format.

Just a side note. Calling a poster a clown, or other names serves no purpose.
Ignore the poster, argue the points of the argument, but name calling is not what a forum should be about.

Says you. To others calling a clown a clown is delightful and LOLLERFUL.

Then those are the times for ignore. Most people who do that stuff strive for attention. If they get no resoponse, they tend to move on. I havent been on here that long, thus I didnt know of the posters past.

Thanks for the update.

The article on bucked shins is still good reading.

Yep, uses every injury as a chance to slam dirt and promote poly.

That's not for you to decide. You are the one complaining. If you don't like what some posters have to say then feel free to do what you're ordering others to do.

I am not complaining, just trying to post some common sense when approaching someone who might have an agenda and perhaps needs attention.

I guess it is best to drop it from my end as I see many dont like the poster.

A great deal of that (I took the liberty of bolding that part) is in reality nothing more than supposition, and while there might be "data" to back up opinion or supposition, in this case it might be an exercise in futility. 2yo's have been racing on dirt forever, and still are (and unless the standardbred industry is going to change, they will continue to do so as well). There's never been an alternative until recent times, hence the passion and the controversy so to speak.

Bucked shins will continue to happen and different people are going to blame and point to problems and solutions. That's what makes the world go 'round, LOL. This certainly isn't a Bob Baffert issue.

Many people have very passionate opinions on dirt, poly/synthetic/etc. and I think the verdict is still out because all of the evidence is not in. This is going to be a life-cycle and now it's still in it's infancy.

Eric

In reality these horses should not be asked to compete at this kind of level at 2 yr. old. They are still growing and maturing. Their bodies aren't mature enough to sustain this type of competition this young. Horse don't reach maturity until they are closer to 4. In terms of what's best and safest for the horse technically everything should be pushed back a year. 3yr olds should be running in the Hopeful, Del Mar Futurity etc and the Triple Crown and Travers and such should be 4 yr olds.

This is such a falacy and this topic was discussed numerous times through some very good and educational reading:

http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/sho...highlight=year

http://www.derbytrail.com/forums/sho...highlight=year

What is the falacy? That horses aren't underdeveloped at 2?