Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

I think that many on this board are looking at Barbaro vs. Bernardini subjectively instead of objectively. I agree with you in that the two are pretty even as far as voting goes. I think that many are overly biased towards Barbaro for emotional and sympathetic reasons. It's as if they can't acknowledge the coming of a potential superhorse because the downfall of another. I won't point out any specific posters, but their arguements are weak, ignorant, hypocritical, or contradictory to the facts. I'm not saying that all of the pro-Barbaro or pro-Bernardini posters are like that...just a few. However, many of the top trainers in the industry are saying that Bernardini is one for the ages and that he would be their pick at this point for the three year old championship. That is a FACT. At this point, I believe that everyone should also just enjoy this horse. He may very well be the next Spectacular Bid, and those kinds of horses are irreplaceable.

Here are some examples of how great some think Bernardini is...

"I think right now whatever he did today, I don't think any horse can beat this horse right now," said winning rider Javier Castellano, who began celebrating his victory at the sixteenth pole.

Winning trainer Tom Albertrani said: "This horse gets better every race. I think he'll be a very tough horse later in the season against the older horses."

"I wanted all the people to recognize that he's a special horse and he's the best 3-year-old right now in the country," Castellano said.

"We know how special a horse Barbaro was, but this certainly showed to us after yesterday how great Bernardini is as well," Tom Albertrani, the trainer of Bernardini, said Sunday morning. "With all of his performances, he always wins by daylight, and I think you have to give him a lot of consideration."

"Bernardini is the 3-year-old champ to me," said Kiaran McLaughlin, the trainer of Belmont Stakes winner Jazil. "That's my opinion, everybody has one. I have a lot of respect for Barbaro. He's done it on both surfaces, dirt and turf. But this horse is just awesome. He has a presence about him. He's just a very, very special horse."

"It's hard to top what Invasor has done, but he is not the horse Bernardini is," Zito said. "Bernardini could beat Invasor five furlongs, six furlongs, a mile and a half, two miles, two and a half miles. He could beat him any day of the week."

"I was just praying he would show up as the phenomenal horse I know him to be — and he did," trainer Tom Albertrani said. "He's just getting sharper every race. It's pretty scary."

"The way he's running, as long as he stays healthy and is on top of his game he's going to be a very serious horse," Albertrani said Sunday morning outside his barn. "When he faces older horses, he'll still be the one to fear. There's more to this horse than we've seen."

"Bernardini is definitely my choice to be a champion," said trainer John Ward, who chased him in vain in the Travers with third-place finisher Dr. Pleasure and with Minister's Bid, who was last in the field of six. "He took on Bluegrass Cat and put him away, and he said goodbye to the rest of them."

"We'll, he's never been challenged," Albertrani said. "Right now, he's been winning by daylight. I don't know how much he's got left until he is challenged. Javier couldn't pull him up after the wire. The more racing he has, the better he's getting."

Originally Posted by Danzig188

a glance at my side by side comparison shows that they are relatively even....

so something must break the tie. at this point, what would that tiebreaker be??? one word.



kentucky

that not enough??

how about four times as many words.
first saturday in may.

they both have four graded wins, both with two grade ones. but the ky derby is THE race that all three year olds aspire to....and one won, the other wasn't even there. he was waiting to play spoiler in md. and in past years, that has earned scorn from those on here...., rested and fresh, waiting in the wings to take on the derby winner.

ah, but it doesn't matter. bernardini is the next superhorse. a chip off the old block, he's gonna beat all comers in the bcc. just like we read flower alley was going to do last year. and mdo before that.

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Your kind of leaving a few things out here. Yeah Barbaro won the Derby, and Bernardini wasn't there. He wasn't waiting to play spoiler, he had just run a week before the Derby, and he wouldn't have made it in anyway, not enough earnings. Can't really fault the horse that it took him a little while longer to get to the races. I certainly don't think Bernardini was ducking Barbaro because if he was he very easily could have skipped the Preakness and run in the Peter Pan. I would say that Bernardini's Travers, or his Preakness was as equally good as Barbaro's Derby. Look at Barbaro's Holy Bull and Florida Derby. Not exactly eye catching wins against somewhat suspect competition. How do you think Bernardini would have fared against Great Point, or Sharp humor? Probably would have won by more than 3/4 and a neck. But again, heresay arguements. I too love Barbaro, and I wish he was still racing because the two against each other would have been fun. Let me ask you this, switch the two. Say Bernardini wins the Derby, and is hurt in the Preakness, and Barbaro goes on to win the Preakness, Jim Dandy and Travers all without breaking a sweat. You still giving Bernardini the championship?

Originally Posted by BellamyRd.

The whole point of the thread is to show they are not on even terms as this juncture. In fact, Barbaro is INDEED well ahead. Those quotes are from Albertrani, who trains Bernardini, Castellano, the jockey of Bernardini, Kieran, who trains for the shieks, and Ward & Zito who's horses just got crushed by Bernardini. So save face, they'd call him great, a champion. Do me a HUGE favor and watch the travers with the sound off, then watch the KY derby with the sound off. Then get back to me as you watch each race unfold who should be champion. Calling people ignorant because they dont have the same opinion of you is ignorant in itself. To me, most here seem to be suscribing to what the media is telling you to think. Use your eyes and not your ears people and you can clearly SEE who is the better horse.

Originally Posted by Danzig188

yeah, the derby winner gets it. i don't care if his name is green eggs and ham.


has nothing to do with which has which name. at this point (and yeah, i've gone a bit over the top because no one will let this go, so what the hell) they are 'tied'. both with two gr 1's, both with four overall graded wins. you can compare the two side by side, they're practically even. so who gets the nod? the derby winner must, right? AT THIS POINT, which everyone seems wont to go over ad infinitum, who's gonna be chicken and proclaim a tie?? not me. there has to be a tie-breaker. shouldn't THE race for three year olds, often times the ONLY time that three year olds from coast to coast meet all year, the best since the year began, be the decider?? how could it not be? it's the derby. you don't have to call it by it's full name, just THE DERBY will do. one winner a year....

just think tho--another point. it's taken bernardini almost NINE months to earn the graded stakes that barbaro earned in FIVE.

it doesn't matter tho. it's august.

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

They are at a tie right now...that was my whole point. I was just stating that some of the arguements, both PRO-BARBARO and PRO-BERNARDINI, were completely biased just as this post of yours is. The tie will be broken when and if Bernardini wins the JCGC and the BCC, either way. I really don't care who gets the Eclipse award anyway. My speculation is just that it will be given to Bernardini based on Bernardini's recent amazing display of raw talent and his improvement with every race plus the fact that he is being perfectly managed.

Why is the bringing up of Flower Alley even relevant? Bernardini and Flower Alley are two very different horses. I was on St. Liam's bandwagon. Most knew that St. Liam was going to win the BCC. That is why St. Liam was the favorite at post time. Flower Alley was a very good horse, but he was nowhere near the horse Bernardini was at this stage of the game last year. Every knowledgeable horse fan/player will concede that. Besides, Flower Alley finished 3/4ths of a length behind a horse that actually sniffed GZ's a s s which is saying something being that Flower Alley was only a three year old.

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

Fortunately, for the sake of horse racing, the whole racing year is considered in the voting for Eclipse Awards.

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Don't really see the relevance of money won. The derby is a 2 million dollar race, and the Florida Derby is a million. Win them both and you're looking at 1.8 mil right there. In this day and age of giant purses, money earned is sort of lost, because there are so many races with giant purses. look at the Delta Jackpot, initially run for a million, but now $750,000. No way that race should be worth that much money. The point is, and Kentuckyrosesinmay made it quite well, this isn't about what the best story is. Take the emotion out of it, if you can. When Bernardini wins the JCC, I hope you will then give him his credit.

Originally Posted by Danzig188

not necessarily.

the media can many times be as 'what have you done for me lately' as everyone else. that's why most movies that they want considered for oscars come out late in the year...short memories.

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

As a "realist", is Flower Alley really that bad? You guys make me laugh. The horse runs a bad race, and now he is a fraud of some kind. talk about what have you done for me lately. I guess that Travers win last year was bad. Or his second in the BCC. Because those two things are pretty easy to do.

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

Not in the case of Smarty Jones and Afleet Alex.