I'm not sure he had to re-break. He was just gliding along when Dunkirk made his move. It was obvious that Johnny V. knew he still had a ton of horse coming around the turn. He was looking around for Dunkirk and was waiting to push the button on this horse.

that track couldn't have been much better for a speed horse

there shouldn't be any debate about that. It was fast and horses were lasting.


Did they soup it up for Saturday? No. It was this bad on Friday. I didn't even check Wed or Thurs...

Quality Road ran a huge race and won. There is nothing whatsoever to take away from him. You can come up with fantasy tracks and fantasy trips, but you have to give credit to the horse who ran the actual race, when they run so great.
Dunkirk ran a huge race and happened to lose. He had to make a sustained move to tackle maybe the best rival, after that one had a dream trip and dream track, and he only lost by a couple lengths. What a great race that was.

The top two IMO both had the best 1 1/16th+ dirt preps we've had this year.
I don't know that I Want Revenge or Friesan Fire could have beaten them on a mythical "fair track".

It's not criminal to like both Quality Road and Dunkirk... seems as though we are trying split hairs on two talented horses.

:tro:

Who's cornered the market on playing both sides of the fence better than you?

Correct.

At least we have more than one interesting horse to debate this year!

(although, like Phil said, having a pace advantage is ideal and why I think Quality Road is the better horse ;) )

FYI. Quality Road's splits..

:23.3
:23.2 (:47.0-1st half)
:23.3 (:47.0-middle half))
:24.3 (:48.1-2nd half)
:12.2 (:37.0-Final 3f)

I said this last night... this year is more exciting than anything last year produced.

Yeah, I mean, that kind of looks like he had a lot left at the end after not-slow early and internal fractions.

I don't know. I can't help but think his win, as strong as it was, was at least slightly aided by the surface. If not, then people calling him a superhorse may not be speaking prematurely. And let's not forget this was his first start around two turns.

I just wanted to throw into the discussion something that's not relevant to these horses going forward. But, wasn't Desormeaux's last ditch flop aboard Theregoesjojo funny? He had given the horse basically no chance to win through the opening six furlongs, so he decided to "check" when "interfered with" wll the while being left behind.

Sometimes I think Desormeaux ought to pay trainers to use him.

NT

If it was a "normal GP surface" as you call it, those fractions wouldn't have happened.

It would have been a different race with probably the same outcome.

The horse is a fast-closing sprinter, but Kent's antics were laughable though not surprising.

You're taking another step that I'm not and some other people also are not.

We've all agreed that the track was fast. It was faster than normal, without question. However, you're assuming that because it was fast, that it favored speed. I think. If so, that's where we disagree.

I wish CJ would weigh in because he brought up on the PA hall of fame board that while the numbers were fast his figures had the pace being pretty soft. That explains, in part, how QR seemed to have a ton left at the quarter pole.

What I would grant is that the time had a lot to do with the track, but I don't think the sped up track had much, if anything, to do with Quality Road's victory.

NT

TGJJ got a really nice setup in the FOY, was able to close while saving ground and was guaranteed to be overbet in the Fla. Derby as a result. He's another in a solid list of horses in this crop who will make the Kings Bishop a really good race this year.

His 'antics' were smart.

I'm referring to him standing up and acting like he'd been interfered with. Are you?

Yes.. He knew his horse was about done. The top 2 did in fact pinch him off... Why not claim foul and hope the stand doesn't have the best view of it and gets it wrong? Wasn't going to happen in a race like this, but in an everyday situation, had a horse in Jojo's scenario finished better, he might very well get a move-up from the stews. I thought it was pretty cheeky and clever even though it wasn't going to go anywhere. It also endears you to the trainer/owner who know from a move like this that you're thinking about their interests.

Their interests? Come on Steve.

Well, his own as well. But plenty of guys just hop off and wouldn't have thought twice.