Was Curlin heads and shoulders above the rest of his three year old crop? He ran 3rd in the Derby, won the Preakness by a head, got beat by a filly in the Belmont, lost in the Haskell, won a subpar GC Gold Cup by a nose and then won the BC Classic impressively. He may have been the best 3 yo but he was hardly a standout as he ran in 4 grade 1's for 3yo's and won 1 of them.

He was clearly the overall standout, even going into the Breeders Cup Classic where he went off at 4.4/1 odds - yes - no question.

I can see your point, but in my opinion he is head and shoulders the best horse of the crop based on what he did in the BC Classic. He certainly is the most talented horse of the class while Rags, Street S and AGS have all been retired. He's shown his versatilty by being able to handle most tracks and his durabilty by still racing today.

This I totally agree with. Most years, a horse with Big Brown's lack of experience and conditioning would have very little hope of hitting the board in the derby. But against this year's group? Uou cannot toss a horse with as much talent as Big Brown. He's really the only "wow" type talent that we've seen so far. Pyro and Colonel John have shown glimpses, but Big Brown hasn't shown a chink in his armour in the 3 races he's ran in.

You dont think coming down the stretch like he was running from an alligator as a chink in the armor, and also the fact that he has only three starts after a performance like he had at Toga is a problem?

Think about this, if his first race back wasn't rained off the turf, this horse wouldn't have even been considered for the Florida Derby. Dutrow lucked out here and while his race was impressive last time, what did he beat down in Florida? Gulfstream racing has been putrid this winter, and probably will be so for the next couple years. I am downgrading him based on that fact, plus the fact he ran a top that is absolutely HUGE for a 3 year old with obvious issues.

He can bounce to the moon and still win, but for me, I have alot of negatives on him (Distance, pedigree, sheet, lack of racing, running style), and few positives (power number last out).

I toss a horse like this 10 times out of 10. And at 2/1, with 19 other hilarious options, makes it every more worthwhile.

He may have been heads and shoulders above the crop at the end of the year but he still lost a whole lot of races to other 3 year olds to be considered vastly superior. It is easy to say this after he has continued to race effectively at 4 while the other 3 year olds are no longer here. But winning and winning decisively against other 3 year olds would be a benchmark for me to consider him head and shoulders above the other three year olds and in the four biggest 3 year old races he ran in he lost 3 of them and the one win was by a nose.

I disagree, by the end of the year he was decisively better than the other 3 yo's. His last three races to me clearly show Curlin as the standout of his class. Street Sense and Hard Spun plateaued, Curlin kept raising his game.
you say the Gold Cup was subpar, but he did beat the best older horse going at the time and the rest of the field was left in the dust and that performance earned him a figure better than anything Hard Spun or Street Sense earned all year. His Classic win said it all really.

Classic line, Scav. Well done.

His haskell loss showed you he was clearly what? The fact remains that he lost 3 of 4 races against 3 yo's in grade 1 races. Did you consider Sunday Silence head and shoulders better than Easy Goer? Probably not and he beat him 3 out of 4. He was a head bob away from being 0 for 4 in the big 3 year old races. The rest of the year counts too. He was clearly the best 3 year old in November and December.

he came back a different horse more mature, whatever, in the JCGC, and consistently performed at that higher level four consecutive times now.
to me there is no doubt who the best horse to come out of 07 was. Curlin is a standout. It was unclear during the TC season, but it didn't end up that way.

Without being a smart ass this time - I don't think it was unclear at all.

Hard Spun wasn't that much horse when he didn't make the lead - and when he didn't make the lead and raced wide over a live rail - he wasn't good enough to even hit the board in the Southwest Stakes.

Street Sense - I know I supposedly have a huge bias against him and all - but all of his good races came with the same illogically good trip.

Rags To Riches had a great route pedigree and a slow paced 12 furlong race was what she was tailor made for.

Curlin didn't always win when things didn't go his way - but he didn't need things to go his way to run big.

How many 3yo champions go through a season undefeated?

look, I feel Curlin is head and shoulders the best of the group.
its just for me I only became totally sure of that later in the year. If you were sure about it early on, good for you because you were right.

i agree with your assessment on him 100%, he was the only one that could win a race that wasn't handed to him.

I think you and I were among the very few on here last year that could see through the Street Sense mystique. why he went off as the favorite in the classic is a mystery to me, off of his loss to Hard Spun and his titanic struggle with Grasshopper.

........ i think he will be one of the biggest favorites we have seen in a while. whatever, if he loses its just another race for me to crumble up my tote. i think its a lock b.b / pyro exacta ( wow, that should pay alot )

You are out of your damn mind if you think BB is going to be 5/1. One good work out of him and he is easily 2/1, even with medicore works, he is 3/1

...... i forgot about arazi......... my buddy put 1 dime on him and stormed out of the casino for the rest of the day:rolleyes: prob F.P

Big Brown will be the favorite - of this I have no doubt.